Got Chased from a City Park Today

[TJPHILLY2]

Here in the City of Philadelphia, I've been metal detecting in City parks maintained by the recreation department for over ten years.

In Recreation Department run parks, there is no prohibition against metal detecting - at least nothing on the Recreation Department's website and nothing listed in their Park Rules, and no signs prohibiting metal detecting anywhere.

Today, I went to a sports field run by the Recreation Department. I have metal detected there many times.

The sports field is not a manicured site...there is bare ground mixed with patches of crab grass. People play soccer and baseball there all the time, there are numerous places on the field where the turf has been worn down to bare dirt....I fill in all holes.

I was there for about 40 minutes and finding nothing when (I assume) the attendant came up to me and told me "You can't dig up the dirt."

Remember..this is a crab grass, dirt, and gravel environment....not the lush, green outfield at Citizens Bank Park.

I was so struck by how stupid the whole thing was and not wanting to argue with this overzealous jerk...that I just said "OK" and left.

I want to contact the Recreation Department and tell someone in authority what happened. But I fear that this might open a can of worms such that there WILL be a prohibition against metal detecting in City run parks if I make an issue out of what happened today.

I can imagine that given the stupidity of how things play out today, and even though I fill in all my holes and plugs, that this jerk at the park will be able to make the case that I somehow vandalized the facility.

As it stands right now, other than City run parks, there are no public places left whereby one can metal detect - none.

Fairmount Park is off limits - and there is an ongoing effort to turn all of the City run parks over to the Fairmount Park commission - and any park run by the Fairmount Park commission is off limits to metal detecting as well. More and more parks are being taken over by the Fairmount Park Commission.

This means that little by little, in public places metal detecting is being outlawed in the City of Philadelphia.

I am beginning to wonder if it is time for me give up metal detecting - at least here in the City of Philadelphia.

It surely is a sign of the times when digging a hole less than five inches deep that is later filled back in anyhow, in a crab grass, gravel, and bare dirt environment,,in a ratty inner-city park - is a big deal warranting someones attention.

Crime...warrants damn little attention....but metal detecting, you betcha.

Sheesh...

TJ

 

[BH_Landstar_]

This is one reason I hunt at night or before the crack of dawn (before sun-up).

Best not to open a can of worms, go back another day, say nothing to anyone, just leave and give it a week or two and try again.

 

[TJPHILLY2]

I don't think I will go back to that particular park any time soon.

I may just stop metal detecting here in Philadelphia - and just do it on the beach when I can get down there or when I am on vacation at the Shore.

To me...it's just galling how something so simple is made into something so major....ratty park, crab grass, turf worn down to bare dirt all over the field...if you minimally just filled in your holes no one would be able to tell you'd been there.

It's not like this place is a well-manicured showcase of lawn tending...people play pick up games of touch football all the time. The turf is literally hollowed out in many places.

But me digging a small hole in the gravel and crab grass..and then filling it in...is a big deal.

What the hell has happened to common sense in this country?


Some days, it doesn't pay to get out of bed...

TJ

 

[Robert2300]

The City of Brotherly Love?\Hahahahaha.

 

[bob.oz]

Your right not to contact any city officials.Read what is written in the law/code...like you did.If you know what your reading.Stand your ground,he might be some grounds worker trying to overstep his job duty!.....My first response would have been,"Says who?Who are you?"...just to find out his knowledge on the matter.I would leave it be for a while.That being your only negative contact in ten years...I would go back another day!

 

[KinTN]

The mindset of those employed by Big Gov is the same as the little bully in the sandbox. He doesn't want or have any use for all those toys he has gathered in the sandbox, he just doesn't want anyone else to be able to have fun with them. Time will come when petty little people have to answer for their sins.

 

[Barry NY]

He never said "No metal detecting" - he said "No digging".
That is the rule in most all public parks and grounds.

What if someone else doesn't fill in their holes and someone trips and falls, gets hurt and sues?
It's just easy for them to ban ALL digging in the dirt.

