Findmall.com
 
 






Minelab Explorer Forum


Welcome! Log In Register
avatar
Slow is the way to go in trash
Posted by: Tony N (Michigan)
Date: June 21, 2017 09:01AM
Quote
Kapok
Quote

I used that detector for years and know it pretty much inside out. If you are not used to running a detector with a completely open screen, also known as all metal mode, or zero Iron Mask it can get unnearving hearing all the thousands of sounds the detector is picking up.
It is giving a report on EVERYTHING that's in the ground. If you are not used to that, then I would suggest running with more Iron Mask. It will run a lot quieter but you will just have to be more careful detecting. Eventually you will want to hear everything
so you can hear coins co-located with trash targets. But for now, just think of it as you are starting to date this girl. You want a little information from her but not her whole life's story in one evening. Giving a little more Iron Mask is like putting the breaks
on too much information from her. Eventually she will tell you more and more. But you are the one in control. You let her give you as much information as you want her to give at this early time in your relationship. Otherwise she'll just blabber and blabber
on like some psychotic idiot if you let her.

Tony, I run my Makro Racer pretty much wide open and am used to hearing a lot of chatter, but with the Racer I can separate the signals out quite easily. I probably just need to spend more time with the Explorer. I'm sure there's nothing wrong with it. At work we say PICNIC error. Problem In Chair Not In Computer. :smile:

How many different tones does your Racer have?
If I were you and you were me, starting out on the Minelab, I'd just start out in coin mode and get used to just a few sounds.
Believe me, when you get used to what specific sounds sound like for silver, copper, nickel, etc. when you have the Explorer in coin mode, then you will be able to hear those specific targets. Then when you go to Iron Mask and detect one day with maybe a half inch darkened then another day maybe a 1/4 inch darkened, then maybe another day 1/8 inch darkened then another day you are in All Metal you will hear those specific good sounds you heard in coin mode.
If a place you are detecting is absolutely littered with lots of garbage and all the many sounds are driving you nutty, just use enough Iron Mask to quiet the trash and listen for the good targets. Then later, as you get
braver, use less and less Iron Mask but, and this is important, if you are in, say a 5 foot by 5 foot area with loads of trash, use no iron mask and very methodically, very slowly, and I mean VERY slowly, swing your
coil in amongst the trash and listen for that good tone. You are only moving your coil a few inches at a time, slowly. When you sweep slow enough with no Iron Mask in trash, you will only hear a couple tones at a time. Find that trash target and approach it from different angles to try to eek out that coin. Use the tip of your coil to sneak up on that trash target and move around it and over it. You might also try pinpointing the trash target to know exactly where it is. Then work the coil around it in different directions SLOWLY. Did I say SLOWLY? I thought I did. In case I didn't, I'll say it again. Move the coil inch by inch around it SLOWLY. You will only hear a couple sounds. You dig, man? LOL
to try to see if there is a good target lurking near it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2017 09:04AM by Tony N (Michigan).

Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Charles (Upstate NY)
Date: June 21, 2017 09:26AM
Recommend you step back and regroup, lets begin with your settings. Auto sensitivity bad idea. Gain 8-10 bad idea. Starting off in all metal bad idea. It would help to know what part of the country you live in and how mineralized your soil is but here are some getting started settings...

Sensitivity MANUAL 25 to 28, for now pick the most stable setting you can increase it later as you get used to the machine and are able to handle some instability. Make sure you do a noise cancel with your coil sitting on the ground.
Gain no higher than 7 for now.
Tones Ferrous, this is ideal for coin hunting as iron will sound low, coins high. Iron falsing will sound high but has a very unique bounce pattern from top/left corner to right edge of screen, back and forth, only iron does this, trust it.
Response Normal
Variability 10
Recover Fast OFF Deep ON

Now setup your smartfind screen with a coin discrimination pattern. Hunt in this mode until you find a target of interest, THEN switch to your iron mask screen setup for all metal and sweep the target and a coil size area around the target, go ahead and circle the target, practice your pinpointing. Keep an eye on target depth typically deeper is older, but the depth meter is only accurate if you are centered over the target. If you are off center the depth meter will read deeper than the target really is. You need to ease into hunting in all metal on an Explorer, using a combination of discrimination patterns while frequently switching to all metal to investigate a target is an excellent method, will also show you how different the machine behaves in all metal without nulls breaking up the signal and getting sticky on discriminated iron and trash.

