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5x10" DD/HF Coil and the 6" DD/HF Coil - Visible Differences

nero_design

New member
I started to write this Thread as part of an answer to someone else's question. However, I ended up writing more information than I expected to... and rather than paste this into the reply, I thought it would be better off to place these details in a separate thread.

_____________________________________________________________________

As someone who wanted to start out detecting beaches and occasionally go out the the Gold Fields, I seem to find myself doing things the other way around.
Prospecting has become my hobby now and I had to look at buying an additional coil or two on order to have any success.

There's three main coils to be considered in the High Frequency range for the X-Terra 70:
The 10.5" DD HF Coil (Better for beach and field but possibly not so much for Gold Prospecting for smaller nuggets)
The 5x10" DD HF Coil (Elliptical, Shaped to use in Difficult Terrain, Replaceable Skid Plate)
The 6" DD HF Coil (Super Sensitive/Waterproof/ NO replaceable Skid Plate)

It's my understanding that the DD High Frequency Coils are particularly good in the sort of mineralized soils that gold typically is found in.
I have the 5x10" DD HF and the 6" DD HF coils. Both are completely different to one another, even though they are both High Frequency DD coils. I imagine the 10.5 DD is also quite different although it was not recommended to me for Prospecting so I have not yet purchased one.


[size=large]5x10" Elliptical Double D High Frequency (18.75khz) Coil:[/size]
The 5x10" is probably best for exploring areas where gold might be found. Larger signal blade means more area can be covered, especially the sort of iron-filled soils near where I detect. But this blade-like Emission Field is weaker, wider and a little shallower that I would prefer. It has a replaceable skuff cover but it's not water-proofed (for immersion) where the cable meets the coil itself. It has quite a wide field of detection near the coil (see the green Halo in the illustration). The blade area of the coil emission is a little broad compared to the 6" coil. The coil is sensitive to metal but NOT to really small nuggets (eg: smaller than 1/5 of a gram, if it's a few inches under the surface, probably won't register).

original.jpg


[size=large]6" Elliptical Double D High Frequency (18.75khz) Coil:[/size]
The 6" coil is probably best suited to careful scanning of areas where finer specimens might be found. A much smaller coil, this is also MORE sensitive but the user should work slower on the same ground due to the smaller detection field. If you were visiting a known site for gold, this is a pretty handy coil. It is waterproof and can be immersed in streams to search from clumps of smaller gold, small specimens in quartz or even very small nuggets. I tested this coil on a 0.02g 'micro-nugget' and found it responded nicely if the target this small is on the surface. That's a pretty small fleck of gold too! The 5x10" Elliptical Coil could NOT detect a sample this small under any circumstance. The Emission Field is almost like a knife blade on the 6" DD. I believe the Emission Field on the 6" to be sharper in shape and far more sensitive to gold that the Elliptical although the Elliptical is capable of detecting gold that is not near the actual coil or the blade.

original.jpg


I'm fond of both these coils but I'm baffled as to which coil to use myself sometimes.

I like the Elliptical. It even looks good on the detector. But if it misses VERY small gold, then I wonder sometimes if it's strong enough for me to rely on it. It costs me time and money to get to the right place and I have to take into account many other things including weather. I don't want to waste time with the wrong coil. Should I use the Elliptical and then change coils if I find something? I honestly don't know ...but this is what I have done in the past. Like owning a camera with two different lenses: if you take an expensive vacation and one lens is damaged or breaks... you can still complete your trip and take pictures with the remaining lens, regardless of the zoom. Same goes for coils. In some instances, serious prospectors take two detectors with them in case of mishap. So carrying an additional coil with me may have its benefits.

In under a week, I am traveling to a location which was once VERY rich in nuggets in the mid-1800s. I just found the details last night (!) which few people know about since it wasn't considered to be as high profile as other gold fields near here. I stayed up last night till 6am marking the map that my friend will use to navigate us there. But since the area has been dug up and 'thoroughly thrashed' (as they say) by other miners and later... detectorists, I'm going to consider detecting the area with the 6" coil. This is because I believe that any gold remaining would need to be small enough to have been missed by people who got there before me. And any larger nuggets will likewise be visible to this coil as long as the Emission Field passes over them. I believe the 6" coil penetrates deeper than the Elliptical and that may be important. I might be wrong too. But Nuggets on the surface should trigger an immediate response with either coil.