You need to become friends with the groundskeepers so they see you are responsible with your digging...and let you dig there...

Also - the Taskforce for Metal Detecting Rights is working to make municipalities aware of proper digging techniques..www.detectingrights.com

This is a problem everywhere - you need to have the "enforcers" on your side...

 

[BluesCruise]

You might try calling the parks and recreation dept. anonymously, and just ask if metal detecting is allowed in city run parks. I've done that in both Portland, Or and Vancouver, Wa, and was told by both it was OK, so long as you didn't dig big holes or leave the grass messed up. I told them I use a screw driver to pop coins, and they said "that's fine, have a good time" I believe park maintenance folks get a little over zealous because a a few bad examples in our hobby who just can't get it when it comes to leaving open holes and trash.

Hang in there man!

Ron

 

[Tom_in_CA]

TJ, you've been metal detecting for "10 yrs", and this is the first boot you've had ? Sounds to me like you've had VERY good odds, and can treat this as an isolated incident. Do NOT go asking for "clarification", etc..., lest you just get a bunch of bored bureaucrats to invent a rule to address your "pressing issue".. All parks have rules agains defacement, alterations, digging, etc... But all such verbage implicitly applies to the end result. So if you leave no trace of your presence, then ..... doh ........ you've not alterED or defacED anything. But sure, anyone can gripe about the temporary evil process. But if YOU know you'll leave no trace (and the field is no worse off as you've noticed), then ..... just avoid such lookie-lous. Go at more discreet times. Let that one park take a break for awhile, and ... next time (if you wish to do that place again), pick a time when it's not his shift (certainly you made not of the time-of-day you ran into him, right?)

I've been at this for over 35 yrs., and if I took every single "scram" as an "oh no, I can't detect anymore", I'd be out of places to detect all ready. But I can think of places where I got a scram before, that ..... after due discretion and lip-service, I've been back 100's of times, and never heard "boo" again. You say yourself there is no rule saying "no metal detectors". And it was only "holes" which is the issue. Well, you're not planning on leaving holes, right? Then what's the problem? Just avoid him in the future. Sure "scrams" are no fun. But no, they do not mean there's a "rule" therefore, from-the-on-out, for that entire city. Heck, that'd be like saying if a single person flipped you off in traffic, that you should never drive again ?

 

[TJPHILLY2]

Hi all,

To be honest, I'm going to just avoid that particular playground/park - and I might just give up metal detecting in the parks around here.

Ironically, I started metal detecting at that very same spot ten years ago. I asked permission from the then-attendant and he had no objection.

That summer, I went there to metal detect at least three times a week - sometimes more. No one ever said a word to me. I have been there many, many times over the years.

Most of the area's turf is a mixture of sand, gravel, dirt, crab grass, and sometimes that orange colored fill dirt that is used on baseball diamonds. It is often times very hard to dig in and does not lend itself to pristine, text book plugs as it's very sandy and usually does not hold together well.

Of course, I fill in all the holes I dig and take my trash with me. I try to return the surface vegetation, if there was any to begin with, to its original position on the surface. Most of the time this vegetation is clover mixed with weeds and crab grass. Often I dig in areas that are completely worn down to bare turf. I fill the hole, make things as pretty as I can, and tamp it down with my foot.

I always look back at the hole and ask myself if it looks any worse than when I started. If the answer is no, then I think I have done all I can. I also go back and try to find where I have dug. Most of the time not even I can readily spot where I dug.

I frankly don't know what more I can do .

But it's not worth fighting over. To be honest, the metal detecting sucks in these city parks with a few exceptions.

There is only one park where I have found anything old - a few mercury dimes, four or five buffalo nickels, some Indian head pennies, a few V nickels, and some wheat pennies - but in all the rest of the City-run parks and sports fields it's modest amounts of clad and tons of trash.

I've only found gold once - but I did not detect it, I saw the gold chain on the surface with my eyes and probably would have missed had it been buried completely because my detector does not sound off on it very well at all.

