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Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Texadillo
Date: November 30, 2015 04:24PM
has anyone here ever used one in the past? Never hear much about them and was just curious as to how they performed. I really enjoy reading about the older detectors... some of which can still do a good job today when used under the right conditions:detecting: HH&HH!



Experiencing the adventure a lot of times will be your best find!

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Joe(TX)
Date: December 02, 2015 04:56AM
Was wondering why you mentioned this metal detector?? Especially if you are a novice to using vintage metal detectors!!?? This detector is very RARE and seldom comes up for sale. It is still a great metal detector and many still like to use the VLF/TR's. This type of detector has a lot of manual controls that most newbies would not be familar with. As one can tell I like the older vintage metal detectors and like using the manual controls. To me it is like the choice of driving either a manual or automatic vehicle. Anything that helps me have more control is what I want.

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Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Sven
Date: December 02, 2015 06:22AM
Basically similar to the D-tex CK-SK, Gold Mountain VIP which have similar circuitry and performance of the Garrett Groundhog and Master Hunters.
Operation is identical. The coils will also work on the the two Garrett machines as will the Garrett coils on the mentioned detectors. Your basic vintage CloneArt.



Nokta/Makro Anfibio-Multi, Makro Multi-Kruzer, and few others
Self built Mirage Pi's --- they work great in trashy areas!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/02/2015 06:34AM by Sven.




Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Texadillo
Date: December 02, 2015 10:31AM
Thanks Joe and Sven for the information regarding the Phantom detector:smile: Back around 1990 I spoke with Richard Ray by phone about building me a water-proof detector but never placed the order. Thinking back seems like I remember Richard saying he could fit some Groundhog electronics (or similar electronics) in a waterproof housing if I wanted him to build me a water-hunting unit. Not too long after that conversation I purchased the original Tesoro Stingray for my foul weather and water-hunting needs. Thanks again for the trip down "memory lane" and HH!

Randy



Experiencing the adventure a lot of times will be your best find!

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: December 02, 2015 01:19PM
good post. Quite accurate. And thanx for the pix. Hence this machine would be a dinasour by today's standards. And in-so-far as "vintage" (ie.: collectable), it's not that old. Sure, perhaps harder to come by, since so few were sold (when compared to fishers, garrets, and whites of the same era).

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Joe(TX)
Date: December 03, 2015 05:15PM
Quote
Tom_in_CA
good post. Quite accurate. And thanx for the pix. Hence this machine would be a dinasour by today's standards. And in-so-far as "vintage" (ie.: collectable), it's not that old. Sure, perhaps harder to come by, since so few were sold (when compared to fishers, garrets, and whites of the same era).
Tom........( I am not attacking you )....But you sure do have a narrow view of what the meaning of "Vintage" is!! Now I mean for some items it does take a long time to get to be vintage! But lets be real and we are talking about electronics....a lot of electronics get outdated fast.....you may not consider that "Vintage" but I do! A Good example is that I worked at Radio Shack back in 1983....all of those electronics of that day would be considered....old....obsolete...Vintage....but take out a 1983 nickel and that is not considered old or vintage!

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Tom_in_CA
Date: December 04, 2015 10:38AM
Yes , I admit I have a narrow view/definition of "vintage". By the mid to late 1970s, it became the hay-day of manufacturer's, sales, etc... So there's no shortage of detectors showing up at flea markets and garage sales that date to the late 1970s, for instance.

Contrast to a mere 10 yrs. before that, and detectors seen-at-a-park or beach, were an oddity. People sometimes didn't even know what you were doing.

A part of my bias is no doubt that I got into this as a teenager in about 1976. And hung with some older guys who, by then, had been hunting for 8 or 10 yrs. Ie.: being the first-ever to hit the parks here, virgin scout camps, etc.... And so it's easy to look at one's own entry into the hobby as being the "cutoff".

But yes: From a strictly electronics/computer's point of view: Sure, anything from the 1970s versus now is a world of difference.

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: trojdor
Date: December 04, 2015 05:28PM
Quote
Sven
Basically similar to the D-tex CK-SK, Gold Mountain VIP which have similar circuitry and performance of the Garrett Groundhog and Master Hunters.
Operation is identical. The coils will also work on the the two Garrett machines as will the Garrett coils on the mentioned detectors. Your basic vintage CloneArt.

Sven, this is the first time I've ever read a post of yours that I didn't agree 110% with. :)

The two Garrett models operate at different frequencies. The coils are not interchangeable. The Groundhog series was the 15k coils that work on the 15k Richard Ray Phantoms (and vice versa), but the Master Hunter series was a 6.5k machine.
That pic you show of the Phantom with a depth doubler will certainly plug in, but won't work well at all (as the Depth Doublers were for the Master Hunter 6.5k series.)

I've got two Phantoms right now...a black one and a blue one. Theyr'e still pretty sensitive machines, but work far better in VLF mode. The TR mode takes a real depth hit, but still works magic in seeing through trash.
Both units are nice and stable. It's fun to take out one of the vintage machines once in a while.

(My Dtex CK-20 on the other hand, has a microphonic coil that drives me crazy everytime it bumps a blade of grass.)

HH
:)
mike



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2015 05:32PM by trojdor.

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Joe(TX)
Date: December 05, 2015 04:58PM
......The Garrett Groundhog had a version before the ADS models...I would call this the pre-ADS Groundhog....when the ADS was incorporated into the Groundhog circuit...it was called a GroundHog Master Hunter. All of these ran at 15 KHZ....Richard Ray's Phantom and the D-Tex Coin King ran at 15 KHZ......what was being called a "Depth Doubler" is actually a Garrett Bloodhound...which converts the Garrett into a 2 box metal detector. Garrett made the Bloodhounds for both the 15 and 5 KHZ detectors. The D-Tex Relic King and Garrett Deep Seeker ran at around 5.0 or 5.5 KHZ. The Garrett detectors mainly shifted into the 6.5 KHZ when the detectors became more computer controlled but this was done years later.....not during the era of the Richard Ray's Phantom!