Lets talk swing speed, with Explorers you don't want to swing too fast, nothing even close to say a Whites DFX swing speed. But you also don't want to swing too slow, you want to swing just right. Practice on a coin with your coil raised, you will see how slow is too slow. When you think you hear a good target shorten your swing, 2-3 inches wide over the target back and forth a bit faster than your normal swing, you are feeding target info to the machine, get the coil hitting on the target pretty good for 3-4 swings then stop your coil and let it rest on the ground and wait for the machine to position the cursor on the screen. A few sets of this will give you an average, if its settling in the coin area most times dig.

Lets talk walking speed, Explorers like target data, you want to be walking pretty slow, moving forward maybe half a coil at a time in trashy conditions, walk slow swing medium. In heavy trash or iron walk slow indeed, even consider the 8 inch coil which is excellent in heavy iron. Don't be afraid to use the front few inches of your coil to sneak up on targets hiding in the shadow of iron and trash I have made many a good find doing that.

Don't be afraid to raise your coil to confirm the depth of a target. A true deep target will vanish quickly after raising your coil just 2 to 3 inches off the ground, Explorers HATE a sandwich of air/soil it kills depth which can be used as a tool for confirming the depth of a target. A tiny shallow/surface target that is trying to fake you out as deep will still sound off with the coil raised. The depth meter is calibrated to a cent sized target, tiny targets will read deeper than they really are, large targets will read shallower than they really are.

The owner of Findmall gave me a suggestion when I was struggling with my first Explorer. He told me to go out and dig only based on depth, obviously not iron but any target that's considered deep for your area or deeper. It was an eye opener. I had not had much luck with the machine up to that point, then like flipping a light switch I was digging deep old coins all over the place at the very same sites I had been hunting for 6 weeks.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2017 09:27AM by Charles (Upstate NY).

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Kapok
Date: June 21, 2017 10:02AM
Charles, thank you. I will regroup and try what you've suggested. I've been able to figure out every detector I've ever used over the past 30 years, so I'll get this. The FBS is just a completely different animal. I'll report back in tonight or tomorrow.

This forum is awesome, so thanks to all who patiently provide advice.



"I'd go ahead and dig that if I were you."

Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: tiftaaft
Date: June 21, 2017 12:09PM
Quote
Charles (Upstate NY)
Recommend you step back and regroup, lets begin with your settings. Auto sensitivity bad idea. Gain 8-10 bad idea. Starting off in all metal bad idea. It would help to know what part of the country you live in and how mineralized your soil is but here are some getting started settings...

Sensitivity MANUAL 25 to 28, for now pick the most stable setting you can increase it later as you get used to the machine and are able to handle some instability. Make sure you do a noise cancel with your coil sitting on the ground.
Gain no higher than 7 for now.
Tones Ferrous, this is ideal for coin hunting as iron will sound low, coins high. Iron falsing will sound high but has a very unique bounce pattern from top/left corner to right edge of screen, back and forth, only iron does this, trust it.
Response Normal
Variability 10
Recover Fast OFF Deep ON

.

