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BBS 800 Coil Verses Slimline Tornado 7 1/4 inch.

Ron from Michigan

Moderator
Staff member
This forum and other sites have helped me understand and become a decent Sovereign user.One of my big disagreement though has been the performance of the BBS 800 coil.I have always felt this coil got a bad rap as being lame.Last summer I recovered many silver coins from a park where I hunted with both the Explorer and the Sovereign with other coils that I missed.Like most of you I buy and sell detectors to support the hobby.I have used the small Tornado coil in the past and suspected the weight and performance very close.The other day I bought another Sovereign that came with the Slimline coil. Side by side comparison with an air test showed identical depth.Weight is the same and the scuff covers are interchangeable.My guess the only difference with these two coils are the stickers.Any Minelab factory people to back up my observation.Thanks Ron
 
Ron sounds like youve got the same coil with different stickers. the older "bbs" coil is noticably thicker and heavier. coil performance can vary I have found and I found the tornado coil a bit more sensitive than the older bbs. also I think on the 10" tornado coil they moved the ears a little closer to the center of the coil for balance.
you might try looking at them both with the coil covers off and then you should see the difference.
actually I didnt know the bbs coils were labeled as lame, just heavy.
for some reason minelab makes there equipment real beefy, would be nice to see one of the sov coils from them as light and thin as say a shadow coil:thumbup:
 
Neil,the older BBS 800 coil and the Slim line are the same deminsions.Check the metal detector store ads where these coils are sold.The 1000 BBS and 10 inch Tornado Slimline are very different. HH Ron
 
Hey Ron you got both of them I see, I was going by memory on the smaller bbs so my mistake. I would have bet both tornado coils were lighter and thinner.
the only small one I have now is the small tornado on my excal and I have a larger tornado set aside in case I want to have that installed.
Thanks for clearing that up!
Neil
 
Neil,I bet the specs are same for these coils except the labels.If I'm right the little BBS 800 is the best bang for the buck.I was hitting silver dimes at nine inches last season.LOL right in front of us Clark Kent and Superman.HH Ron
 
Ron
I agree with you on the coil issue.
The issue I have is that the 550 meter gets a bum rap as well.It has a higher resolution which means it can give you a closer ID, example I can tell the differance between a nickle and modern pull tab and older pull tabs are very easy to identify. These IDs can be done at several plus inches just as the coin IDs. The 550 will jump around but that is due to the higher resolution, when you come over targets the jumping around comes to a craw and most of the time stops. But that is me.
 
Prudent,I favor the 180 for me its more simple.There have been others like yourself that swear by the 550.The higher resolution meter would make a logical hypothesis that this would enable better separation of targets.The point is that we sometimes let the facts get in our way.
 
Ron from Michigan said:
Prudent,I favor the 180 for me its more simple.There have been others like yourself that swear by the 550.The higher resolution meter would make a logical hypothesis that this would enable better separation of targets.The point is that we sometimes let the facts get in our way.

good point. with ground conditions and other targets in the mix, getting close to the correct ID is good enough for me. Ive found you pretty much have to isolate a target completely for a textbook ID or real close anyways. Dug enough zinc and below readings and came up with silver that made me see it that way.
 
Glad I saw this thread! I have been lamenting the fact that I just sold my 10" Tornado and bought a 13" Ultimate. I also bought a Sun Ray 5" Intruder and the last on my list was the 8" Tornado. All I have found are with a used detector that is way overpriced. I bought a decent XS2 setup on ebay and am waiting for it, it has the small Seasearch coil and the 800 BBS coil. Then I saw this thread...guess I don't need to look for the Tornado 8 inch! I have it's Clark Kent twin!

Ron hope you like the drawing I did for your meter!:clapping:
 
Sovereign, first...That seasearch coil is an awesome coil from what I hear. Very stable. Many guys loved it so much they cut them off Excals and used it on their Sovereigns. You can cut off the fins to save more weight too. Check the Coil sticky first page for info on it.

I think Ron *might* have been mistaken on the BBS/Tornado 8" thing. Yep, that pic sure does look like the BBS and Tornado 8" coils are the same coil, but what I suspect is that Minelab was throwing the old BBS stickers on the first productions of the new 8" Tornado until they used up that stock of stickers, and then they converted to the Tornado sticker. Reason being? I've held the old 8" (it and the Tornado are actually 7 & 1/4" in size, which is why they are said to be fantastic in heavy trash, and still get outstanding depth...I've read of coins a foot deep)...Anyway, I've held the old 8" Tornado in my hand to repair one, and I can tell you it's a frick'n boat anchor. Everybody says the Tornado 8", just like the 10" Tornado, are so much lighter and better performers than the old BBS versions. Ron says both of his coils were similar in weight, so I suspect he got an "odd" newer Tornado when Minelab was making the transition and was still throwing left over BBS sticker stock on them.

But I'll say this- I've read some say the old BBS 8" coil was a much better coil than the 10" BBS coil, and was actually deeper for people. So I ain't saying it's a bad coil. I've seen it do some damage water hunting on an Excal, but just the same I'd opt for the 8" Tornado myself, as it's said by many people to be a better all around coil, not to mention a lot lighter.

Wpruden, the 180 meter will easily tell nickels from tabs. Nickels range around 143 to 146 usually, some as low as about 136 or so, but tabs start at about 148 or 149 and go up to 169 99.9% of the time. Never owned a detector that could distinctly ID nickels from tabs like this, and the audio is also very telling for nickels. I'm not even aware of any machine thus far that has as high of resolution from foil to copper penny as the 180 meter on the Sovereign in terms of conductivity resolution. It can be deadly for avoiding trash while hunting rings or such.