Below is the Business Card-sized manual that I used to keep in my pocket to remind me which settings to start off in.
I've pretty much memorized these details but am posting them here in case others want to print them out for use. Bit of a "Startup For Dummies" which I made after i realized I was neglecting the correct process myself at the beginning. I think I wasted my first three days with the X-Terra 70 by hitting the buttons in the wrong sequence. There's a few experienced detectorists here who wouldn't have use for it but I thought it might come in handy for newbies who don't want to carry their manual around with them on their first few trips.

Cheers,

Marco


[attachment 82999 X_TERRA70_CARD.jpg]
[size=small]Fold Down the Middle. Laminate if desired.[/size]
 
I have printed out most of what is written in FAQ, but my memory is not what it used to be and I really appreciate your efforts and your willingness to share your info.
Sheila.
 
add this one to the FAQFAQ section on the forum. Awesome graphics!!! Thanks. HH Randy
 
You're most welcome, Digger. Go right ahead.

I spent tonight repeatedly mounting both coils to the X-Terra 70 and testing a variety of gold nuggets of various shapes and sizes (minute shapes the size of a pinhead to spherical shapes over 5 grams). It would best be described as playing with two different shaped magnets! The shape of the detection field around the two coils is very much like the above images. The coils react when any metal enters the "green halo" zone. This halo extends on both top and bottom of the coils - even if this is not apparent in the illustrations.

The Elliptical was LESS sensitive to TINY nuggets, yet the 6" was easily able to detect their presence when they were close.

With slightly larger nuggets, the 6" coil was unable to detect targets that were not in the "projected emission blade" yet the Elliptical could easily sense them as they approached the ege of the coil - above or below it... Even if they did not enter the projected emission blade area of the Elliptical coil.

But both coils are VERY similar! I found it hard to see a CLEAR benefit for one or the other at first glance. One comes with a replaceable Scuff Cover and a larger footprint.... the other is Waterproof, more sensitive to smaller targets and fits in narrow places. The Elliptical certainly has a wider Emission Blade - which has "soft" edges. The 6" had a more defined Emission Field Blade which appeared tighter, narrower and projected further than that of the Elliptical.

The ends (front and rear tip) of the Elliptical are slightly more sensitive than previously noted.
 
In field use over a 10ft(3m) x 10ft(3m) heavily iron trash infested area will demonstrate the differences readily. Methodically covering the area first with the 5x10", then 6"HF DD, will be an eye opening experience. The 5x10" is excellent in trash, but the 6" HF DD is Nirvana.:)

And I define high iron infestation as a new piece of iron about every two inches or so in every direction.

HH
BarnacleBill
 
Marco GOOD read...!!! :thumbup: I just got my X70 late last Fall so am very anxious to get out this Spring and do some serious detectiong. I hunt about 90% of my time with some real tough competition so the more I can learn the better my edge might be.:twodetecting: I live in an area that has very low mineralizattion so CC coils work rather well here. I have the stock 9" 7.75Khz, 6" 7.75Khz cc, 9" 3khz, and just recently traded my 6" 18.75Khz for a 5X10 Elip 18.75Khz. Reason being the two 6" coils performed very similar in my area, but still wanted a high frq coil. The elip coil I am hoping may give me better ground coverage in the many corn filed we hunt and still have that 18.75Khz for those lost gold coins. Your read gives me confidence I did the right thing for my area of the country as I don't have the opportunity to find any raw gold.
Now if the darn snow would leave us alone and the ground would thaw out Digger and I will be out there doing our thing.
PS I will probably carry a copy of your Start up for Dummies, just in case.. I wouldn't need it if I would quit alternating different machies and concentrate on just the best.
Bill
 
And I define high iron infestation as a new piece of iron about every two inches or so in every direction

Ijzerhandelaar!!

de jackpinewilde
 
original.jpg


I didn't connect my Concentric coil last night but from memory, the Primary Emission Field (strongest) is more like a Cone shape (Red).
The secondary (weaker) field appears to form two big disc shaped fields on top and bottom (Green).
 
sophisticated test gear. But when I tested my concentric coils with various targets, and mapped the detection pattern based on audio response and visual TID, my results looked more like this.....

[attachment 83151 concentricdetectionpattern.JPG]


Less of a "cone shape" and more rounded at the bottom. I believe I referred to this as an "inverted half melon" when I posted this initially.