Had an interesting day yesterday and looking at Charles' note above reminded me of something. I spend about 4 hours swing time hitting an old park (1900) and an old school (1950). I found one piece of sterling jewelry, but all else was clad. I then took a break and headed back out to the site of my first IH a week or so ago... and I hunted about an hour, with not much luck. I realized that at some point, I was testing All Metal and high sensitivity and had boosted my sens to 32. So I lowered it down to 28... and back to back wheaties within minutes that were obvious in tone, cursor placement and depth. So I may have been overdriving the explorer (and here is the key) for my soil conditions. I found one more wheat and called it a day. Now, maybe I just happened upon those wheats at just the same time I changed the sens... but with several hours of hunt time and nothing deep to show for it... it makes me wonder. I am currently running essentially the exact pattern that Charles shows above... and practice my brain discrimination on every solid target (meaning if it is solid, I guess what it is, then I dig it... even if I am guessing trash targets in some cases). It has really helped me in learning the machine and cursor placements. Also, I am still new to the explorer, but both my Indian Heads this past week... in the back of my mind I heard Charles' words... dig on depth... I probably would have passed them up otherwise.

Can't wait to hear about your awesome explorer finds Kapok!
Tim.

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Kapok
Date: June 21, 2017 08:26PM
Thanks to everyone for the tips. Went back out tonight and pulled these two coins out of a spot I've been over numerous times. 1919-S wheat and 1926 Merc. So geeked that I did it with this detector. Both were on the edges of trash targets, but I listened to the tones plus the cursor and ID to isolate them. The cent was a bit of a reach, but on the Merc, the cursor kept returning to the top right and the ID would bounce around but I kept seeing 03-29.

One question, though... I found a clad quarter lying on the ground and ran my coil over it. It didn't sound any louder than a deep target. Do I need to change a setting somewhere?



"I'd go ahead and dig that if I were you."




Re: Explorer SE - First FBS machine coming
Posted by: tiftaaft
Date: June 21, 2017 09:45PM
NICE Kapok!!! First of many I am sure!!! Congrats!

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Tony N (Michigan)
Date: June 21, 2017 09:46PM
Quote
Kapok
Thanks to everyone for the tips. Went back out tonight and pulled these two coins out of a spot I've been over numerous times. 1919-S wheat and 1926 Merc. So geeked that I did it with this detector. Both were on the edges of trash targets, but I listened to the tones plus the cursor and ID to isolate them. The cent was a bit of a reach, but on the Merc, the cursor kept returning to the top right and the ID would bounce around but I kept seeing 03-29.

One question, though... I found a clad quarter lying on the ground and ran my coil over it. It didn't sound any louder than a deep target. Do I need to change a setting somewhere?

All right Kpok! :clapping:

First of all, how deep were the mercury and penny?
As to the quarter, where is you sensitivity at?
What is your gain at?
What is the setting on your volume?

If you are hitting deep coins and the quarter sounds shallow, don't worry about it. Remember, Minelab Explorers don't really like air between the coil and the coin.

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Kapok
Date: June 21, 2017 10:03PM
Neither coin was much past 6" or so, but surrounded by high ferrous junk.

My gain was set at 7, sensitivity manual 25. Not sure about the volume--I don't think I changed it.



"I'd go ahead and dig that if I were you."

Re: Explorer SE - First FBS machine coming
Posted by: aproc123
Date: June 21, 2017 10:50PM
I just got my explorer se in march of this year. I used a t2 before and was used to swinging fast. At first I thought I wasted my money...but after slowing down and taking my time I have found more silver in the last few months than last year. Go to a park with lots of clad until you get used to the sounds. Only issues I've had is with certain kinds of grass causing falsing which I drop gain and auto sensitivity to compensate.I bought a 12x10 sef coil and do believe it has helped with target separation, though I have noticed deep old wheats and Indians ring up 0-22 and also if it sounds like your detector is dry heaving dig the target cause it is a mixed signal and have found several coins with iron and trash in the hole. They are awesome machines!

Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Charles (Upstate NY)
Date: June 21, 2017 11:56PM
Quote
Kapok
Neither coin was much past 6" or so, but surrounded by high ferrous junk.

My gain was set at 7, sensitivity manual 25. Not sure about the volume--I don't think I changed it.

What headphones are you using? I have tried many brands, Sunray Gold are my top choice for the Explorer.

