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Advice Please

Oh like

1. coins targets ring twice but others ring only once. Some targets ring in only when passing over right to left? This is why???

2. Some targets won't seem to lock in and change numbers?

3. There seems to be a second id for targets that appears when I wait a few seconds. Usually this is the coin id and is associated with the high tone I am hearing? Sometimes I hear a high tone but never see the numbers and dig anyway finding a coin? Why?

4. someone mentioned pinpointing with the coil on edge?? This does not seem to work for me.

Joe. please explain?
 
I've read through every post here and a lot of people have given you some great advice and very specific steps and settings. You keep saying "Yeah, I did some of that..." Well you can't do SOME of it because a lot of what you've been told goes together and you have to do all of it. SOME of it without the OTHER of it MIGHT make it worse.

Second, KellyCo didn't "save a bunch of money" on the batteries. Those are the batteries Minelab puts in the battery pack now. Apparently they believe that is sufficient. If it's only holding a charge for 3 hours and you are charging it for the full time specified in the book, then it's bad. So exercise your warranty and get a new one. How long have you had it? If there was a problem with it when you got it you should have told KellyCo right away. They will almost always take care of those kinds of things without making you go through Minelab.

If you want to try something that works very well, try reading the info in the link below and set your machine like that. I set mine that way and haven't changed it since. And I get a hell of a lot more that 3 inches with it. Keep in mind, if your battery is very weak, that could be your depth problem. As somebody else said, use fresh brand name alkalines until you get a new rechargeable pack.

Here is the setup I use:

http://mikesweather.metsite.com/detectin/html/charles_rock_solid_setup.html

This is the main page of the site that came from. There's a LOT of good stuff there. I suggest you spend some time reading it.

http://mikesweather.metsite.com/detectin/html/explorer_xs___explorer_ii.html

This may have some stuff of interest too:

http://usetheminelabexplorerlikeapro.blogspot.com/2005/08/chapter-7-selective-discrimination-for.html
 
The Explorer XS II now come with a charger and 8 of the Vanson 1600Mha batteries right from the factory. These are 1.2 volts apiece for a total of 9.6 volts which will run the Explorer just fine. Now you know these batteries have to be put on the charger for a good 14 hours before they are fully charged. Now if you have done this and it will only go for 3 hours and the low battery alert comes on you have either something wrong with the charger or the batteries, if the gauge show 1/2 so it is OK as some gauges seem to go to 1/2 and stay that way for a long time. Mine will show full when I first charge the battery, but when i leave it sit over nite it may show 3/4 when I use it.. Minelab uses the Alkaline battery packs also which says 1.5 volts but this pack is also used for the rechargeable and the Explorer don't need the 12 volts to run as the Explorer uses a voltage limiter reduce the 12 volts of 8 alkaline to a lower voltage.
Now for the numbers on the screen for IDing not being correct is because the tone is what you go by as the number are for the last target the Explorer sees, so if it see trash item after you hear the tone of a good target it will show the trash numbers. The numbers also do not reset when you are going over the target, but when the threshold returns. What we are seeing and hearing are 2 different things. What we have to do is get a good tone we think is good target and lift the coil up off the target area before it sees another target that way the number will go to the correct ID when the threshold returns.If there is no other target beside a good one the number can be correct when you are going over the target. If you have the sensitivity too high and it is not stable than the number will be bouncing all over and you also will not get a correct ID.
The main thing with the Explorer is to learn it before you will be good with it and the best way is to just use it at one setting and get the tones, check the numbers several times and dig some targets and soon you will know which tones and which number are the good ones.
 
Lighten up guy.

No I am not going to do everything exactly as others say. I plan to learn as I go and adopt for my own hunting only what works for the sites I work on and for me.

Yes KCo does sell some cheap stuff. I got three of those black pin pointers they offer as extras before I got one that worked. And on the third replacement I took it apart and fixed the problem myself.

As for the batteries do you even know what kind of batteries they sent to me? But you know they are the right ones? Maybe I do have a defective battery? I will check it out.

Thanks.

Joe.
 
Thanks Rick:

That was good advice. I have done the 3 hour thing with the Vanson batteries three times now and each time they lasted around 3 hours. So maybe I do have a bad battery or else the charger is messed up. I charge them over night so they have a full charge. The detector shuts down when they start to drain below 1/2. The first time I used them the detector kept shutting off. I'll use my tester on them and see how they are doing.

