Deep Coins

[Critterhunter]

Just thought I'd post this from the Explorer Classroom forum for a comparison of depths of it to the Sovereign. It shows that those machines or the Etrac don't hold a depth advantage over the Sovereign. I've read of the Sovereign finding coins for people this deep and deeper, and as I've said before I'm digging deeper coins in my soil with my GT than I ever did with my Explorers.

rayski --

9" is a DEEP coin! ESPECIALLY if your soil is not super-mild. I would bet that very few folks find a dime or penny-sized coin deeper than about 10" max. Sure, you hear stories...but 10" is getting close to the limits of these machines, in most soils. Quarters, can hit an inch or maybe two deeper, and I'm sure a half can be had at a foot or more. But, for a small coin, 9" is pretty deep! YES, you will hear only a broken signal on many deep coins...I'd practice working with that coin you buried and get used to the "less than perfect" sound and ID. One more thing -- a coin long-buried will often give you a better signal than a newly-buried one. That's been my experience, for sure.

Steve

 

[deepdiger60]

[size=medium]I found in the last few years that most all high end machines are equal in depth in a 12 inch deep fresh plowed field , targets 6 inches on the average,one day on a 100+ acre field about 20 of us from the ADT who by the way is sponsored by Minelab most hunting with the E-Trac a few of us had the Sov units and even 2 had the Excal and Explor units, but you can use any brand make you want no one had a extraordinary find beyond 6 inches in lose soil except 1 guy decided to hunt the wood,s next to the 300+ year old fields with a E-Trac and found not 1 but 2 !! 1697 King William silver hammered coins very deep in undisturbed soil over 13 inches deep so what does that say ?? Plows fields are great for relativity shallow finds with the exception of iron . Jim [/size]

 

[Critterhunter]

Yea, Minelabs don't like disturbed ground. It's not just about the halo effect but also due to the disturbed ground matrix and trapped air.

 

[Critterhunter]

Here's another repost concerning Explorer SE depth. Most of what I've read says the Etrac gets the same depth as an SE so it applies to both. Also remember that most Sovereigns are using an 8" or 10" coil versus the 11" on the SE/Etrac, yet I've read (and have experienced) similar depth reports with the Sovereign. Very interesting read...

Rayski....for starters....Explorers HATE disturbed ground

I would estimate that 50% of the silver dimes, wheaties, and Injuns' I have found in the last 4 years have come from the 8" to 10" depth range.

I would also estimate that about 20% have come from the 10" to 11" depth range in cleaner ground. (I have found plenty at a true measured 11" depth)

The other 30% I have found are either mixed in with trash....under trash...on trash...mixed in with iron...under iron....laying on iron....on edge....etc...at depths anywhere from 2" to 11". I actually found a barber dime on edge one time that was next to a bottle cap at only 4" deep...honestly. You just never know.

I found countless deep silver and injuns' in the 8" to as deep as 9" range (plenty of 9" ones" with the 6" Excelerator).

All the 10"+ deep coins came with the 10 x 12 SEF, Minelb Pro, 12" Sunray...etc....and a few 10" ones with the 6 x 8 SEF.

Most ANY good coin hit in the 9" to 11" depth range WILL NOT have that textbook sweet, consistent sound. They WILL be broken and chattery BUT with time you will be able to recognize that sound.

Just this year alone I dug at least 100 keeper coins (silver, injuns', and wheaties) that were in excess of 10" deep and probably closer to 11".

The other several hundres keeper coins were found in the range and conditions I stated here in my IL soil.

In the last few years I have found a handful of wheaties and silver dimes at a true measured 12" depth...and 1 silver dollar....but those depths are VERY rare and happen for me maybe 2 to 3 times each year.

The key is for you to learn that "broken" yet sweet sound over an 8" to 10" deep silver coin.

The next step will be for you to learn that same sweet sound...BUT learning that sound when the coin is mixed in with trash or iron.

That's a whole different ballgame..and it just takes time. Give it some time and a LOT of practice.

The explorers are GREAT machines.

 

[Critterhunter]

My Explorers seemed to max out in my mineralized soil at about 7.5 to MAYBE 8 deep on a silver dime. The deepest coins I ever dug with any detector to date have been with my GT and the stock 10" Tornado. Under wet conditions an indian head in one hole and a v-nickle in another that were roughly 11" deep. I almost gave up on those thinking they must be a large piece of trash at those depths. The 12x10 has proven to me that it's deeper in my tests but I haven't used it enough at known deep coin spots to find coins that deep and deeper. I have, though, dug wheats with it at about 8 or 9" deep and a merc about 9" deep.