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: trojdor
Date: December 05, 2015 07:36PM
Quote
Joe(TX)
......The Garrett Groundhog had a version before the ADS models...I would call this the pre-ADS Groundhog....when the ADS was incorporated into the Groundhog circuit...it was called a GroundHog Master Hunter. All of these ran at 15 KHZ....Richard Ray's Phantom and the D-Tex Coin King ran at 15 KHZ......what was being called a "Depth Doubler" is actually a Garrett Bloodhound...which converts the Garrett into a 2 box metal detector. Garrett made the Bloodhounds for both the 15 and 5 KHZ detectors. The D-Tex Relic King and Garrett Deep Seeker ran at around 5.0 or 5.5 KHZ. The Garrett detectors mainly shifted into the 6.5 KHZ when the detectors became more computer controlled but this was done years later.....not during the era of the Richard Ray's Phantom!

Joe, I meant to type in 5k instead of 6.5k. (Old person brain fart.)
I'm looking at my 1982 ...right at the beginning of the Phantom's era...Garrett Master Hunter ADS III, and it states that it operates at 5K...long, long before the digital series. Additionally, you can download the 1982 Garrett catalog from Treasure Lynx and clearly see the frequencies listed as 5k for the Master Hunters and 15k for the Groundhogs. And the separate part number for the coils, since the coils are NOT interchangeable.

Additionally, the same catalog says YOU ARE INDEED CORRECT about the Bloodhound! I had tried very hard to locate a Groundhog version of the Bloodhound a few years ago, and even went as far as to call the factory...where I was told "They never made one for the Groundhog!"
However, this appears to be inaccurate. Just by looking at the 1982 catalog, 15k Bloodhounds were clearly offered for at least a short while...I may have to search again.

So Sven/Joe...I was wrong about the Bloodhound only being for the Master Hunter. Some were obviously made for the 15k groundhogs as well. :)

However, I stand by my statement that any Garrett Master Hunter made during the same era as the Phantom (early 80s through early 90s) ran at a much lower frequency, and the Phantoms ran at the same frequency as the Groundhog.
And you cannot swap coils between them.

I once heard a story that Charlie spotted some employees using a Groundhog with either a Phantom or Gold Mountain/Dtex coil (same mfg design)...and threw a fit! Apparently, they worked much better than the Garrett coils at that time. A memo was distributed, and it was forbidden for any employee to use any coil but Garretts own.

mike



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2015 07:58PM by trojdor.

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Joe(TX)
Date: December 06, 2015 06:48PM
....I heard the same story about Charles Garrett but the coil that he saw that he did not like being used on his detectors was actually from a D-Tex!! And according to Allan Cannon... the D-Tex coil actually added from 1.5 to 2.0 inches in added depth to the Garrett metal detector! This coil was a super concentric design compared to Garrett's Co-Planar coil. You are right about the 5 KHZ coil is Not compatible to the 15 KHZ coil.. The problem or confusion is the terminology used. When you say the Garrett Master Hunter...I assume that you are referring to the Master Hunter DeepSeeker (5 KHZ)....the real confusion is that Garrett had a Master Hunter Deepseeker (5KHZ) and also a Master Hunter Groundhog (15 KHZ). Back in the day....one could call the factory and get real info on anything ever made by Garrett. The problem now is that most or all of the older staff has died or retired and the newer/younger staff has really no idea on what you are talking about plus they have no one to ask....especially since Charles died! Actually there is a Richard Ray metal detector (at 5 KHZ) and coil that is compatible withe the 5 KHZ Garrett. Sorry I do not recall the exact name but it was made to compete against the Garrett Deepseeker. Evidently these did not sell too well and not many were made. Most of the success of Richard Ray is because of the 15 KHZ Phantom! Hope that I cleared up any of the confusion!!

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Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Sven
Date: December 08, 2015 08:24AM
What I was getting at was the Garrett Groundhog was at 15 khz, the Master Hunter at 5khz.
The D-tex were clones so to speak of the Garretts, D-tex fashoned the CK models after the 15khz Groundhogs
The SK models fashioned after the 5khz Master Hunters.
You could use the proper frequency coil from these these machines between the Garret and D-tex.

The Gold Mountain again as well as the Phantom is patterned after the D-tex and the Garretts.

The last survivor of the Groundhog circuitry was transformed into the Garrett Scorpion. Which was recently discontinued.

And as added interest, fairly certain some Eastern Block European countries used the (similar) circuitry in a couple current machines.



Nokta/Makro Anfibio-Multi, Makro Multi-Kruzer, and few others
Self built Mirage Pi's --- they work great in trashy areas!!

Re: Richard Rays Phantom metal detector...
Posted by: Texas Jay
Date: July 08, 2018 09:08PM
I owned and used a Treasure Hunter Phantom metal detector in the early 80s. Mine had a blue and gold box. I made a lot of amazing finds with it over the 10 or so years that I owned it. It was a really fine detector. I visited Richard Ray at his shop in Alvin, Texas in 1984, after purchasing the Phantom. I and some friends were planning our first gold panning trip to California. At the time, Richard Ray had won the speed gold panning championship and he was kind enough to take us behind the shop and teach us how to speed-pan. We didn't find much gold on that 1984 trip but I made many more trips out there in later years and perfected the skills he taught me those many years ago. I was devastated when I learned that my Treasure Hunter had been stolen in 1992. I never was able to recover it. Unfortunately, Richard Ray passed away a few years ago.
~Texas Jay

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