2 tone ferrous for the SE

[weston]

I have been watching the Etrac forum and have been seeing alot of nice finds being found in the trash with 2 tone ferrous! i have a buddy that uses an Etrac and has recently found some great stuff in "hunted out" spots with TONS OF IRON with 2 tone ferrous! so how do i do it on my SE guys? any input would be great! i really want to try it and make sure im doing it right!

Thanks, Weston

 

[amustel]

Weston, I don't know about the E-Track, however in the Explorers you can get 2 or 3 tones by playing with variability and max limits. I did it once in order to get 3 tones only but then realized that this made not sense at all, or at least it is not recommended unless you have a hearing impairment. Well, it was only my 2 cents, you better wait for the experts since I'm still on the learning curve.

 

[stasys]

in my opinion main idea of ferrous that you can open all screen or hunt without discrimination-what I all the time do and still have hearing... you have very clear borders between good and bad signals and still you can check on screen what is under coil.

 

[Chris(SoCenWI)]

Weston,

I've been watching the 2 tone stuff going on that forum too. It's pretty silly.

I would say about a third to half of the explorer users on this forum use Ferrous sounds with an open screen. We feel that you get a faster/better quality response with very little discrimination, and more information than to have the machine in a continual null. You can not run open screen in conductive because in that mode iron sounds high tone, same as most coins. In ferrous mode iron tone is low while silver/copper is high, with other stuff spread in between.

Look at the link to TDI numbers pinned at the top of the E-trac forum. Jim Upstate NY made the list when the E-trac first came out. Basically he was wondering why they had changed the way the screen works. Pretty much all GOOD targets, AND most JUNK besides iron give a ferrous reading of 12. Which means in ferrous you can't differentiate between any good or junk targets by sound. They are all mapped to 12 and all sound the same. In two-tone low means iron, high means something else. And even out of two tone mode the fact that most of the targets ring in a 12 effectively makes it a two tone machine.

On your SE the values haven't been mapped to a single number so you can hear different sounds for different targets. (Look how the ferrous numbers vary in the charts) You can tell a silver coin from a nickel from a nail. If you want you can do the two-tone thing with your SE, just dig anything that sounds higher than iron. But you don't need to because you get all sorts of additional information by looking at the screen. Why they took away the most powerful advantage of the explorer (the 2-D) screen blows me away. I keep asking what good that did and no one can give a reason.

I also have a F-75 which has a single line TDI. Once stuff gets deep or in junk the numbers bounce around hugely, you pretty much have to dig everything above iron, and many hard core F-75 users hunt exclusively in 2-tone mode. Fine for colonial home sites but a heck of a disadvantage any where there is more junk. Even though it is a faster responding machine than my XS the F-75 tells me so much less about what is in the ground, it pretty much stays at home.

And now some of the E-trac users are finding that they also get a better signal with minimal discrimination and ferrous mode, but because of the changes made to the machine they are forced to use a two-tone system while the previous models did so much more.

Hoping Minelab is going to rectify this on the next model.

Chris

 

[weston]

hmmm i guess it never hurts to try it an fill everyone in! i believe two tone will find stuff hidden in iron that the regular setup wont. i watched a buddy do it with indian head just last week with his Etrac. matter a fact hes a member here and i first hand watched it! i didnt find squat at the place and he came out with a indian head and a V nickel! so it works on the Etrac now what about the SE! just makes me really wonder what im missing. im going to try it and make a video. im going to check targets in 2 tone ferrous and normal settings then dig it up and show you guys what i got. might be a bit for my little expirement to show results! but im determined to prove it!

 

[Chris(SoCenWI)]

Are you saying you checked those targets out with your SE and couldn't get them?

Chris

 

[Goes4ever]

Weston,

I've been watching the 2 tone stuff going on that forum too. It's pretty silly.

Chris

well I guess I am silly then..........but my finds sure speak for themselves! and yes I tried several targets with coin mode and I got NOTHING........just a solid null. I am not talking about places that have a nail here and there. I am talking about places that you get a SOLID null on the etrac. Weston has hunted with me, ask him if he thinks I am silly.

I guess if finding different ways to pull coins from areas where other detectors can't find them is silly, then I am the silliest guy here!