Far as coins above copper penny, I only care to know it's a coin because if it's deep or it's shallow but in trash I'm digging it no matter what kind of coin the machine thinks it is. The conductivity between various coins above zincs is so close that any one can read like another due to minerals, being on edge, masking, etc. I've dug a ton of silver dimes in the past that a machine told me were copper pennies or even zincs. I never trust that when old coin hunting. Only thing I want to avoid is zincs when in the mood, and I can do that.

Also, I've noticed...You can often tell what kind of coin by how fast the meter gets to 180. Copper pennies will climb...177,178,179,then finally hit 180 if you watch the meter when first wiggling over it. If you missed it move the coil away and make the meter reset so it's not 180, and then move back and wiggle. You'll see the steady climb. Clad dimes hit 180 sooner. Quarters even faster if not instant, and silver dimes or quarters usually will go 180 the fastest. Like bang- 180 right off. The silver WL quarter I dug a few months back was an instant 180 with no climb that I ever saw. It was instantly "180" when I first hit it, and didn't fight me to do that. Of course deeper silvers are going to climb slower maybe in some situations, but then you judge- how deep does this coin sound? And how hard is it to get to 180? All coins will get equally slower in that climb at depths, so you can adjust the "how fast is it climbing" scale in your head based on depth and figure out still what it might be. Often silver will still bang 180 pretty instantly at depth, but not always. My experience so far anyway...
 
interesting topic.... i could never figure out why my 10 inch coil on the excal feels twice as heavy as the 10 inch coil on my gt... thought it was just my imagination.....
 
By looking at the picture of the coils they do look the same, but know they are actually different and the coil covers were different too.
I started with the XS Sovereign with the 8 inch coinsearch coil, then got the XS2 with the new BBS 10 coil and notice the XS with the 8 inch coinsearch I sold to my hunting partner seem to do better than I could with the XS2 and the 10 inch BBS and when comparing signals we seen the 8 inch coinsearch could go deeper and ID better, so I found a used 8 inch coinsearch and put on my XS2 and it did a lot better. I tried the 8 inch BBS coils too, but the 8 inch coinsearch seem to do better for me, but wasn't waterproof like the BBS 8 was, so I got a S-8 of Sun Rays and that did great. I bought a 8 inch Tornado coil from Neil, but never got a chance to use it when I had a guy wanting to buy it, but been told it works as good as the 8 inch Coinsearch if not a little better and is waterproof. I never was a fan of the 8 or 10 inch BBS coils.

Rick
 
To me this topic is subjective. Which is better, more sensitive, goes deeper and so forth.

How can that be proven?

I favor the lighter Tornado, for that reason alone and I have both. Until someone can show by Empirical Method one way or the other, it will remain opinion and nothing more.
 
Critterhunter said:
I've held the old 8" (it and the Tornado are actually 7 & 1/4" in size, which is why they are said to be fantastic in heavy trash, and still get outstanding depth...I've read of coins a foot deep)...Anyway, I've held the old 8" Tornado in my hand to repair one, and I can tell you it's a frick'n boat anchor.

Meant to say I've held the 8" BBS coil in my hand repairing one for a friend and it's a hefty coil. Couldn't get over how heavy it was. Like holding a brick, and I mean that. The newer Tornado version is a great deal lighter, so I suspect Ron had an odd early run of a Tornado that they were still throwing the old BBS stickers on. His post is a few years old, so I suspect he's well aware of the differences in the BBS and Tornados now, as he sure knows a ton about the Sovereigns having owned them for years.

I'm trying to trade my $200 S-5 for a 8" Tornado, or for an Ultimate, so if anybody has one to trade check my post in the classifieds. I'll even swap for a non-working 8" Tornado or a Ultimate that aint working, so long as I can pin down that it's a short in the coil cable and not an internal problem with it. That's how I got my 12x10. It wasn't working so I traded my 15x12 for it along with the person kicking me $50 for the trade since I would have to fix the 12x10. Worked out well for both of us. I've got a line on a few S-12s with bad coil cables from the same person so sooner or later I may buy those off them to fix and compare to my 12x10, although I've got somebody right now who wants to loan me a S-12 to compare and contrast to me 12x10 and the Ultimate as soon as I'm done with putting the Ultimate through it's paces.
 
Would be nice to see someone weigh these side by side , the new-newer:laugh: 8" Tornado and the old older 8" BBS. I have the S-5 and the Ultimate...and I think I will be fine with the Seasearch and BBS 8". Now I need to start moding old Sov meters...or maybe I'll leave them at the 550 scale...
 
If you look on I think the last page of the meter sticky you'll find a video where a guy changes the scaling of the 550 Minelab meters to the 180 scale most people seem to like better. It only involves changing a few resistors and a POT, which can be bought at just about any electronics supply store. I'm pretty sure the guy mentions what K the resistors/pots need to be, and also he shows how to take the meter apart. Good stuff.
 
Can't comment on which is better or deeper, the BBS on a excal and the tornado is on a GT. I do like the BBS as it has done a fine job, maybe even better than the 10" excal II. The weight differences is 3.6 Oz's between the 8" BBS and the Tornado as best I can tell, with the Tornado at 13.0 Oz's. and the BBS at 16.6 Oz's. Just my 2 cents.
 
The meter mod is not hard to do if you know how to solder. The resistors are 1% precision where as all the electronic store around here had 5% so I had to order in all the actual parts from Australia myself and ordered many extras as the price was right, but shipping was higher than normal. If anyone wants to do the conversion and cant find the 1% resistors or the 1K pot I do have many extras to help those out that want to do the conversion.

Rick
 
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