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Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Ohio Digger
Date: May 03, 2013 09:32AM
If you get a nice tone one way but at 90 degrees either nulls or disappears is it usually junk? I get a lot that seem to null at 90 degrees when they sounded good the first way. I'm only disc'ing from Fe20 down. I'll usually jump to Quick Mask and see Fe numbers from 30 to 35 so I keep swinging. Even if the CO numbers are decent. Am I missing good targets by doing this? The few I've dug have been junk.



Minelab Etrac- 11" Pro coil, 8x6 SEF coil, 15" WOT, 13" Ultimate, Sunray X5 coil, Sunray X-1 inline probe, Garrett ProPointer
Check out my YouTube channel - Ohio Digger

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: gfatizzi
Date: May 03, 2013 11:32AM
Sounds about right. I've been experiencing the same results as yourself. I think we both got our Etracs the same day. lol I saw your posts when you received it. Hope your enjoying yours as much as I am. HH George

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Ohio Digger
Date: May 03, 2013 12:33PM
I love this thing. Still having a hard time getting time to use it though. Logged maybe 6 hours total so far. It's just a lot more pleasant and enjoyable to use than any other machine I've used.



Minelab Etrac- 11" Pro coil, 8x6 SEF coil, 15" WOT, 13" Ultimate, Sunray X5 coil, Sunray X-1 inline probe, Garrett ProPointer
Check out my YouTube channel - Ohio Digger

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: t8474kj1
Date: May 09, 2013 08:25AM
You are doing the right thing with checking the Quick Mask and looking at the Fe number. If the Fe number drops below 17, it is usually trash with my experience, unless it reads deep, then dig. When the signal is great one way, but the Quick Mask Fe number reads low, then I find nails. The 90 deg check is a good indicator with the Etrac, but not positive in my opinion. I have made good finds with one way signals when I used my Explorer SE, but the Etrac seems to be more positive that it is trash if you cannot get a 2-way signal.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Johnnyanglo
Date: May 20, 2013 09:05PM
With the E-Trac, if you have a signal that is repeatable in only one very precisely swept orientation and you get a mostly full tone (not clipped or chirping audio), and if the Fe value is not greater than ~23Fe, then dig.

To improve your finds, try not to look at the display - listen for the audio quality. The screen position of the cursor will lead you not to dig when you probably should.

Listen for a clear whole audio (not chirps or occasional hits) either High Tone (TTF) or Med-High to High Tones (4TF) without those Low Tone hits. Don't bother looking at the screen to see if the cursor is jumping about, if you're in TTF or 4TF the clear Med-High or greater audio means dig. Your sweeps should be centered over the suspected target and not more than 1-2" in length (focus your sweep to isolate the target).

Your finds will increase when you ignore the screen and listen intently to the audio quality. If you want to improve the audio, try using smooth. It will make a more continuously "smooth" audio that can be used like a laser to isolate good targets in fields of iron junk.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: ot1138
Date: May 22, 2013 03:05PM
If I don't get a repeatable tone at 90', I'm probably not going to dig it unless it's one heck of a nice signal in the other direction. Before I do though, I'll try it from a few other angles to see if I can get a pair of 90' angles that will repeat. Failing that, I might try to wiggle out a couple of radials to see if I can get a repeatable 12-XX signal mixed in. If I get that, I'll dig because it's usually a coin mixed with iron. You can also sometimes see this when the TID jumps consistently between two portions of the screen (one in high FE area, the other in coin area).

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Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Goes4ever
Date: July 15, 2013 11:11AM
One way signals are rarely ever good stuff, but sometimes they are good....so u cant say never. If I get a good quality sounding tone and turn 90 degres and it nulls out then I walk all around it and see if I can even get it to repeat at lets say 45 degrees, if it does and has some depth, I am gonna dig it

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: ironsight
Date: February 06, 2014 06:44PM
In addition to whats been said,
I'd say a lot depends on what the depth indicator is telling you.
That depth indicator IMO is just as important as the ID and tones.
Be aware, the detector will start to do seemingly strange things for deep 10+ inch targets until you dig a bunch of them and then it all starts to make sense.

In my experience, a one way at less than 8 inches that indicates a strong non-jumpy Fe number has a high probability of an iron nail.
On the other hand, a one way with the depth indicator near or at bottomed out with a jumpy Fe and/or strange ID, you just never can tell. I dig all those and occasionally get surprised when i see that shiny silver disc at the bottom of that deep hole.
A jumpy one way Fe ID could also be a coin on edge or a smaller coin inches below a large iron nail. Found a few coins with both of those indications.