HH Randy
 
I just want to say thank you for the great posts. I just ordered the X70 Yesterday morning (the Pro pack...which contains a ton of freebies, including: the standard 9" 7.5kHz and the 5X10 DD 18.75kHz as well as several hundred in add ons from KELLYCO and MineLab). I asked the salesperson what "extra" coil would make the most sense for me to buy (as someone who will relic hunt about 70% of the time and "prospect" the other 30%) and she suggested the 6"DD (18.75). Right before I came to this site I made myself a note, because I started thinking to myself...."OK Self, Why did she suggest a 5X10 and a 6 DD both with the high frequency and describe the 5X10 DD to be best suited for "clean" areas to search for gold and even jewelry or coins, but the 6"DD was suggested to be good for small/tight spots around metal items (such as ladders/pipes/bleachers/etc). The salesperson said the 9" 7.5kHz was good for general relic hunting....and while I still don't quite understand why the 5X10 and 6"DD's... with the same frequency (I'm a total newbie..only been detecting half a dozen times years ago..using a friends detector) ...are best for totally different types of terrain, I do see that Nero and Barnacle Bill (and others I may have missed the names of) seem to think that having both are wise...so I wont call back the lady and suspiciously ask why she suggested that combination.
If you (nero, bb or someone else) could clarify "WHY" the two coils with the same frequencies work best in such opposite terrain's?

Thanks in advance-
The New Guy.
 
Being DD coils they have a heel to toe blade pattern as in the wonderful illustration by Nero. One pattern is 10.5 inches long and the other only six. In the simple drawing below the black items are trash and could mask the good items under a different part of the 10.5 coil.

[attachment 93372 6vsElliprical.gif]

But this is not to say the 5x10 doesn't do well in trash, it does very well with more coverage than the six. But the little DD is so good that it is very difficult to take off once you've used it in heavy trash. At the moment for shore hunting I am running the 10.5 MF DD on the X70, and the 6 HF DD on the X50 so I can make a quick change over. For beach and wading the 10.5 HF DD and 6 HF DD.

HH
BarnacleBill
 
original.jpg


Hi there 'New Guy',
The coils you have are the same three that I use myself. The Concentric coils on the X-70 are less effective on the goldfields.
For the "noisy" soils that Prospectors typically encounter, you'll need the High Frequency DD coils. Nothing else will work as well.

medium.jpg

Elliptical HF DD (5x10)
The Elliptical (5x10) coil has a larger overall field and can detect items under soils that would give any other coil type a very hard time.
The Elliptical coil has a softer, fuzzier detection field and the most sensitive area of this field has a soft edge to it. This means that
a bunch of small targets in a small area (a few feet wide) will sometimes show as one large target. You can sweep somewhat quickly with this coil.
You would use this coil to cover larger areas more quickly, especially when you are trying to find native gold nuggets.
The Elliptical coil is not designed for under water use. Unlike other coils (including the 6" DD HF), it is only really useful when prospecting for gold.
I use this coil when searching new ground. If I find good signals, I will sometimes change coils to the 6" for more careful Prospecting if
I find good sounding targets in the right areas. it has a replaceable scuff cover.


medium.jpg

Elliptical HF DD (6")
The 6" coil is very small but it has a much narrower and sharper "blade shaped" emission field. It can detect VERY SMALL targets.
Even the head of a pin can be detected with this amazingly sensitive coil. It works well in "noisy" soils which would give another
detector a hard time. With such a narrow field on this coil, you could sprinkle coins or nuggets on the ground in front of you and this coil
would enable you to select them one at a time. This small coil requires slower working speeds and slower sweeps.
You can speed the sweeps up when you discover a target.
It is not as suitable for covering larger areas QUICKLY like the Elliptical coil is. But it's small enough to carry with you as a specialist coil.
It is waterproof and is designed for under water use as well. It can detect small gold in specimens that the Elliptical will not respond to.
I like to use this coil in creeks and also in areas where I want to work quickly to recover targets in very hard to read soils.
This coil is ALSO good for hunting in saltwater and beaches and many Relic Hunters use it for efficient coin recovery on professional digs.
As Barnacle Bill pointed out: You might be tempted to only use the 6" coil alone and never swap them over. But you'll spend an entire day covering an area the size of your bedroom if you do that when prospecting. So try to use it when you find good targets with the Elliptical. Together, these two coils are a VERY powerful combination. The 6" DD does not have a replaceable scuff cover.
I usually put duct tape on the bottom of mine before each trip to protect it a little more.
This coil penetrates quite deeply into the ground. Possibly more than the 5x10. But is has a very small secondary field (the green fuzzy glow in the illustrations) so it won't spot the targets nearby that you don't pass directly over... whereas the Elliptical 5x10 might just spot them with its larger field.


medium.jpg

Concentric MF (9")
The Medium Frequency Concentric Coil that usually comes by default with the X-Terra 70 is a great multi-use coil which is best suited to coin hunting.
This coil has a different shaped emission field (more like an inverted cone shape) and the user will need to remember this if switching between coils.
This coil is waterproof as well and can be used on the beaches and in salt water effectively. Again, it's a larger coil than the 6" DD and can cover a larger area much faster. If you find that there's a lot of junk on the area you are covering, your signals may start to merge together when you pass over multiple items near one another. If that happens, you can change to the 6" coil which will allow you to examine each item one at a time.
Remember to remove your scuff cover after hunting to empty the loose sand from it. If you pick up any iron particles and they get trapped between the coil bottom and the scuff cover, they may interfere with your signals.