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Kapok
Date: June 22, 2017 07:21AM
Quote
Charles (Upstate NY)
Quote
Kapok
Neither coin was much past 6" or so, but surrounded by high ferrous junk.

My gain was set at 7, sensitivity manual 25. Not sure about the volume--I don't think I changed it.

What headphones are you using? I have tried many brands, Sunray Gold are my top choice for the Explorer.
I'm using Gray Ghost.



"I'd go ahead and dig that if I were you."

Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Charles (Upstate NY)
Date: June 22, 2017 10:01AM
Quote
Kapok
Quote
Charles (Upstate NY)
Quote
Kapok
Neither coin was much past 6" or so, but surrounded by high ferrous junk.

My gain was set at 7, sensitivity manual 25. Not sure about the volume--I don't think I changed it.

What headphones are you using? I have tried many brands, Sunray Gold are my top choice for the Explorer.
I'm using Gray Ghost.

Sunray Gold will be an improvement imo. I have used a couple different pairs of Gray Ghost, their tone is thin and ice pick like in comparison. Tones on an Explorer are closer to a musical instrument, the Sunray give a fuller, richer sound plus are a lot more comfortable to wear. But its not such a big deal that you have to run out right now and buy a pair. If you don't already have one an X1 probe should be your next purchase priority.

Back to your volume observation, probably won't be a lot of difference between the volume of a clad on the surface vs a coin at 6 inches. But beyond that deeper coins will start sounding lower/faitner in volume due to depth with your gain at 7, which is a great way to cut through all the shallow stuff and pick off just the deep targets, deep targets will sound fainter AND seem wider as you sweep across them. This is why the Findmall forum owner's suggestion of going out and just hunting nothing but deep targets was such a game changer for me. After a couple of hunts doing this I pretty much ignored all the shallow trash and clad and just listened for these deeper signals.

If you turn your gain up further to 9-10 you lose this as the Explorer gain further boosts the volume of deeper/fainter targets. With your gain at 10 all targets regardless of depth sound equally as loud, then you can't hear the forest for the trees, you lose the depth element of the tone. IF your soil is relatively mineral free and the machine is stable at higher sensitivity settings then a gain of 8 is ideal. But do not lower sensitivity in order to run your gain at 8 its counter productive, lowering sensitivity notches out those deep faint targets, gain can't boost what has been notched out by a lower sensitivity setting. I called Minelab years ago to confirm the order in which Sensitivity and Gain are applied and Sensitivity is applied first, then Gain boost to whatever is left after Sensitivity.

avatar
Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: Kapok
Date: June 22, 2017 10:19AM
Quote
Charles (Upstate NY)
This is why the Findmall forum owner's suggestion of going out and just hunting nothing but deep targets was such a game changer for me
That is exactly what I did yesterday. Neither of the coins I found were extremely deep, but definitely on the deeper end of the scale. I ignored all the shallow signals.

Charles, your expertise is great appreciated.



"I'd go ahead and dig that if I were you."

Re: Your detector is giving too much info?
Posted by: tiftaaft
Date: June 22, 2017 11:18AM
Quote
Kapok
Quote
Charles (Upstate NY)
This is why the Findmall forum owner's suggestion of going out and just hunting nothing but deep targets was such a game changer for me
That is exactly what I did yesterday. Neither of the coins I found were extremely deep, but definitely on the deeper end of the scale. I ignored all the shallow signals.

Charles, your expertise is great appreciated.

+1

avatar
Sound files for Explorers???
Posted by: Tony N (Michigan)
Date: June 22, 2017 11:28AM
Quote
aproc123
also if it sounds like your detector is dry heaving dig the target cause it is a mixed signal and have found several coins with iron and trash in the hole."!

Too bad someone can't make sound files so people can hear the dry heaving. LOL

Seriously though, someone needs to make some audio files like:

1. This is what a deep dime sounds like.
2 This is what a deep quarter sounds like.
3. This is what a dime or quarter or half sounds like mixed in with iron nails. etc. And post them here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2017 11:44AM by Tony N (Michigan).

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login