Question on "iffy" signals

[BarberBill]

I've noticed that about 20% of the time I dig a signal that just sounds off or strange enough that I might have passed it, I end up with a worthwhile target when I do dig. I'm curious if others have an estimate of how often they're glad they stopped and dug the signals that just don't sound quite right? Also make me wonder how often I should have dug and didn't.
HH
BB

 

[BH_Landstar_]

Dig, always dig an 'iffy' signal. I've dug a few good keepers that have been 'iffy' signals with my F4 over the last 3 months, one was an 1877 quarter.

 

[earthmansurfer]

To be honest, I very rarely get anything worth digging with my T2 on iffy signals. Now, almost all of my iffy signals are 3"-4" like the coins I dig. The iffy signals that are coins are almost always badly corroded. I still will dig iffy signals to learn my machine, but I'm going to say that less than 5% of my iffy signals are good.

Also, One and two way signals are almost never coins for me. I use the stock 11"DD coil though.

 

[gmanlight]

earthmansurfer funny i was thinking 5% when you posted.With my F75 i dig some older sites and after hitting them a few times
with a few hunters i go for the iffys , rare to get a goody off a bad signal.
Last year at a old house hunted since the 80s I dug three junk targets in a row, 2 bottle caps and small copper flashing
Next target was my first Barber Quarter that i almost walked from.
Last winter hunting partly frozen wooded area i though i had a good hit, had hunting bud check it he said junk
It was frozen in . Went back a few weeks later with some melting and saved a Indian head , still sounded Ok with small coil.

 

[jim tn]

Some of my more coveted old coin finds, 2 cent piece, three cent piece, Indians and v's, were the result of digging iffy signals. Having said that, though, I would guess no more the 10% of the time are iffy signals anything good. I have a few sites that have been hard hit for year's and about the only chance for anything good is to dig iffy signals. On some of these, a 10% ratio would be good. HH jim tn

 

[gmanlight]

Hey Jim i hoped to see you post here.
The word iffy can mean many things to many people.
To me when i get a iffy signal i think to myself ,it iffy but i think a goody is in there
or its iffy most likely junk but i hope there is something there.
But most of the junk iffys are junk. HH Mike

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Of course, you can turn your question around and ask "how often has digging an iffy signal resulted in junk being found?".

Afterall, if the odds are (even 1 in 10 odds) that it turned out to be a good target, well then by definition, it would no longer be an "iffy" signal, to begin with. The signal then, would be worthy of chasing, and thus not "iffy", because most of us would gladly dig 9 junk to each real good keeper.

The truth is, most iffy signals will indeed be junk. And yes, now and then an "iffy" signal will be a keeper, no doubt. But this is like black-jack: If you have 20 in your hand, do you "hold" or do you "take another hit"? Most people would say to "hold", right? But why is that? How do you know that the next card *MIGHT* not be a one card and thus you could win the game? Because odds are, it's not going to be a one card.

So too is the same for metal detecting, if you have the liberty to strip-mine an area, fine then. Go for it. But a lot of other times, you simply can not strip-mine an area (junky inner city urban turf, for instance), so you elect to pass up some stuff (surface foil, corroded surface zinc, etc... and angle for deep coin sounds instead). Will you miss something? SURE. But will you miss reams and reams of junk too? Sure!

 

[Cliff KS]

n/t

 

[harvdog42]

Tom,

I think you are right on discussing odds. Odds are what they are...they have nothing to do with luck. I figure based on many years of hunting, that my odds are 1 in 400 of finding gold on the beach when the wet sand is producing. I've actually found two gold items in a row but the odds were still 1 in 400 as I see them. Was that luck? No. It was odds. Odds don't change because you find something. They are what they are, regardless of what you find.

I found six rings today on the beach today. None of them gold. Should I be pissed? Absolutley not. The odds were 1 in 400 as I see them. You have to play the odds and accept them for what they are. Great post Tom.