A lot of the reported depths people get have a lot to do with the make up of the soil. If it's mineralized or contains a lot of tiny black hot rocks the depth suffers. For years in my soil my best depth was about 7.5" on a silver dime with my QXT Pro. My Explorers maybe slightly bettered that depth.

My main point is that people shouldn't have any concern whether the Sovereign is getting as good or better depths than the FBS machines. A lot depends on your mineralization as to whether you can match the reported depths of others in other states. I just know that I'm digging coins deeper with my GT than I have with any other machine I've ever owned. Breaking the 7.5" mark in my soil seemed impossible for years.

When you come across a deep target don't just assume it's trash or iron based on the first response you get from it. You need to do fast wiggles or short sweeps over it to pull the best ID out of it. It may take a while to reach 180 but if it does then dig. Also, I've found in my tests that many coins on the fringes of depth may only response properly from one direction, so don't pass those deep ones like that thinking they are iron. I recommend anyone wanting to see how real deep coins might respond to place a silver dime on the ground and sweep over it from far away and slowly get closer until you just start getting a response. Notice how the audio sounds and the ID reacts. That's how the real deep ones are going to be. It may take a lot of effort to get them to climb to 180 and you can notice the pattern they take while getting there.

 

[Critterhunter]

Here's a repost from the Explorer forum...

From the Explorer forum...

Yup. Most of the silver coin i find is between 9-11 inch range. I found a merc. Dime at 11-1/2 inches deep. with the explorer, And the deepest coin i have ever found was a indian head cent at just over 14 inches and i was using the sovereign GT. The sovereign is a deeper detector then the explorer, just my opinion, but the explorer is smarter.

Might be fun to see people post their depths with a Sovereign and what size coil.

 

[Rick(ND)]

Much of what you say has a lot to do with how well you know your detector, me with the Sovereign I feel there is no one around me that can find what i can with the Sovereigns as some great depth which has been proven many times before. Now I have a Friend that has a old Explorer XS, in fact it is one of the first Explorer I tried and didn't care for it and he is finding coins in places most everyone has gave up on. His silver count for 2011 is 345 and that is not counting war nickles. The reason he does so well is he has spent the time to learn his detector well, like i have with the Sovereign by using it and understanding it in actual hunting and not doing air test and test gardens. Now another hunting Buddie (started with a Sovereign XS in 1997, then a Explorer XS, the Explorer EX2 and the SE Pro before the E-Trac) uses a E-Trac which I do too when not using the Sovereign and he hunts with the guy with the XS a lot on the weekends. When they go out they like to do some signal comparing and the depth seems about the same, but the E-Trac give a clearer signal on the deep targets better and will lock on better too, but the real difference is coins close to trash the E-Trac will see much better. Now this being said he was also very good with the Sovereign when he had it and was the only guy that could find more than me at times when we went out detecting, but I seem to find the deeper coins as i went slower than he did. After he used and learned the Explorer a bit he wound up selling his Sovereign as he seen that the Explorer was finding too many nice coins he had missed with his Sovereign, some very deep while some not that deep, the reason is because he spent the time to really know and understand his Explorer. Both have used their Explorer is some very mineralized ground and do well with them, it just getting to know your detector well and find the settings that will work and leave them and not being changing them all the time.
Now for me with the Sovereign my deepest coins with a 8 inch coil is around 12+ with the Sun Ray S-8 and the Minelab 8 inch Coinsearch coil, with the E-Trac has been around 10 inches with the X-8 of Sun Rays and haven't had a chance to try the X-12 on the E-Trac yet, but with the Sovereign the S-12 has got me a few coins at 13-14 inches in some tough area.
My opinion is the Sovereign when you get to know it well and understand it is one great detector, but the Explorers are better for those that use and know them while the E-Trac is the best of the 3 for those that also spend the time to get to know and learn them. The E-Trac for me can be learned easier and will run much smoother than the Explorers and the E-Trac is not a Explorer and should not be run like a Explorer for the best results plus will see coins close to iron better than even the Sovereigns which are very good.
What I can tell you about the BBS verses the FBS is both work very well and why they made the FBS and stayed with it though out all the Explorers and now the E-Trac is it does work better than the BBS for those that spend the time to get to know their detectors.
I love my Sovereigns as I know them well and I trust them, the E-Trac is growing on me more each time I use it as I am seeing some things that is impressing me in spots I worked hard with the Sovereign, but I know i will always have a Sovereign around, maybe even take it with me when I go as that would be heaven wouldn't it?? Might have to take some asbestos just in case.