The rest of the time I find some clad, a dollar or two an hour - and I was trying to find enough clad this spring and summer to buy a few metal detecting accessories - or at least defray the cost of a new Minelab Xterra 505.

My real passion is beach and water hunting but I work six days a week and live 75 miles from Atlantic City so I don't get down there very often. Hunting the parks up here in the City was my distant-second-best option to remain active in the hobby.

I guess that all in all, I've been lucky - this guy is the only person to ever object to my metal detecting here.

But if it becomes a regular thing that I am treated like I was today, then I will happily give up hunting the parks here as it's not fun to be treated like you're vandal or something - and it's my sense that if you try to metal detect in any park that has an attendant on duty you run a high chance of ill treatment based on ignorance.

And it would be ironic if I were the one to leave and give up my pastime - since the parks up here are often populated by people who deal drugs, people who litter profusely, people who drink copious amounts of alcohol, and people who let their dogs pee and crap all over the place....

But the metal detectorist who fills in all his holes, he's the one they go after.

Ain't that some crap?

Peace out.

TJ

 

[Jim Robertson]

Show him the trash you remove from the park. Things that folks could get hurt from. And just the trash that has to be a good thing for a grounds keeper.

 

[BillF]

Where I live you used to have to get a permit to detect in the parks. They aren't needed anymore. However, the rules state, No Digging, whatsoever.
You are allowed to use a screwdriver, no bigger than 3/8". Apparently that's different than "digging". And you must not leave any evidence of what you're doing, and remove all trash.
Don't let that one person stop you from detecting in the park, and don't dig plugs.
Use a screwdriver. I will bet that if you check with city hall the rules will be the same as we have here.
Best of luck.

 

[michaelnc]

None of these detecting shows paint our hobby in a good light. The less known about our hobby the better (let us be the quirky detector guy). Mainstream media attention is forcing landowners to say no because they mistakenly believe their land holds massive treasures. The government (local,state,federal) is getting a first hand look at these morons on tv and deciding they don't want goofballs like that digging up the parks . Most folks don't understand our hobby anyway and pushing these shows into the public eye just reinforces their negative attitude toward us. I guess we all better buy a bunch of land so we will have some ground to detect. I personally enjoy the solitude and history of the finds and the sites we hunt but already more and more sites are becoming off limits. This is happening at an alarming rate and anyone who supports these digging shows is driving the nails in our hobby's coffin. Sorry for the rambling, just my 2 cents on why parks and other sites are booting detectorists.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

There is a term in psychology known as "projecting". It's where we naturally assume that others do the same as us, come to the same conclusions as us, etc.... So you and I (as metal detectorists) will obviously flip channels on the TV, and stop on this show, RIGHT? Why? BECAUSE WE ARE METAL DETECTORISTS, doh And even if we don't like it, we're still going to check it out anyhow, since, we're metal detectorists. And so too do we assume (as "projecting") that others, likewise, will tune into this blather.

But think of it: there's hundreds of channels on TV nowadays, right? And of those hundreds of channels, did you happen to watch the home-shopping-network today? Or how about "Real Housewives of New York"? Or have you spent an hour watching a info-mercial on the latest kitchen blenders? Or perhaps the yoga channel? NO, of course not. Why? Because you're not into that. But trust me: those people that are in to shopping (stay-at-home housewife types), or those who are into hollywood gossip, or those who are into kitchen gadgets, or those who are into yoga, WILL stop and watch those channels for awhile. And they too just "assume" that "the masses are seeing this". And if they spot an error, will "project" that oodles of people care about it.

Thus, trust me, not a lot of non-md'rs are watching this crud.

JMHO.

 

[azsh07]

Thought they were stupid people doing a stupid show. Most just laughed at them and pretty much figured out that the shows are all faked.

Lust like say...Storage Wars or Pawn Stars....most people never do these activities but most have a good hankering these shows are all setups...an they are.

So while these MD shows are a joke and simply satisfy the egos' of the short little stumpy men who make them...few take them seriously. People put them in the same league as the Paranormal investigation shows...bwahahaha.....and I have seen real ghosts..but still bwahahaha..