HH Harvdog

 

[BarberBill]

Well, when I started this, I meant the kind of "iffy" signal that makes you back up and check because it just doesn't quite fit the typical trash signal or the nice, solid gotta be a goodie signal while hunting with low discrimination. As mentioned, I've had a fairly decent return on checking those out although believe me, I've dug my fair share of pulltabs and foil as well. It does add credence to the dig every thing school of thought and I wonder what I have missed on some of the signals I have passed. Anyway, I was just wondering about other's experience and appreciate those that have jumped in on this thread.
HH
BB

 

[BH_Landstar_]

I'll go back to this .....

My iffy signal was reading 76 on the F4, then it would read 77 or 78 at 90 degrees to the object. Now I know quarters come in at 79 - 82 on the F4, so I was wondering if the target was a silver ring, a small silver ring, some of the rings I have found that are silver and small have been in the 68 - 76 range and at 4 - 5 inches deep. Now back to my target that was reading 76, 77 and 78 ..... the F4 said it was 6 - 7 inches down ! I walked away from it, but a few minutes later I decided to go back to it and dig, I'm glad I did cos this is what became of that 'iffy' signal.

 

[UK Brian]

A quote I wrote down from one of the U.K.'s most prominent detector users...

"Using the expression "iffy" is an admittance of ignorance; or being kinder, a euphemism for lack of signal knowledge".

I don't totally agree with it myself though you do have a lack of knowledge of that particular target. If I have an iffy signal then it tells me its time to drag all the tricks out of the box for that particular detector to make it none iffy. Could be reverse discrimination, an increase or decrease in sweep speed, seeing which sweep direction gives a bounce into the good on an analog meter etc. But this then makes me what he calls a faffer, someone who waves the coil back and forth over a target like a magic wand trying to make a bad signal into a good one.

 

[BH_Landstar_]

I tried every trick I could for the F4, it only hit 79 in one direction, all the other times and sweeps (slow, fast, at an angle and high or low to the ground by 1 inch, and even with lowering the gain from max) it still came up as what I would call an iffy signal at either 76, 77 or 78..... it bounced around between these numbers. In the end I dug it up, I was going to leave it, I walked away from it the 1st time but then went back to it as I had that 'nagging in my head' ..... "What if ?"

Signal knowledge ! Hmm ! The lack of signal knowledge is far from it, at the end of the day it's down to the metal detector and what it is telling you, how one decodes that info is the trick, not that the user has a lack of knowledge on signals, but an understanding of the signal being relayed back to the end user. If the users ignores the signal that is 'iffy' does that mean the user is a novice ? I think not, I'm sure there are more experianced users that have turned a signal down only to find out later that the item was a keeper. I, like most other detectorist have passed a signal up, we all do it from time to time based on the info given to us by the metal detector that we happen to be using at the time.

 

[gmanlight]

Iffy signal = Mental fatigue , not focused , lazy, and many other factors .
Bugs , weather , and real life concerns .
When i almost walked from my 1st Barber Quarter , i was hot and tired and dug 3 junk targets in a row
that were close in ID .

 

[earthmansurfer]

earthmansurfer funny i was thinking 5% when you posted.With my F75 i dig some older sites and after hitting them a few times
with a few hunters i go for the iffys , rare to get a goody off a bad signal.
Last year at a old house hunted since the 80s I dug three junk targets in a row, 2 bottle caps and small copper flashing
Next target was my first Barber Quarter that i almost walked from.
Last winter hunting partly frozen wooded area i though i had a good hit, had hunting bud check it he said junk
It was frozen in . Went back a few weeks later with some melting and saved a Indian head , still sounded Ok with small coil.

I guess it just comes down to not knowing and digging those iffy signals partly out of curiousity. To be real, if we just wanted coins, we would work faster and not waste time on the iffy's. Thinking of all the bad iffy's we dig, we could just be searching for good sounding targets. The results from this would almost certainly be more coins per hour, but it's not just about that.