Rick

 

[Critterhunter]

Well, all I can say is that I knew my Explorers well. Did extensive reading, research, and setup on all three that I owned over the years...And yet they never got me coins as deep as I do with my GT, or got me coins in iron as much as I have with the GT. Many say (including me) that past about 6" in depth the VDI on the Explorer becomes very unstable. From my experience the GT has a much more solid target lock on at depth. In my opinion there is just too much resolution on the Explorer's VDI for good solid target lock ons. A bigger net catches more fish in a sense where a coin only has to get into the 180 zone on the GT while the Explorer splits hairs on targets, making things a bit unstable at depth.

I did a lot of reading and helped my friend set up his programs and discrimination patterns on the Etrac. After using it here and there it's not really the detector for me. I don't care at all for the way all the targets get compressed into the 12 line on it, and the conductivity range is rather limited...making target differences harder to see on some targets. If I was to go FBS again I'd buy an SE. It's depth is the same as the Etrac. The main difference between the two is the Etrac does better at visual ID at depth while the SE does better at audio at depth. One other thing I didn't care for on the Explorer was the visual target lag compared to the audio. It made use kind of akward for me. I also didn't care for the 10" coil on the Explorers which hindered seperation and pinpointing. The 10" Tornado on the Sovereign is a much better coil. The Pro Coil on the SE is the main reason I'd be willing to try one of those again, but then again I'd probably put a 12x10 on it for more depth.

I still say a lot of the credit owned to the improved unmasking ability of the Etrac or SE is due to the Pro Coil. The 12x10 for the Sovereign makes seperation so much more easy to do and it's so laser like that you get a faster reaction between targets. I'm able to sniper coins right next to even large pieces of trash that I simply couldn't do on the Explorer with the 10" coil. The added depth of the 12x10 is also a nice improvement over stock.

 

[Neil]

Wow Critter you have posted 6 times in this post you started. Sov versus Explorer/Etrac always it seems.

 

[taltexan]

I have the etrac and just bought a 2a with 8" coil. I have use the etrac for approx. 2 years and feel comfortable with the detector. As far as depth I have a 2 year old test garden with a penny at 12" on a plastic lid. The etrac will give a report with the 10x12, a somewhat broken "thunking" sound. The sovereign with null over the coin with a low tone iron sound when the threshold returns. Now it is the 8" coil.....I am just learning the sov. but I like the tone when hunting heavy iron sites. Kinda like pitch hold on the etrac but easier for me to tell the difference between falsing and a good target. I hunt an old park where nails are everywhere in one area about 30x30 but have found numerous silver coins with the etrac....I hunted that same area with the sovereign and found a silver dime surrounded by nails. The tone was solid I knew it was a coin before I dug it. I have hunted this area nearly every time I hit the park and continue to pull coins. I like the tones of the sovereign over the etrac....Will I give up the etrac, No...but I will pick up a 10x12 when I can find a good used one and continue to learn the sovereign......

 

[Tin Fin]

Well, it's just my opinion, but I think Rick has it right - some of this depth argument has very much to do with personal skill with any given machine. I know one person that finds pretty deep coins with a Bounty Hunter; I don't think it has so much to do with that particular machine so much as his skill with that machine. I'm just starting to learn the excal, and a gt soon to follow - I don't know anything about how close they are in tone; but I do know that I need to spend the time learning the sounds, testing my skills against my own level of competence, and then stretching that by any means possible. True, there is a limit to each machines ability, just like there is a limit to any tools ability. But, the same wrenches in a professional mechanics hands can do a heck of a lot more work, and do it better, and in less time, and more efficiently, than those same tools in my hands. That has nothing to do with the tools ability, it has to do with personal skill and knowledge. I have even seen some people do impressive work with cheap tools - same can apply in MD.