 

[kingingkunsan]

Where I live you used to have to get a permit to detect in the parks. They aren't needed anymore. However, the rules state, No Digging, whatsoever.
You are allowed to use a screwdriver, no bigger than 3/8". Apparently that's different than "digging". And you must not leave any evidence of what you're doing, and remove all trash.
Don't let that one person stop you from detecting in the park, and don't dig plugs.
Use a screwdriver. I will bet that if you check with city hall the rules will be the same as we have here.
Best of luck.

Next it will be against the law for squirrels to be in city parks. Because we all know they dig holes to bury their nuts

 

[siny]

Here in NYC we need permits to MD in parks....no MD'ing on any athletic field.....injuries and legal issues come into play......in other words play the cards which you are dealt.

 

[Robert2300]

You might want to carry one of those small tote bags with you to collect
the trash in. DON'T THROW THE TRASH AWAY. I used my bag of trash
to show one park superintendent all the junk I was digging out and carrying out
of the place. He liked that and said GO AHEAD...just don't make any big
holes.
Robt2300

 

[marcomo]

Thus, trust me, not a lot of non-md'rs are watching this crud.

Tom, I understand the psychology of projecting and don't dispute the validity of it.

I also understand that ratings good enough to get a show like Diggers renewed for a second season on the Nat'l Geographic channel are still small.

And maybe I am projecting a bit here, but I've been detecting a little over five years now and I can tell you that I have easily had more wanna-bes approach me unsolicited over the last year than all the previous years combined. Invariably, they watch Diggers.

Later this year, a show called Digfellas with Bill Ladd and some other guy will debut on the Travel Channel. Another small cable channel that relatively few watch, but it will still inspire more big treasure seekers looking to strike it rich.

The truth is that most who take up detecting with the intention of treasure jumping out of the ground will lose their enthusiasm and drop detecting shortly after taking it up, same as it's always been. Unfortunately, those are the people most likely to cause damage to the hobby before they give up.

My issue with a show like Diggers isn't that it inspires people to take up detecting, it's that it does so unnaturally. And there's no way to avoid that with the entertainment enhancements needed to spice up a so-called "reality" show.

Lots of interesting and valuable stuff found in just a half-hour, with wacky frat boy antics and no mention of how to properly get it out of the ground.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Marcomo, your point is "duly noted".

And what you say about the inability of those newbies to make a dent on the good spots is also true. I mean, let's face it: There are NO newbies who are going to pick up a detector and go out and pick out the deep silver from well-worked parks. Where I'm at, for instance, I can think of parks where I (with 35+ yrs. experience) can go still "eak out" 2 or 3 silvers from insane depths, *only* because I know *exactly* what I'm listening for. But the beginner (no matter WHAT machine, no matter HOW expensive) will go to that same park and only dig clad.

And to-this-day my mind is continually boggled when I travel around to other parts of my state, and see some place I want to detect. At first, I'll think to myself "nah, no doubt the locals have seen this, or read about this in their history books, and already exploited it". But I try it anyhow and sometimes find places that are very good (even gold coins, reales, seateds, etc...) Then later, I get on a forum, and read of a person in a town near there lamenting how he "can't find any good place to hunt in his area." Doh! Because the average beginner just doesn't know, or doesn't recognize the age indicators that should/would compel him to trudge on, etc.....

And as for the impact that those shows make on the "image" of the rest of us (ie.: getting permission, or getting kicked out of parks d/t beginner who were an "eyesore" before you, etc...), that too doesn't bother me to much (although I wish it weren't true). The reason it doesn't bother me too much, is the caliber of places I hit, is often-time so exotic, that .... no one's around to take issue, to begin with. Ie.: old-town demolition sites, beaches during storms at 2am low tide, park turf in the middle of the night, ruins out in the desert 10 miles from the nearest live person, and so forth. All the type of places and times that beginners just aren't going to be doing.