The other advice is good too. I am learning to pay attention to the tones most of all. The fact that there are several targets in a small area makes it difficult. Do you think the detector shows a display for the last target it saw or just the strongest target in the area? Some how the coin usually shows up after the threshold returns. Perhaps the detector shows the first target it Ids and not the last and then after the threshold returns it shows other important targets it saw?

Thanks Again.

Joe.
 
Well, you don't seem to need any advice. You seem like you have all the answers.

Yes, I do know what kind of batteries they sent you. I have the same battery pack that came with my Explorer II. It was a recent change Minelab made in their rechargeable battery pack. And if you are charging it and it lasts only 3 hours, there's no "maybe" about it...you have a bad battery. I never said anything about KellyCo not selling cheap stuff. I said KellyCo didn't make any money selling you a cheap battery pack. The battery pack is what comes from Minelab. KellyCo just sells it. You didn't say how long you've had it or if it's still under warranty so maybe it's just old age.

I didn't say you should do everything everybody says. But when somebody gives you a complete setup to try and you say "I did some of that" my point is that a set of settings is often intended to be used together, not partially.

You say you are going to do what works for you...that's fine and dandy. From the sound of how you describe your unit's performance at the present, it is nearly completely dysfunctional. It also doesn't sound like there's anything wrong with the machine. Constant nulling is a problem in iron-rick soil and trashy areas if you use too much discrimination. I gave you a setup that works for me but I can't make you try it. What that program will do is do away with your nulling problem, give you great depth, and better enable you to work in the conditions you describe. You will have to sort out a lot of tones, but in going by the tones and digital readings, you should be able to determine some good targets out of it. Good luck.
 
Hey Mike:

It sounds like you are looking for someone to give a hard time. Please find someone else to bug. You are right I don't need your kind of help but I do appreciate the others who gave good advice and I will benefit from it.

For your info I have detected since 1982 but I don't know everything which is why I ask questions. People who know everything stop learning.

I often find the people who complain the most know the least. Complaining and whining is what they do best.

Have a good day Mike.

Joe. lol.
 
Cachenut I'd reccomend the X-1 Probe, it will aid you greatly, but I'd reccomend you'd send your detector to Minelab first and your rechargeable battery pack with an explanation of what's been going on, I believe it won't take more than a week for them to get it, repair it (if there is actually something wrong) and return it to you, if they say nothing is wrong then you know it might just be the settings, or the targets aren't more than 3" deep where you hunt, won't you feel better to know if there is a problem or not? They will include a rechargeable battery pack (new) I believe, so you lose nothing sending it, maybe it's just a bad connection, who knows.

Also set Recovery = Fast Off, Deep On. It might help.
 
Whatever dude. If you go back and read my original post you will see two things:

1) I didn't tell you anything that wasn't true.

2) I gave you some very good links to some very good settings that worked very well for me.

You are the one who copped an attitiude and told me to lighten up. All I did was try to help you out. So you can take my advice or leave it. It's worth at least what you paid for it. :shrug:
 
Wouldn't bother me. I didn't mean to offend him and I would be willing to forgive him.

Honestly, you know I'm a decent guy most of the time Dave. If I can help, I help. But I'm not one for blowing sunshine up somebody's butt. Well, maybe now and then...if they post some cool stuff. But mostly I tell them what they NEED to hear, not what they WANT to hear.

If he comes to Virginia Beach I'll be happy to show him everything I know about the Explorer II. Which is a good bit, but not as much as it will be after this winter. I've been doing the beach thing all summer with my Excalibur, so I've only been out with the Explorer maybe 20 times or so. Did real well with it though.

I don't think I want to go to Winchester though...sounds like they have some HORRIBLE ground out there. Probably loaded with that iron-rich orange soil. :thumbdown:
 
