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Beach and Water / Scuba Dive Detecting Forum


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Unfortunately it is too hard a question to answer
Posted by: therover
Date: October 06, 2018 09:38AM
The only way to know for sure for YOU, is to use both units in the areas you will be hunting.

Like Tom CA stated, it has a lot to do with personal preference.

Cracks me up when guys state hands down this unit is the best. Yeah...hands down for THEM.

Differences between the two (CZ vs Excal):

Silent search vs threshold
Concentric coil vs DD
Manual GB vs auto.
3 tones in discriminate vs multiple tones
How pinpoint feature works
Ergonomics

All of these and more will determine what you prefer.

You can have the deepest most sensitive unit on the planet...if you don't like it or it does not mesh with you in terms of sounds, weight, feel, etc, you won't use it and you won't find a thing !

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: October 06, 2018 12:02PM
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mike k.
Had the cz and excal. Sold the cz just bought another excallibur 2 .Now I have 3 the excallibur sword the excalibur with blue headphones ( changed head phones on the 2 older machines to grayghost aqua headphones ) And I just bought an excallibur 2 . These outperform anything made , and last if you take care of them . Regardless what people say - they DO find small objects (if your hearing is good ) . My older excallibur has a huge wot coil , and I regularly find small objects like ear ring backs and small stud earings , even found a .177 lead pellet . I had to install a fine screen in my scoops for small objects . - mike

Yes, this defies conventional wisdom, but ... it's somehow true. A buddy of mine has the Sov/Wot combo (which would be similar to the Excal/wot combo). And, while it's true that he kicks b*tt on coin and ring sized objects, I chided him that he's loosing sensitivity to smaller dainty gold. He tried assure me that he also gets dainty small things at depth as well.

Eventually, I saw it with my own eyes, that .... yes ... he does indeed get even small dainty stuff. GRANTED: not "grain of rice" sized stuff (ie.: "micro-jewelry"). You'd need a pulse, or the Nox, or a nugget machine, or whatever if that is your agenda. But .... seriously now ....... how much "grain-of-rice" sized jewelry is really worth chasing ? An earing stud ? Who cares ?

Perhaps the only thing that a micro-jewelry enabled machine can boast about, is, admittedly : Tinsel thin chains. But even then: While none of us would belittle a gold chain, yet .... let's be perfectly honest: When you get that on the scale, you're talking about some very light weight stuff. And when it comes to the bigger gold chains and bracelets, (with bigger links), then the standard machines can get them. And THOSE are the ones that have the weight anyhow.

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: October 06, 2018 12:06PM
Quote
lytle78
.... decent Iron ID.....

Somehow I have my doubts. The devil is going to be in the details. I'll bet that to avail oneself of the "iron ID" on that, he's going to have to sacrifice some of the fabled depth. Or that "nagging doubts" will have him chasing a bunch "just to be sure".

I am waiting to see the day when a P.I. detector get equivalent iron ID, to what we've all come to expect on our standard machines. There's been several PI introductions over the years that tout "iron ID". But the devil has been in the details each time. Or PI machine users who swear they can tell the difference by sounds/tones. Yet.... you see those poor souls pack up and leave nail-ridden beaches in disgust. :unsure:



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2018 12:08PM by Tom_in_CA.

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Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: lytle78
Date: October 06, 2018 12:59PM
Tom, your scepticism is no doubt well founded on the history of all currently available PI machines.

The iron ID on the Manta does not function to the same depth that the machine exhibits when the “all metal” settings are selected. the difference I’m told is not great, but there is a difference.

In the all metal mode however (According to LE JAG who has been testing Manta prototypes for more than 3 years) any target detected (at any depth) can easily be cross checked by raising the coil till the target “fades”. Ferrous Targets will give the “multitone” signal before you raise the coil enough for the signal to disappear. Non ferrous will retain their normal tone until they disappear.

Note - this is apparently not the “double blip” on elongated iron which some users of current PI’s claim to hear and you are correctly skeptical of.



Rick Kempf

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: October 06, 2018 07:40PM
Thanx for replying Rick !

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Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: lytle78
Date: October 06, 2018 09:48PM
Tom, I hope sometime in the not too distant further to be able to hand you a Fisher PI and watch you try it for yourself and tell me what you think.

Exactly when that can happen and how, I am not yet clear, but a long drag up the CA coast with the first one I get my hands on is very much my “Plan A”



Rick Kempf

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: October 07, 2018 05:28AM
Quote
lytle78
Tom, I hope sometime in the not too distant further to be able to hand you a Fisher PI and watch you try it for yourself and tell me what you think.

Exactly when that can happen and how, I am not yet clear, but a long drag up the CA coast with the first one I get my hands on is very much my “Plan A”

I would be very much honored. We have a guest bedroom you can stay in, and the beer is on me :)

You said : " Tom, your scepticism is no doubt well founded on the history of all currently available PI machines. "

Sheesk, I was there "in the days" . When guys were still using push-button Compasses, and VLF/TR's on the beach (and having to "ride the knob" while in manual VLF mode, whenever they got closer to, or further away, from the water's edge. All the way to the present age. So I've "seen it all". haha

But I'm the first to admit that ... that doesn't mean there's not something new. Or new technology that will leave the guy who waits, kicking himself years later, for not having tried it earlier (once he polls the panel and sees who's-finding-what, haha)

No, my skepticism isn't founded on the history of the currently available PI machines". It is based on the rather comical observation of the various touted "discriminating PI's" (whether via audio clues, or actual on-board filters). There's been (as you know) multiple ones that have come down the pike.

Hence, now, when I hear of "yet the latest release/claim", then yes : You can hardly blame me for being skeptical.

Anyhow, if you find yourself in this part of CA, hopefully some storm erosion is going on . Would love to try it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/07/2018 05:30AM by Tom_in_CA.

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: outdrfrk
Date: November 30, 2018 11:45PM
Some of my observations. I recently bought a used Excalibur and haven't used it yet. I also have a Sovereign GT and I understand they have the same guts. I also have a Garrett AT Pro which I love. I also acquired a Whites MX Sport which is extremely deep. A Tesoro Tiger Shark for back up. Mostly use the AT Pro and I will use the Excalbur for salt water.

Re: CZ21 or ML Excalibur
Posted by: synthnut
Date: December 02, 2018 06:49AM
Ask Olebeechnut which one is deeper !!!......

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