 

[Shambler]

several targets with coin mode and I got NOTHING

Why would you hunt a "mode" at all? That was the point of Chris's post. In heavy iron with an Explorer (NOT an E-Trac - do a search for FE12 on these forums if you want to see the argruments that make us keep our Explorers), ferrous tones and a wide open screen means you hear everything with the left side of the screen (iron) as one low tone, while the right side of the screen is your multiple high tones. All we're doing with the Explorer is creating a quicker response, because, and your post verifies, all of the minelab machines recover from null very slowly.

I can't imagine anyone saying that a wide open screen (NO mode) isn't giving enough information and therefore they must even further reduce that information with less tones...... wah?

 

[Shambler]

Ok - so I got to thinking about this some more and that made me do some research.

The FE12 line would seem to eliminate what we Explorer users know as "Ferrous Sounds", and sure enough, it's now two tone. Yet another reason to scratch your head about Minelab's decisions with the ETrac.


Weston - You can do what he's doing, but you'll have multiple high tones. It's a change of pace, but you can learn it just like you've learned Conductive Sounds.

- Choose Menu - Choose Sounds - Choose Ferrous
- Then click your iron mask button and and turn all of it off (all the way left) so the screen is wide open. Now all iron willl be low tones and all good stuff will be high tones. You'll find the same results as your ETrac friend. Faster recovery from the sound of iron allowing you to pick up the coin nestled in the middle.

 

[Chris(SoCenWI)]

Geos4ever,

No personal dis meant.

The constant nulling is why many hunt ferrous with no/very little discrimination. It appears from what you and others are saying that even with a faster processor in areas of heavy iron trash (almost everywhere!!!) you are still going to be in a constant null with the E-trac also, and hence missing targets. You are essentially running your E-trac the way many of us have run our explorers for years, with good results as you have posted.

My, and Shambler's, and many others, beef with the E-trac is what is the advantage to having a silver dime, a nickel, a pull tab, the Pointer Sisters, and about everything else under the sun have a ferrous value of 12? Why have a ferrous value at all if most targets are mapped to one value? Weston can run his SE in ferrous, most likely pick up the same signals, but will also have much more target information than you will with the E-trac. He can watch his cursor bounce all over the screen and gain a better clue to what is in the ground.

I'm in total agreement with the other changes Minelab made with the E-trac. Many, such as the easier menus or being able to know what the real-time sensitivity value in auto have been requested by users for years and are great improvements. The 12 line mapping was totally out of the blue. Never heard anyone pissed off about the "ferrous s curve". I haven't heard one explanation of why this was done and what possible advantage this has. The answer "Well, this isn't an explorer" just doesn't cut it.

Chris

 

[stasys]

possibly etrac was designed by other people team then explorer and not enough spend time consulting with hard core metal detectorist and explorer users-etrac predecessor.
minelab was needed new product to boost sale and they did it.

 

[Goes4ever]

Goes4ever,

My, and Shambler's, and many others, beef with the E-trac is what is the advantage to having a silver dime, a nickel, a pull tab, the Pointer Sisters, and about everything else under the sun have a ferrous value of 12? Why have a ferrous value at all if most targets are mapped to one value? Weston can run his SE in ferrous, most likely pick up the same signals, but will also have much more target information than you will with the E-trac. He can watch his cursor bounce all over the screen and gain a better clue to what is in the ground.

Chris

what did you mean by the red part? because I do the exact thing all the time with quickmask. I get an iffy signal and sweep the target from different directions and I watch the cursor bounce. If it pegs to botom right corner, I am sure it is iron, if the cursor hits coin area then back to bottom right corner back and forth etc bouncing, I can tell there is a good item with iron in same hole. Is that what you are meaning?

 

[weston]

guys, this doesn't need to become an argument over which you perfer Explorer or Etrac. they are both Fantastic machines! and truthfully my dad used Explorers for years at a local park. he upgraded to the Etrac. went over the same areas and found 4 silver dimes and a silver Washingtons the first day! now, if that's not results from the Etrac, i don't know what is. i love my SE its a fantastic detector and my finds totals have went up since getting it. i have no doubts in it capabilities. all i was asking is how to put the SE in 2 tone ferrous. i didn't want an argument made out of which is better. I'm mean guys we all use Minelabs! the best detectors in the world! whether you use a Explorer or a Etrac we are posting up awesome finds unlike any other forums on here. i think most would agree! so instead of arguing lets rub it in for other brand users and keep posting awesome finds for all to see, proving we have the best detectors in the world!