When I pinpoint with my T2 I almost always can tell if the target is not exactly round (barring iron or the like right next to it). I am correct 95% of the time. Pinpointing/all metal is your friend for "sizing" the target.

A great suggestion I read from Norfolk Wolfs book "Advanced Detecting" is to decide to dig in a few seconds and not go around in circles and spend too much time on one target. I do that now and I'm listening better (focusing) and knowing my targets better. Try it, great suggestion from a great detectorist.

Again, it's clearly not about being a machine, we have that in our hands

 

[earthmansurfer]

What you just described is not and iffy signal. You guys in America are spoiled, the coins in Europe are all over the place. My main coin find seems to hit exactly around the pull tab range, but luckily there aren't that many where I hunt.

On coins my T2 usually hits within 3 or so of the mean, if the coin is flat and in good shape. If it's not flat (or if iron is nearby) the range might be 10 to 15! But what matters is that sound. And also how the target is shaped in pinpoint mode.

Semantics aside, I will always digg a deep iffy as there is more chance for things getting in the way of a good signal. It is indeed about odds.

So, I just realized something, when I say an iffy signal, it's not so much the ID, it's the sound. I love having the ID and use it always, but it's the sound that tells us more. The more years I hunt the more I learn about the sound but I can't say the same about the ID.

 

[BarberBill]

I agree about the sound. I walked away once from a scratchy, odd sounding signal that didn't ID as anything. Thought about it for a moment then back tracked and dug. Turned out to be a small (about a quarter inch) scotty dog silver charm from a bracelet. Marked .925. why that little piece of silver didn't Id as silver I don't know, but the SOUND was what made me decide to turn back and dig.
BB

 

[UK Brian]

Here's the result of any iffy signal....gold coins that were in a tin that rusted away. The spread in the coins meant the signal was to large to be anything good and target audio was mainly bad. On the other hand it didn't seem right so I returned and dug.

 

[UK Brian]

Just who I got the quote from in my post up the page but the problem is he's in one of the best metal detecting areas in the country thats repeatedly ploughed so its all there on or near the surface. A very large part of the U.K. is pasture and hills/mountains that are rarely if ever ploughed. Finds are few but tend to be in far better condition as they have not been hit by the plough once or twice a year for hundreds of years.

My club gave a copy of his book away as the booby prize when it came out. Weird in places and wrong in many statements. I'm still waiting to see anyone taking up his idea of holding all the excess coil cable in a loop in their hand as they detect as he suggests. Plus if you read his magazine articles one month he's saying he shakes his head in wonder (or was it disbelief ?) seeing people checking targets and the next he's talking about his checking out an iffy signal.

 

[earthmansurfer]

Just who I got the quote from in my post up the page but the problem is he's in one of the best metal detecting areas in the country thats repeatedly ploughed so its all there on or near the surface. A very large part of the U.K. is pasture and hills/mountains that are rarely if ever ploughed. Finds are few but tend to be in far better condition as they have not been hit by the plough once or twice a year for hundreds of years.

My club gave a copy of his book away as the booby prize when it came out. Weird in places and wrong in many statements. I'm still waiting to see anyone taking up his idea of holding all the excess coil cable in a loop in their hand as they detect as he suggests. Plus if you read his magazine articles one month he's saying he shakes his head in wonder (or was it disbelief ?) seeing people checking targets and the next he's talking about his checking out an iffy signal.

Good post Brian and it reminds me of something I read from J. Krishnamurti many times. He said "Find the truth in the false." Even though some people may spout bull-shit they often tell a bit of truth. I have learned a lot from Norfolk Wolfs book, but I don't see him as a God or anything. But, I've gotten lots of true statements from him. He said decide in the first few seconds on a target and that alone has made my ears and focus better. I've probably taken 5 huge points like that from his book. Also, when he talked about masking it made a few things very obvious that I just didn't think about before.

I don't remember reading in his book about holding the coil in your hand. eheheh, maybe that is the old edition? I keep my coil fairly loose though, to protect where it plugs in on My T2 as that area can be problematic I heard.