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E-trac setting
Posted by: WV62
Date: October 25, 2017 02:35PM
I posted this question in the General detecting forum, but thinking I should have posted it here in the E-Trac Forum.

To make my E-trac run a little like my Fisher F75 which setting should I choose Conductivity or Ferrous?

Ron in WV



Worked and lived in the Huntington West Virginia area all my life, retired 2010
US Air Force Vietnam Veteran (68-69 & 70-71)
Started getting into metal detecting around 1975

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: IDXMonster
Date: October 25, 2017 06:37PM
Ron...before anyone breaks out their flamethrower,let me explain. IF you run in CONDUCT sounds, the machine will give you a tone depending on how CONDUCTIVE it has determined the target to be. If it thinks it's VERY CONDUCTIVE,it will give a HIGH tone. If it doesn't think the target is very CONDUCTIVE at all,then a very low tone.
If you run in FERROUS,it's the same drill...
Remember...no matter if you're running FERROUS or CONDUCT,the target will always show up on the same spot on the Smart Find screen,and more importantly on really deep targets,dance around in the same way. What they did with the CTX and Target Trace was to actually incorporate the "traces" or "paths" that the cursor is taking,making it easier for the operator to see what's going on.
To ask how to run your eTrac like an F75 might be a difficult thing,I don't know. I have never used a Fisher. But I will guarantee that the eTrac will take many many hours and many many days,months...but when your confidence in the machine and the way you run it starts to match the machines actual capability,you will have something special. There's no shortcut,no magic this or that.
I'll be interested in the rest of the comments...

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Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: WV62
Date: October 25, 2017 07:25PM
Thanks IDXMonster,

I hope nobody gets upset over the question, I am just trying to improve on my E-Trac. But I have been running a F75 since I retired in 2010 and I understand it pretty good so my thought is the closer I can get the E-Trac to the F75 it would help me get a better understanding of the E-Trac.

I haven't had my F75 out since I got the E-Trac, my thought is if I try to use both machines it will just prolong my learning curve.

Please no flamethrowers guys, just trying to learn the E-Trac.

Ron in WV



Worked and lived in the Huntington West Virginia area all my life, retired 2010
US Air Force Vietnam Veteran (68-69 & 70-71)
Started getting into metal detecting around 1975

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: sprchng
Date: October 25, 2017 08:37PM
Trying to make the etrac sound like a F75 is like trying to make a thoroughbred run like a zebra.
As I said in your other post , it depends on what tones you ran on the F75 and , if DP was your tone setting , there's just no accurate comparison.
The etrac is musical , the F75 is digital,,,like comparing Bach to Kiss.
You can make the Deus sound like the F75 pretty easy , not the etrac.

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Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: Tony N (Michigan)
Date: October 26, 2017 02:48PM
Quote
WV62
Thanks IDXMonster,

I hope nobody gets upset over the question, I am just trying to improve on my E-Trac. But I have been running a F75 since I retired in 2010 and I understand it pretty good so my thought is the closer I can get the E-Trac to the F75 it would help me get a better understanding of the E-Trac.

I haven't had my F75 out since I got the E-Trac, my thought is if I try to use both machines it will just prolong my learning curve.

Please no flamethrowers guys, just trying to learn the E-Trac.

Ron in WV

Maybe some day detectors will allow you to choose from a list of sounds like our cell phones for calls or texts we get.
Like on the Minelab you'd be able to choose a Fisher F75 sound. Or on the F75 you could select from a list a Minelab sound.
Or instead of a sound get a human voice which says "Silver" or "Copper" or "I don't know what the heck it is but I'd dig it just to see what it is."

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Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: Tony N (Michigan)
Date: October 26, 2017 02:52PM
Quote
IDXMonster
But I will guarantee that the eTrac will take many many hours and many many days,months...but when your confidence in the machine and the way you run it starts to match the machines actual capability,you will have something special. There's no shortcut,no magic this or that.
I'll be interested in the rest of the comments...

There is one shortcut to learning the capabilities of the E-trac or any detector: Have a coin garden set up with different scenarios one might encounter in the real world.

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: tiftaaft
Date: October 26, 2017 03:21PM
Quote
Tony N (Michigan)
Quote
WV62
Thanks IDXMonster,

I hope nobody gets upset over the question, I am just trying to improve on my E-Trac. But I have been running a F75 since I retired in 2010 and I understand it pretty good so my thought is the closer I can get the E-Trac to the F75 it would help me get a better understanding of the E-Trac.

I haven't had my F75 out since I got the E-Trac, my thought is if I try to use both machines it will just prolong my learning curve.

Please no flamethrowers guys, just trying to learn the E-Trac.

Ron in WV

Maybe some day detectors will allow you to choose from a list of sounds like our cell phones for calls or texts we get.
Like on the Minelab you'd be able to choose a Fisher F75 sound. Or on the F75 you could select from a list a Minelab sound.
Or instead of a sound get a human voice which says "Silver" or "Copper" or "I don't know what the heck it is but I'd dig it just to see what it is."

I would choose "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" by the Beatles for the high tone. (which coincidentally is my Etrac's nickname ;))



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/26/2017 03:34PM by tiftaaft.

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: metalpopper
Date: December 02, 2017 04:48AM
Hello Ron.

A simple answerer, to making your E-Trac SOUND like a Fisher F75. You need to use the CONDUCTIVITY mode.