If it is shutting down when the battery gauge shows half full you may have a bad battery in the pack. If you have a battery tester, not a multi meter I would test them right after it shuts down to see if one of the batteries is bad as this is what will happen if one battery is bad. Now if they all show about the same and high charge I would say you pack is not making a good connection in the Explorer. Now after 3 hours and the batteries all show weak then I would say your charger is not working correctly. You can also run 8 alkaline batteries in the pack and see what happens.
On target close together you may be hearing one tone of a good target and as I said before until the threshold comes back the number will not be the correct ones. Now if there was a item that was disc out right beside the target you were hearing with the tone you would not hear the signal of the other target, but the numbers will be that of the second item as it was the last item seen by the coil. We see this a lot when we get a good tone and while working over the target before the threshold returns the numbers may show trash item, when we stop so the threshold returns the numbers may show a different trash target, but we know the tones is not that of what the numbers say. What has happened now is it had seen a trash target and the threshold never returned before it seen a good target which we hear by the tone, but the meter is showing the trash target as the threshold has never returned. Now if the last swing before you lift the coil it seen the good target which we heard but then seen a trash target which we did not hear the number will still not be the correct one. When we hear a good tone we know where the number should be, if not we recheck or come at it from a different angle so it don't see the trash target and get the correct ID. This is why we say go by the tones more than what the meter says as the tones is the ID of the target while the meter gives you the reading of the last item it see. This is why you are seeing the correct ID when the threshold returns, but not while you are hearing the good tone of a good target.
It takes time to get used to the Explorer for some while some know it right away and some never get used to it.Have a little patience and I think you will do well.

Rick
 
I think I understand what you are saying. I do need to work on getting the right numbers on the meter at some point. From what you said I need to move off to the side and let the threshold return and then go right to the target. Then the numbers should be right.

I still wonder how to get the ground balance to stay fixed. The detector seems to lose its threshold too easily. If I can get flat on the ground and keep it there then I keep the threshold. Move one end of the coil up and I lose it. I hunt in the woods with sticker bushes and such. Also too many targets in the park mess it up. I have more than one target every three seconds so it always seems to be busy.

I listen for the right tones and then check them out.

Joe.
 
Joe there's a lot to digest here but I hope some of this helps.

1 - Three inches is pitiful depth the Explorer will go much deeper. Our ground is dry right now but we are still digging indian cents 6-7 inches deep. I dug an 1873 close to 9 inches deep with the stock coil last weekend and the ground was bone dry all the way down. Not the best signal but it was definately diggable. Step one, make sure there is nothing wrong with the machine by doing some air tests with various sized coins and report your findings back to the forum. The detection field extends several feet so don't place the coins on the ground, its best to aim the coil at the horizon to eliminate the ground matrix during air tests and wave the coins under the coil. The Explorer does not air test that well because it uses to ground matrix to improve depth but you should still be able to get 5-7 inches on most coins in an air test. When the threshold disappears the machine is over a target you have discriminated out, iron/trash etc. That is normal. Don't worry about the ground balance, its automated and adjusts itself as you go. Its also quite good at doing what it does. What you should do is set your iron mask to -16 e.g. nothing discriminated out e.g. all metal including iron. Hunt in smartfind with your discrimination pattern and when you get wondering why the threshold has vanished on you, switch to iron mask, with nothing discriminated out you will be able to hear all the trash targets. ALSO if you are running a LOT of discrimination it may be masking a machine that is actually setup unstable. Underground power lines for example will make the Explorer false like crazy but with a ton of discrimination it doesn't sound bad because most of the falsing is hitting in the discriminated area. So again switch to your iron mask mode with iron mask at -16 to tune your machine sensitivity, gain, etc. If she's running stable your good to go.

