CZ-70 Pro Disappointment & Wonder

[Altamaha]

I have been interested in getting a CZ-70 Pro to join my two hot CZ-3Ds and was able to acquire a very nice (minty) 11292*** serial numbered one recently at a reasonable price. This one was sent to Fisher Labs about 6 months ago and came with the repair paper work showing that Fisher tested and re- calibrated it. Really nice detector, only thing is that upon air testing I can only get about 7 &1/2 to 8 inched tops on a clad dime. This is very disappointing and makes one wonder about Fisher's (First Texas) calibration procedure/process for CZs. Just wonder what the performance was before Fisher touched/re-calibrated it, especially since the 11292*** serial numbered ones are suppose to be better. Has anyone on here had any experience with Fisher calibrating their CZs? Too bad that Tom D doesn't work on/calibrate the CZ-70 Pros :- (.


Thanks & HH

 

[trojdor]

Altamaha,
I recently had an almost opposite, but still disappointing experience with a CZ-70 pro.
Mine was also an 11292 serial, but it was quite sensitive...similar to my CZ-3D.
The problem with it, though, was that all the ID ranges were all off by quite a bit.
I considered sending it in to FT, but have heard bad things, so returned it to dealer.

It also had the typical CZ-70 pro assembly faults no one talks about...the case doesn't quite close up all the way (leaves a gap, usually on left side) due to a tolerance stack error, and the face panel label was peeling near the phone jack.
I've seen that to be quite typical of the 70's from that production run.

Unimpressed.

I suspect you'll also be annoyed by the various delays when pinpointing or changing modes...delays that aren't there in your 3d's.

Good Luck, and HH

mike

 

[HaroldILL.]

Just curious as to where you are running your sens. at on these air tests 4 or 6 as some can be run at 6 some not? Also are you running 0 disc. And where are you setting volume and ground at also?

 

[Nailed-it]

All cz's prior to the cz3d were made in los banos. However the cz3d's were, are made in both factories. With the Los banos factory now defunct and strict calibration methods being abolished. Hence performance standards being compromised. 1021 and early 1022 cz3d models ate highly sought after due to their better air test values as well in "real world" performance.

 

[Dan-Pa.]

One wonders about new or old calibration standards as Harold is sure right as owned both older models and one could be run at six while other 4 was tops rel sens. while keeping a stable unit.....

 

[Altamaha]

Just curious as to where you are running your sens. at on these air tests 4 or 6 as some can be run at 6 some not? Also are you running 0 disc. And where are you setting volume and ground at also?

Hi Harold;

I initially used settings recommended by Tom D on his forum as follows:

- For air testing, setup outside about 4 ft above the ground, away from any metal & in an area with low emi

- Sensitivity = 6 (runs smooth & stable), also no problem running at 6 in park/real world

- Mode = Normal

- Disc = 0 (no not notching)

- GB = 5, per Tom D, also tried GB = 0 & 10, no change

- Vol = 10

- Also tried a different coil, no change


Thanks & HH,

 

[Altamaha]

Hi all, I think this post by Dave Johnson (on another forum) puts things in perspective regarding CZ tuning by Tom D vs FTP

Re - CZ 3D Calibration

"Tom Dankowski's a good guy (my personal opinion), but he speaks for himself, not for the factory.

If someone wants a CZ tuned up the way Tom thinks they should be tuned, Tom's the guy who does that, not the factory. If someone wants a CZ tuned to factory spex, the factory does that.

I'm not interested in getting into a debate over which way is "better", or even what the differences are since the factory has no control over how Tom tunes machines up, nor does Tom have any control over how the factory does it. Both ways "work".

A few years ago before Fisher in California was put on the auction block, the original CZ tweak procedures produced by engineering dept. (that's me) were abandoned in favor of an easier procedure which however did not produce results comparable to the original procedure. (This is the "Old Fisher" I'm talking about which so many people mistakenly venerate.) After the manufacturing operation was moved to El Paso, we discovered that the procedures being used were not the original procedures I'd specified. We rewrote the procedures to conform to the original procedures insofar as practical, in light of stuff we knew now that wasn't known then, as well as accommodating a different manufacturing environment. Nowadays there's a lot less difference between a "Tom tweak" and a factory tweak than there used to be.

* * * * * * *

Figured I better post this, because the "Tom versus the factory" thing crops up occasionally on forums and gets overblown and misunderstood. Since Tom is not an employee of the factory I can't officially endorse him, but I can report what I read on the forums, which is that he has a good reputation. (And I've had enough contact with him to respect him personally.) If you want a Tom tweak, Tom's the guy to talk to, please don't bug the factory about it. If you want to have a CZ recalibrated by the factory, that gets done at the factory, but it doesn't have anything to do with Tom."

Dave Johnson
Chief Designer, FTP-Fisher

My experience with my FTP tuned CZ 70 Pro with regards to its' depth performance (8 inches on a clad dime), makes me wonder what the "Factory Specs" are?

 

[HaroldILL.]

Just curious as to where you are running your sens. at on these air tests 4 or 6 as some can be run at 6 some not? Also are you running 0 disc. And where are you setting volume and ground at also?