To add a TONE ID function to that mode, you choose from 1,2,3,4 or multi for the TONES.
Also set Normal, smooth, Long, Pitch hold; to NORMAL….or use whatever you may later decide by experience.
Do experiment with the latter adjustment.

*******************************

Now regarding IDX's post........I read it as IMPLYING Conductive mode and Ferrous mode audio response were the ‘SAME’...???????
FERROUS mode audio responses are not stimulated by the same factor as in CONDUCTIVITY mode.
Ferrous response id (FE) is determined by :-
(1) the 'inductive' nature of the target.
(2) WHICH for a non-ferrous coin or target, IS RELATED TO ITS APPARENT THICKNESS (sd) in relation to the frequency (harmonic involved.)
‘APPARENT’ meaning, that 'thickness' as 'seen' by the lines of flux as they intercept the target. i.e. the 'angle' or attitude at which the target is orientated in the soil.

ADD TO THE COIN’s FE factor (12), the soil's FERROUS factor, (1 to 35). i.e the FE mineralization per cubic metre of soil, and its VOLUME/THICKNESS at depth, as perceived by the detector.
That's an over-simplified attempt to convey what is a very complex...sweep-time-varying scenario.
So on the surface...a non-ferrous coin reads 12-something.CONDUCTIVITY.
As its depth in soil increases, the SOIL's FE component adds its 10 cents worth...so the FE factor INCREASES with Fe level/DEPTH. = 12+soil FE@depth.
It is a situation which understandingly is difficult to grasp, unless you are qualified in the subject of electro-physics; even so, it is equally difficult to reduce any description of the involved physics if at the same time you are avoiding the complex maths involved, which at this forum level, I am trying to do....matt.

N.B. Remember that we are dealing with MINELAB's FBS system, involving Time-domain principles; whereas the Fisher 75 is a Single frequency unit; working in the FREQUENCY DOMAIN.

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: IDXMonster
Date: December 02, 2017 08:48PM
Quote
metalpopper
Hello Ron.

A simple answerer, to making your E-Trac SOUND like a Fisher F75. You need to use the CONDUCTIVITY mode.

To add a TONE ID function to that mode, you choose from 1,2,3,4 or multi for the TONES.
Also set Normal, smooth, Long, Pitch hold; to NORMAL….or use whatever you may later decide by experience.
Do experiment with the latter adjustment.

*******************************

Now regarding IDX's post........I read it as IMPLYING Conductive mode and Ferrous mode audio response were the ‘SAME’...???????
FERROUS mode audio responses are not stimulated by the same factor as in CONDUCTIVITY mode.
Ferrous response id (FE) is determined by :-
(1) the 'inductive' nature of the target.
(2) WHICH for a non-ferrous coin or target, IS RELATED TO ITS APPARENT THICKNESS (sd) in relation to the frequency (harmonic involved.)
‘APPARENT’ meaning, that 'thickness' as 'seen' by the lines of flux as they intercept the target. i.e. the 'angle' or attitude at which the target is orientated in the soil.

ADD TO THE COIN’s FE factor (12), the soil's FERROUS factor, (1 to 35). i.e the FE mineralization per cubic metre of soil, and its VOLUME/THICKNESS at depth, as perceived by the detector.
That's an over-simplified attempt to convey what is a very complex...sweep-time-varying scenario.
So on the surface...a non-ferrous coin reads 12-something.CONDUCTIVITY.
As its depth in soil increases, the SOIL's FE component adds its 10 cents worth...so the FE factor INCREASES with Fe level/DEPTH. = 12+soil FE@depth.
It is a situation which understandingly is difficult to grasp, unless you are qualified in the subject of electro-physics; even so, it is equally difficult to reduce any description of the involved physics if at the same time you are avoiding the complex maths involved, which at this forum level, I am trying to do....matt.

N.B. Remember that we are dealing with MINELAB's FBS system, involving Time-domain principles; whereas the Fisher 75 is a Single frequency unit; working in the FREQUENCY DOMAIN.

Matt,what I was TRYING to say was if in Conductive,high conductors will report a high tone,the less Conductive targets receive a lower tone. If in Ferrous,the machine will report a high tone if it thinks it has little FE content,and a lower tone the more FE characteristics it sees in the target. No matter how it’s reporting,in CO or FE, placement on the Smart Screen remains the same. I apparently didn’t proofread what I had typed...thanks for the catch!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/02/2017 08:51PM by IDXMonster.

Re: E-trac setting
Posted by: Tony (Michigan)
Date: December 03, 2017 12:57PM
Quote
tiftaaft
Quote
Tony N (Michigan)
Quote
WV62
Thanks IDXMonster,

I hope nobody gets upset over the question, I am just trying to improve on my E-Trac. But I have been running a F75 since I retired in 2010 and I understand it pretty good so my thought is the closer I can get the E-Trac to the F75 it would help me get a better understanding of the E-Trac.

I haven't had my F75 out since I got the E-Trac, my thought is if I try to use both machines it will just prolong my learning curve.

Please no flamethrowers guys, just trying to learn the E-Trac.

Ron in WV

Maybe some day detectors will allow you to choose from a list of sounds like our cell phones for calls or texts we get.
Like on the Minelab you'd be able to choose a Fisher F75 sound. Or on the F75 you could select from a list a Minelab sound.
Or instead of a sound get a human voice which says "Silver" or "Copper" or "I don't know what the heck it is but I'd dig it just to see what it is."

I would choose "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" by the Beatles for the high tone. (which coincidentally is my Etrac's nickname ;))

I like your idea!

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