To improve depth the first and best thing you can do is SLOW down your sweep speed. The field Ed and I dug all these recent coins out of is infested with modern trash and 150 years worth of rusty nails, big ugly ones. I made 2-3 medium speed passes over this field and found nothing, then I went into slow to a crawl mode and the deep coins starting popping out all over the place. Next I like Deep ON Fast OFF with my gain at 7. Its easier to hear the deep targets verses the shallow ones that way. Deep targets 6+ inches sound larger as you sweep across them, say 4-6 across versus shallow targets 2-5 inches which sound about 2-3 inches wide. Deeper targets also sound more flutey like multiple notes on a flute or an old style bycycle bell. The deeper the coin, the more fluty it gets. Surface clad and trash can polute a large area around the target, either dig it out of the way to move on. Once you get your ear trained for that deep coin sound, keep an ear peeled for the classic double signal. You'll make a sweep, it will sound almost like a single target but you hear that deep coin type signal mixed in. You check again and find a shallow target nearby. Shallow targets don't give off deep coin signals so there are VERY good odds there is a deep coin hiding near the shallow target. I dig the shallow target out of the way and probably hit a deep coin 80% of the time. Step one of course, learn what deep coins sound like. Now if you turn Fast ON...all bets are off, it makes deep coins sound more like shallow ones e.g. I find it tougher to hunt deep coins that way. Reduce the amount of discrimination you are running to improve depth. Try this, edit your smartfind screen to black out the entire bottom 1/3rd of the screen. That will get rid of 80% of the trash targets leaving mostly coins and iron. Now set your tones to Ferrous, that will make iron sound low, coins high. Now go dig some coins. Once you learn what deep coins sound like you can gradually open up the bottom of the screen. About the only thing I discriminate out these days is rusty bottle caps, the rest of my screen is wide open. While you are learning when you think you found a deep coin, switch to your iron mask screen set to -16 and sweep the target again from a few angles. Thats good practice, with nothing discriminated out you will notice how much better the signal can be on a good target. Plus its easier to pinpoint in iron mask at -16. Finally, THE best depth tip anyone ever gave me was to go out and dig every non-iron signal at a given depth or deeper. Say 6+ inches. If you are finding modern trash at 6, dig targets at 8+. Using the depth meter and ignoring the target ID did wonders for me. I tell you coins can and do ID WAY off the textbook mark when they get deep. They can sound pretty crappy also. If you are waiting for a textbook type ID on a deep coin you may be in for a long wait. The machine is accurate in our ground to about 5 inches, often its good to 6 inches, but if you are talking an indian head at 8+ inches I have seen them ID all over the screen from iron high left to half way down the screen right. What gets our attention around here is that coin like behavior, a wider signal, fluty, couple that with the right depth and we dig even if the tones and ID are off.

2 - Call Kellyco, they should last longer than 3 hours in my book but its their product.

3 - Most of my settings are above, I adjust my sens for a reasonably stable operation not squeaky clean stable. I like a minimum sens of 24 and will go up to 28 conditions permitting.

4 - Hey digital is fine for shallow coins but if you want to troll for deep old coins put all thoughts of using digital mode out of your mind. The ID varies too much on deep coins for digital mode, the numbers will bounce all over the place unless your soil is mineral and trash free. Take deeper nickels for example, those damn things will bounce left and right about an inch across the screen. Just watch the cursor instead, its easier to learn the bounce patterns than looking at a bunch of numbers changing. The cursor may be bouncing left and right, even up and down but silver bounces different than indian heads, and indian heads different than say wheats. Nails trying to false have their own bounce pattern also. Ed is the nickel king around here but I look for the right height vertically, if its in the nickel zone height wise on the screen and bouncing left and right, plus sounds a bit larger/wider like a coin I'll dig it. Theres lots of beaver tales right in the nickel zone but they sound flatter and shorter as you sweep across them. Tech note, if you have rusty bottle caps disc'd out as I often do, if I think I'm onto a nickel I switch to iron mask -16 because nickels can bounce over into the rusty bottle cap zone whey they get corroded.

And before you get cussing the digital mode as useless like I did...understand that if you pass the other top brand detector over some of these deep coins the Explorer finds, while the signal may not be the best on the Explorer the other brand detector gets no signal at all or at best ID's the coin as iron. If you want to go deep you have to rely more on how the target sounds and less on the screen target ID.

Charles
 
The Explorer isn't an easy machine to pick up and just start hunting with.If someone is use to a beep beep machine,they're gonna struggle.It's best he finds someone near him or a local dealer to help him get started.Dave
 
You know,if there's that much trash there and that many old coins below it,you should start taking the tarsh out.Pick one section where the old coins are most plentiful and start sanatizing the spot.Set a goal.like maybe a 20 foot square section a day.IT WILL PAY OFF.A pull tab at an inch will mask a dime at 10" directly under it.Dave
 
Absolutely. Although, the link I gave him to "Charle's Rock Solid Setup" would solve a number of his problems...particularly the nulling and the depth. And he would get intimately familiar with the tones.

I would consider that program to be as good for the Explorer as the infamous "Dave Z" program for the DFX was/is. :)
 
Hey Dave,

This is W park and your right theres a bunch hiding under that trash. I'm going to try a concentric coil next, its too dry to dig the trash right now.

That other park we hunted seems picked clean...ahem maybe the 15 inch WOT coil was too much for it! lol There's some good finds under the trash over there also but W has older coins in much better condition.
 
The area near where you park is where Ed said found a lot of nice coins.But the trash was so thick,I couldn't hunt it with the stock coil.Had to be between 10-20 targets per swing.I imagine that area would take quite a while to sanatize,BUT trash is also a good thing in a park like that.You KNOW that there's old coins in nice shape there,you don't mind working a little harder.Dave
 
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