The sales person who suggested the Elliptical for "Clean areas" did so because it's usually the coil that Prospectors will choose to scan an area looking for gold. If they find some, of if it seems there's a lot of junk targets in the area, you can change coils immediately to the 6" DD HF coil. It's smaller and far more sensitive. But it's not as fast to use as the Elliptical coil so it's better for slow and careful scanning of areas you suspect might yield a good specimen or nugget.

To Surmise:

*Elliptical (5x10) = Fast and effective but only for the gold fields. Exclusively used for Prospecting on Gold Fields only.
*6" DD HF = Slow but extremely sensitive to small gold. Useful on beaches for coins and relics as well as the Gold Fields.
*Concentric 9" MF = Best suited for beaches and relic hunting. Not useful on the Gold Fields.


Hope this helps.

Cheers

Marco
______________________________________________________________

TIP: Most gold that you might come across will usually sound rather "Faint" to the detector. If you only dig the loudest and sharpest target signals, you'll only get large iron junk or tin cans. In areas where nobody has ever been before (Virgin Ground), try to dig ANY and EVERY target you detect because the odds of it being junk are reduced. Listen for the quieter sounds and slight rises in pitch. Don't expect to be successful on your first outing. Virtually nobody is... they need to learn their detector on the first few trips. Use the new "Ground Tracking" feature on the X-70 and remember to turn it OFF when you hit a target.
 
Thank you for the comments, clarifications and time. I really appreciate it! Forgive me for bugging you, but you definitely seem to know the machine extremely well, so I ask you : With those three coils in your arsenal (if you were going to do a significant amount of coin/artifact hunting), would you stick with the 9"default coil for this task...or would you invest in a different one. The obvious question as a follow-up to that one would be/is ...then..."if" so, what one would you buy? If it makes sense to invest in a coil more specific to coins/artifacts, now would be a good time for me, so please look at it as being able to afford a specialty coil if it makes sense to do so, but not so rolling in money rich to buy it just for show :) I hope you understand that! lol ....and thanks very much again for your time and patience.
Dave King.
 
Hi Dave,
I don't hunt for coins and relics quite as much as I enjoy Prospecting so I'd encourage others to reply to your question if they can.
With my selection of coils, I'd use the 9" on the beaches because it's light and quite effective. The 9" MF coil works smoothly because the frequency range is good for both coins and also for silver jewellery. Mine detects gold jewellery easily too.

If I was after targets in a tough area or I was searching a wreck or a series of rockpools, I'd be more inclined to remove
the 9" concentric and then fit the 6" DD. The smaller disc size will allow you to get up tight in smaller spaces and up against crevices where small
and heavy items fall and get trapped.

But for scanning large areas of beaches and fields at a good speed, the light and effective 9" concentric coil is certainly one of the best out there.
There is a heavier 10.5" MF DD coil available with supposedly a little more strenght but the added weight will take away some of the pleasure involved. With this sort of detection, you might be more interested in finding Gold jewellery so the High Frequency version might be preferable. Hope this helps.

Again, I'd encourage others with a Coin and Relic background to reply to this thread question. Feel free to correct me if you think I'm off the mark.

Kind Regards,

Marco
 
No problem....Maybe I'll start a new thread and ask folks what they think is best for general coin/relic detection and see what happens lol.....With me, I would love to spend all my time nugget hunting, but I live in South Central Ohio (not exactly near one of the Gold Bands here in the USA :O) , so I want to be able to just go out for the joy of detecting and being outside. Who knows....maybe I'll find a lost shipment of gold from the civil war era, or some bank hating paranoid rich dude that died before telling anyone where he dug his treasure hoard :O) Gotta dream, eh? :O) Thanks once again for your time and patience in answering so many questions for me. I can't wait to learn to operate this machine and feel able to remove my self labeled "new guy" handle :O)

Best Regards-

Dave King.
 
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