Hi Harold;

I initially used settings recommended by Tom D on his forum as follows:

- For air testing, setup outside about 4 ft above the ground, away from any metal & in an area with low emi

- Sensitivity = 6 (runs smooth & stable), also no problem running at 6 in park/real world

- Mode = Normal

- Disc = 0 (no not notching)

- GB = 5, per Tom D, also tried GB = 0 & 10, no change

- Vol = 10

- Also tried a different coil, no change


Thanks & HH,

WOW! If you are running at 6 Sens, and 0 Disc. with the other settings you are using for volume and ground you should at the very least be getting 10'' on a dime in air. Man that sucks dude!

 

[ryaan21]

I have a CZ70 Pro and can run it at 8 and 10 sens with no problems in 99% of the areas that I hunt. The only place I had trouble was on the shore of Lake Superior, dry sand and up into the woods bordering the lake. I think it was black sand or something. But other than that it hits coins deep. Air tests deep as well even with the 5 inch coil on it. And it is the supposed shallower serial number.

With the stock coil I pulled silver dimes and a silver ring all from 10+ inches. When I first got it I wanted to send it in for a checkup, but I think I will just leave it alone.

 

[HaroldILL.]

I have a CZ70 Pro and can run it at 8 and 10 sens with no problems in 99% of the areas that I hunt. The only place I had trouble was on the shore of Lake Superior, dry sand and up into the woods bordering the lake. I think it was black sand or something. But other than that it hits coins deep. Air tests deep as well even with the 5 inch coil on it. And it is the supposed shallower serial number.

With the stock coil I pulled silver dimes and a silver ring all from 10+ inches. When I first got it I wanted to send it in for a checkup, but I think I will just leave it alone.

I wouldn't touch it! That is one of the hot CZ-70 Pro's!

 

[ryaan21]

Haha I was actually going to sell it because while it is super deep, it struggles in iron. I was told a smaller coil would help so I bought one last month so I am waiting somewhat patiently for spring to get here to try it out really good.

 

[Nailed-it]

Hi all, I think this post by Dave Johnson (on another forum) puts things in perspective regarding CZ tuning by Tom D vs FTP

Re - CZ 3D Calibration

"Tom Dankowski's a good guy (my personal opinion), but he speaks for himself, not for the factory.

If someone wants a CZ tuned up the way Tom thinks they should be tuned, Tom's the guy who does that, not the factory. If someone wants a CZ tuned to factory spex, the factory does that.

I'm not interested in getting into a debate over which way is "better", or even what the differences are since the factory has no control over how Tom tunes machines up, nor does Tom have any control over how the factory does it. Both ways "work".

A few years ago before Fisher in California was put on the auction block, the original CZ tweak procedures produced by engineering dept. (that's me) were abandoned in favor of an easier procedure which however did not produce results comparable to the original procedure. (This is the "Old Fisher" I'm talking about which so many people mistakenly venerate.) After the manufacturing operation was moved to El Paso, we discovered that the procedures being used were not the original procedures I'd specified. We rewrote the procedures to conform to the original procedures insofar as practical, in light of stuff we knew now that wasn't known then, as well as accommodating a different manufacturing environment. Nowadays there's a lot less difference between a "Tom tweak" and a factory tweak than there used to be.

* * * * * * *

Figured I better post this, because the "Tom versus the factory" thing crops up occasionally on forums and gets overblown and misunderstood. Since Tom is not an employee of the factory I can't officially endorse him, but I can report what I read on the forums, which is that he has a good reputation. (And I've had enough contact with him to respect him personally.) If you want a Tom tweak, Tom's the guy to talk to, please don't bug the factory about it. If you want to have a CZ recalibrated by the factory, that gets done at the factory, but it doesn't have anything to do with Tom."

Dave Johnson
Chief Designer, FTP-Fisher

My experience with my FTP tuned CZ 70 Pro with regards to its' depth performance (8 inches on a clad dime), makes me wonder what the "Factory Specs" are?

Wow I have read this before. And I have respect for both involved, but there is a reason why tom tuned cz's are sought after and what early cz3zds are sought after. Both have greater depth capabilities. I have a cz3d that I bought 2 years ago that air tests 8" . needless to day I bought an etrac 2 months later. I recently bought a tom tuned cz3d certified at 12". And I have pulled a Canadian large at 12". How can fisher rightfully say that the new ones that air test 8" are on par with older units that air test 12".

 

[Nailed-it]

And with all the problems that I have been hearing about the the new f75, I really have hesitations about buying one.

 

[uselesspulltab]

I have a CZ-3D tom tuned, its one of the newer ones and it is certified at 13.5 inches but ive even dug targets at 14 inches and whats suprising is i have the stock coil on it. if its doing this good, i cant wait to get the larger one and see what happens.

 

[Nailed-it]

I have a CZ-3D tom tuned, its one of the newer ones and it is certified at 13.5 inches but ive even dug targets at 14 inches and whats suprising is i have the stock coil on it. if its doing this good, i cant wait to get the larger one and see what happens.

You got lucky and got a good one! Congrats! What was it air testing before it was tuned? Probably somewhat close? I hear that the 12" Sunray coil works great, but they are expensive when they come around.

 

[uselesspulltab]

I'm not sure as to what it was beforehand. But mout targets here aren't very deep so at least it guarantees I'm not missing anything. Got a target a couple days ago. That was down at around 12 inches it was a very faint signal. Turned out to be a nail and a copper penny. Was kind of strange.