Take care, Weston

 

[Derrelld]

Well said Weston

 

[Goes4ever]

I agree good post buddy

 

[Shambler]

went over the same areas

Weston, you will go over the same spots with even the same detectors and pull out more coins. It's the nature of the hobby - more or less water, freeze thaw cycle, break down of iron masking, different angles, etc. It just happens. And if you use a different detector (even a non-minelab), your chances go up even more that you'll find something in the "hunted out" park.

 

[captn_se]

Weston,

Technically, you cannot put an SE in 2-tone mode like you can on the E-Trac. There is no 2-tone setting on the Explorer units. Like the others have said, you can put your SE in All-metal (wide open screen, no discrimination) and hunt in Ferrous sounds. Sure you can lower your variability and Limits settings, but it won't be the same as how the E-Trac can do it. Lowering Variability simply makes aluminum foil sound more similar to silver coins while in Conduct and iron sound more similar to foil while in Ferrous.

With the E-Trac, when 2-tone is selected, the machine will only have two unique tones, high and low. The low tone will sound off for all targets with a Ferrous reading of 17 or higher while in Ferrous Sounds(or Conduct reading of 25 or lower while in Conduct sounds), while a high tone will sound off for all targets with a Ferrous reading of less than 17 while in Ferrous sounds (or Conduct reading of higher than 25 while in Conduct sounds).

Hope that made some sense to you.

CAPTN SE
Dan

 

[stasys]

Thanks CAPTN SE! I just from hunting totally exhausted and I had to reed your post at least three times...it was really interesting! now I want to ask you, what etrac missing compare with explorer --or explorer missing compare with etrac- if you hunt with open screen? I just want truth and I don't care if explorer will be defeated! lets strongest will win. thanks

 

[Hotcz70]

which machine is better...which will miss more...or any kind of comparison for that matter.

what etrac missing compare with explorer --or explorer missing compare with etrac- if you hunt with open screen? I just want truth and I don't care if explorer will be defeated! lets strongest will win. thanks

All Weston did was ask a simple question...which I feel Dan answered as perfect as it could have been answered. THANKS Dan

2 tone ferrous! so how do i do it on my SE guys?
Thanks, Weston

Weston,

Technically, you cannot put an SE in 2-tone mode like you can on the E-Trac. There is no 2-tone setting on the Explorer units. Like the others have said, you can put your SE in All-metal (wide open screen, no discrimination) and hunt in Ferrous sounds. Sure you can lower your variability and Limits settings, but it won't be the same as how the E-Trac can do it. Lowering Variability simply makes aluminum foil sound more similar to silver coins while in Conduct and iron sound more similar to foil while in Ferrous.

With the E-Trac, when 2-tone is selected, the machine will only have two unique tones, high and low. The low tone will sound off for all targets with a Ferrous reading of 17 or higher while in Ferrous Sounds(or Conduct reading of 25 or lower while in Conduct sounds), while a high tone will sound off for all targets with a Ferrous reading of less than 17 while in Ferrous sounds (or Conduct reading of higher than 25 while in Conduct sounds).

Hope that made some sense to you.

CAPTN SE
Dan

Westons post was intended to obtain information on how he could set his SE up as he explained....not turn into a debate...argument...or comparison.

Again...this is Weston's post...and Weston I'm sorry it has gotten off topic. I hope you were able to get the information you were looking for....and I appreciate what you responded back with about arguments...etc.

I hope we can all do our best to stay ON topic when responding to threads...as this one is turning into something that it was not intended to be.

Weston should be able to post what question he wants without it turning into a debate...argument...or this machine will do something the other one won't...etc.

Dan...my friend...if you want to respond to this post from stasys...then please feel free to do so. Just didn't want you to be put on the spot and have to come up with "this machine will find more" than this one...etc....unless YOU wanted to be

Just wanted to let everyone know that the post will be closed unless it stays on topic with what Weston originally intended it to be.

Not trying to be a jerk here...just trying to keep the post on topic.

 

[captn_se]

Stasys,

If you hunt with an open screen (no discrimination), either machine will hear the same targets in the ground. That's an easy answer.

It's up to the detectorist to determine whether he/she wants to dig the target that the machine is 'beeping' on. Some can hear more desirable beeps amongst the undesirable beeps. It's what's between your ears that will make you a more successful hunter with any Minelab or any other brand of detector.

HH,
CAPTN SE
Dan