In this day and age, with all these metal detectors around, you have to go well beyond the casual 'week-end' detectorists, push the envelope and dig, dig, dig.
Then after a while, after all that arm aching digging of junk and treasure, one day you will suddenly realize that you have become one with your eTRAC.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: khouse
Date: March 05, 2014 09:59AM
There are a lot of places I've hunted a lot where these are the only types of signals that are left. Think of your target as a pie cut into 10 pieces. I find a lot of good stuff with only getting a good signal on just one piece of the pie. Don't take to heart that you need a two way and/or 90 degree signals to be good. Sure, if your still cherry picking solid signals by all means dig those first. But after those are gone your left with more stuff that all others have just passed over.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Bowie
Date: March 05, 2014 12:36PM
khouse nailed it and Johnnyanglo is right on with the audo. Thing is,its easy to get caught up in a cherry picking state of mind. I know I find myself kind of getting off track at times trying to make something sound good,walking around a target and walk away. Truth is,you want to find whats left, you have to dig these signals,especially if you are in a spot where digging isnt going to disturb the area. But, I do have some spots that I dont want to dig to much, I will dig some but not many iffies. I dig a lot of junk, mostly iron but it cant be helped, until we get a machine that takes us to another level for unmasking. It will surprise you tho when you see that seated dime next to or with a piece of nail over it all rusted up. I try and remember,especially if it doesnt sound like a false signal,something is down there making the signal register higher than iron.
HH,
John

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: ironsight
Date: March 06, 2014 10:02AM
Quote
Bowie
....... Truth is,you want to find whats left, you have to dig these signals,especially if you are in a spot where digging isnt going to disturb the area. But, I do have some spots that I dont want to dig to much, I will dig some but not many iffies. I dig a lot of junk, mostly iron but it cant be helped.......

The public areas around here have been pounded to death with all the easy ones harvested. The 10+ inchers are typically all thats left. At one time, I was leery of digging deep holes in some areas, but to get whats left just gotta dig em out or leave them for someone else to dig out!
Whats been working for me is to NOT use a shovel in those more sensitive public areas especially with a lot of people milling around. I save my shovel for other areas.

Instead i use a hefty 7 X 4 inch garden spade that i re-enforced by putting some weld beads in critical areas. Always try to keep my back to any people around to hide the pile best i can. Spreading the pile out on my rubber mat helps too. If certain people including some park caretakers see a foot high pile and a shovel it'll raise their eyebrows.
I remember asking one park care taker if it was OK to detect. His reply, "as long as you don't use a shovel" was all he said.

If the weather ever breaks and i can get into my workshop, i'm working on fabricating a digging spade that will have a collapsible T handles and just a long enough telescopic stem to light foot dig the deeper holes or hard pack soil. Last year, I fabricated a shovel with a telescopic handle which works great in less sensitive areas.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: matterny4
Date: March 16, 2014 08:06AM
I am still learning the machine and haven't gotten the quick mask down real well. Here is what I have been doing and I hope people will chime if it's useless. If I get a good signal 1 way but it's choppy at 90 degrees, I go into TTF and swing really really slow. I dig if I get a solid hit through the iron nulling. I am still struggling with iffy signals though, I have found 16 wheaties in a yard and all signals were in the 12-42/45 range except 1. It had 3 wheaties and a 54 nickel in the same hole but the tone repeated at 90 degrees.

Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: ironsight
Date: March 16, 2014 09:16AM
Quote
matterny4
I am still learning the machine and haven't gotten the quick mask down real well. Here is what I have been doing and I hope people will chime if it's useless. If I get a good signal 1 way but it's choppy at 90 degrees, I go into TTF and swing really really slow. I dig if I get a solid hit through the iron nulling. I am still struggling with iffy signals though, I have found 16 wheaties in a yard and all signals were in the 12-42/45 range except 1. It had 3 wheaties and a 54 nickel in the same hole but the tone repeated at 90 degrees.
For one ways, go into QuickMask wide open screen to get rid of the nulls, then sweep in all directions to get the whole picture. TTF not really necessary, disregard tones and just study the ID at this point.
Keep in mind for iffy signals, the conductive number is typically more stable and accurate than the ferrous number. In other words, if the ID bounces into the conductive 40's and the ferrous bounces down say to the +20s, dig.

If you can pinpoint a target(s), you can dig it. There just might be a piece of junk around a keeper or a deep 10+ inch keeper causing the iffyness, dig out any junk and re-sweep.
Many of my best keepers had hyper iffy signals with some next to-under-over junk or just plain deep. Never know until you dig.

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Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Samuel_Champlain_FTW
Date: September 08, 2014 10:04AM
Digging for older coins out on the iron infested farm, I have had success digging one way signals. Would I have dug them in a park? No chance... But out there, it only takes a second to open up a hole. Many times when I would get a signal one way, I'd open up the hole and the signal would turn two way.

When I am using the small X5 coil, I don't bother with the one way signals.

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Re: Non-repeatable signals at 90 degrees. Junk?
Posted by: Goes4ever
Date: September 09, 2014 07:46PM
I'd venture to say 98% of one way targets are iron, but sometimes you get a one way signal that just sounds too sweet and you MUST dig it to satisfy curiousity, yes it is NORMALLY a deep bent nail, but sometimes you are rewarded with a deep coin. Trust me I dig a lot of deep one way targets, and yes I dig mostly bent nails chasing those signals. But I am too stubborn to walk away, and sometimes it pays to dig them. The more you use the etrac the more you will learn.

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