 

[deepdiger60]

I have the etrac and just bought a 2a with 8" coil. I have use the etrac for approx. 2 years and feel comfortable with the detector. As far as depth I have a 2 year old test garden with a penny at 12" on a plastic lid. The etrac will give a report with the 10x12, a somewhat broken "thunking" sound. The sovereign with null over the coin with a low tone iron sound when the threshold returns. Now it is the 8" coil.....I am just learning the sov. but I like the tone when hunting heavy iron sites. Kinda like pitch hold on the etrac but easier for me to tell the difference between falsing and a good target. I hunt an old park where nails are everywhere in one area about 30x30 but have found numerous silver coins with the etrac....I hunted that same area with the sovereign and found a silver dime surrounded by nails. The tone was solid I knew it was a coin before I dug it. I have hunted this area nearly every time I hit the park and continue to pull coins. I like the tones of the sovereign over the etrac....Will I give up the etrac, No...but I will pick up a 10x12 when I can find a good used one and continue to learn the sovereign......

I think the largest problem with the Sovereign is it,s recovery speed in a very trashy area you should be able to adjust the iron level reading Gary,s UK report on the GT he says...

Grumbles
I would like to see the sales brochure explaining the features in a little more honest detail for example: The lockable ground trac feature will only work in all metal, which is very mis leading, searching in discrimination has fixed auto trac like other Sovereign models. Reading the brochure I was led to believe the Iron mask could be switched off, assuming the operator will then have a full control aver the discrimination from all metal upwards. This is not the case, with Iron mask on or off the machine will still reject most Iron automatically at zero discrimination, this can not be lowered by the operator to say reject very small nails only..Gary

Also all those deep short chirps i hear that i assumed was a iron null sound and passed up really was a target just to close to a iron nail ? sounds sounds sounds !!! that is the whole key to learn . Jim

http://youtu.be/odhpMMNfslQ

 

[park pirate]

I was searching WP. park one day and got this signal man it was deep you could just hear how deep it was. After digging 10 inches down using my S1- probe i could hear it,so i dig another 3 inches stick the probe in the hole and BANG, BANG. stuck my digger in hole and poped it it out of the side of hole and reached down pulled out a hand full of dirt in my hand i thought i was holding a large cent. It was round and green. But after wiping the dirt off it ended up being a copper cog. 13 half inches deep the sovereignGT is a master in depth....

 

[Jack Flynn]

The title of this thread should be deep everything! I ran the ETrac since it came out and got my hands on the GT about 4 months ago and never looked back period. The GT doesn't need a lesche it needs a stainless steel scoop to dig with. In my experience with six minelab machines and a few others the GT has beat them all in depth. It will find stuff even the ETrac won't find in heavy mineralization. The GT when ran very slow will find stuff no other detector will if you ask me. Tiny small targets to anything above. I've never seen the ETrac or Explorers or any of the Xterra's do what it is doing for me. Deep is relevant also. In black sand iron rich red clay it shut all my other detectors down. The GT when ran snails pace will find targets all over the place in this stuff. The machine will be total silent nulled out and will sound off when ran over and accepted target, anything above iron simply. Being relevant, depth is no wheres as great as in good ground, but other machines have left a bevy load of targets in the stuff I'm hunting, I mean a lot of them per they were not seeing the targets. These places have turned into my gold mine! Coins too. What made me realize this is the loads of 1970's pulltabs present. Lot's of them on hard hunted a lot places. In a time when everyone wants to know almost for certain what they are digging before they exert the energy with a lot of machines. The GT puts them to shame. They are missing great targets wanting to know, as I was, with all my other machines. The new machines with whitewalls and curb feelers and pretty screens are causing many to leave stuff in the ground. The GT will find them. Lot's of horsepower in that little blue control box, no bells and whistles.

 

[park pirate]

The title of this thread should be deep everything! I ran the ETrac since it came out and got my hands on the GT about 4 months ago and never looked back period. The GT doesn't need a lesche it needs a stainless steel scoop to dig with. In my experience with six minelab machines and a few others the GT has beat them all in depth. It will find stuff even the ETrac won't find in heavy mineralization. The GT when ran very slow will find stuff no other detector will if you ask me. Tiny small targets to anything above. I've never seen the ETrac or Explorers or any of the Xterra's do what it is doing for me. Deep is relevant also. In black sand iron rich red clay it shut all my other detectors down. The GT when ran snails pace will find targets all over the place in this stuff. The machine will be total silent nulled out and will sound off when ran over and accepted target, anything above iron simply. Being relevant, depth is no wheres as great as in good ground, but other machines have left a bevy load of targets in the stuff I'm hunting, I mean a lot of them per they were not seeing the targets. These places have turned into my gold mine! Coins too. What made me realize this is the loads of 1970's pulltabs present. Lot's of them on hard hunted a lot places. In a time when everyone wants to know almost for certain what they are digging before they exert the energy with a lot of machines. The GT puts them to shame. They are missing great targets wanting to know, as I was, with all my other machines. The new machines with whitewalls and curb feelers and pretty screens are causing many to leave stuff in the ground. The GT will find them. Lot's of horsepower in that little blue control box, no bells and whistles.

I couldent agree more ,vary true post thank you...

 

[Neil]

The title of this thread should be deep everything! I ran the ETrac since it came out and got my hands on the GT about 4 months ago and never looked back period. The GT doesn't need a lesche it needs a stainless steel scoop to dig with. In my experience with six minelab machines and a few others the GT has beat them all in depth. It will find stuff even the ETrac won't find in heavy mineralization. The GT when ran very slow will find stuff no other detector will if you ask me. Tiny small targets to anything above. I've never seen the ETrac or Explorers or any of the Xterra's do what it is doing for me. Deep is relevant also. In black sand iron rich red clay it shut all my other detectors down. The GT when ran snails pace will find targets all over the place in this stuff. The machine will be total silent nulled out and will sound off when ran over and accepted target, anything above iron simply. Being relevant, depth is no wheres as great as in good ground, but other machines have left a bevy load of targets in the stuff I'm hunting, I mean a lot of them per they were not seeing the targets. These places have turned into my gold mine! Coins too. What made me realize this is the loads of 1970's pulltabs present. Lot's of them on hard hunted a lot places. In a time when everyone wants to know almost for certain what they are digging before they exert the energy with a lot of machines. The GT puts them to shame. They are missing great targets wanting to know, as I was, with all my other machines. The new machines with whitewalls and curb feelers and pretty screens are causing many to leave stuff in the ground. The GT will find them. Lot's of horsepower in that little blue control box, no bells and whistles.

Jack when you call the adjustments on an etrac or explorer bells and whistles, that pretty much sums up how well you know them. bells and whistles is a saying for stuff that really doesnt do anything and your not being honest by saying the adjustments on those two detectors do nothing. If you like the Sov better that is of course fine and good for you that youve found something that really works for you. but your bells and whistles statment is not being honest. what is honest is that plenty of people seem to claim to know detectors when they really dont.

 

[AustinEd]

All I can add is that with my Sov and a 8 inch coil I have hit Indians in a old park at just barely past a measured 10 inches. I grant you that this was under ideal conditions in mild wet soil but it did it. The signals were almost ghost signals but they were there.

 

[Critterhunter]

will pick up a 10x12 when I can find a good used one and continue to learn the sovereign......

You'll find better seperation and more depth with the 12x10. It makes reaction between targets faster too since it's using such a sharp edge of a detection field. Wiggle the tip of it at targets to really get a sharp edge to the signal and sniper out stuff.

 

[Critterhunter]

The title of this thread should be deep everything! I ran the ETrac since it came out and got my hands on the GT about 4 months ago and never looked back period. The GT doesn't need a lesche it needs a stainless steel scoop to dig with. In my experience with six minelab machines and a few others the GT has beat them all in depth. It will find stuff even the ETrac won't find in heavy mineralization. The GT when ran very slow will find stuff no other detector will if you ask me. Tiny small targets to anything above. I've never seen the ETrac or Explorers or any of the Xterra's do what it is doing for me. Deep is relevant also. In black sand iron rich red clay it shut all my other detectors down. The GT when ran snails pace will find targets all over the place in this stuff. The machine will be total silent nulled out and will sound off when ran over and accepted target, anything above iron simply. Being relevant, depth is no wheres as great as in good ground, but other machines have left a bevy load of targets in the stuff I'm hunting, I mean a lot of them per they were not seeing the targets. These places have turned into my gold mine! Coins too. What made me realize this is the loads of 1970's pulltabs present. Lot's of them on hard hunted a lot places. In a time when everyone wants to know almost for certain what they are digging before they exert the energy with a lot of machines. The GT puts them to shame. They are missing great targets wanting to know, as I was, with all my other machines. The new machines with whitewalls and curb feelers and pretty screens are causing many to leave stuff in the ground. The GT will find them. Lot's of horsepower in that little blue control box, no bells and whistles.

Great post! I've found that my GT runs smoother in rough ground that my Explorers did. I always seemed to be fighting the sensitivity setting on them to keep it stabile.