Deep target questions...

[samandnoah]

Several members have mentioned that deep targets often result in a value on the ID that is off from the expected value.

1) Is there a bias on which way is the ID off? Does it tend to show a higher ID or lower ID for a deep target? Or is that not consistent?

2) How do you guys interpret a A) good tone, B) appropriate and desired ID, but C) ferrous reading on the horseshoe? For example, you hear a great tone, see a value of 88 (in 12 kHz), but the horseshoe goes half-way down on the left side.

Maybe that leads to another question -- what has been your experience in terms of what you hear and/or see (and with what settings for Iron Volume, etc.) when you have a good target and iron adjacent to each other in the hole? What adjustments do you make to help your target identification?

On those REALLY faint sounds with just a sliver on the horseshoe, does it stay consistently on the non-ferrous side, or have you ever dug a good target that showed up on both sides?

Thanks!
Rich

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

Rich, to answer you question simply. Dont worry so much with #'s and perfect visual ID, Dig by audio. On the real deep ones you will get repeatable audio but no ID, dig ALL of those! ID#'s will lie to you.

 

[samandnoah]

Thanks, Bart. But you're jumping into the middle of a prior discussion. Trust me, I've done plenty of "just dig it". And my first detector was a Tesoro -- so I understand the value of listening (and learning what those sounds mean). I am asking people for their experiences with these specific instances, and not how to solve any specific problem. So, what has been YOUR experience in those situations?
Thx,
Rich

 

[Barry NY]

To address your first point...I'm more often "disappointed" than "overjoyed"...

In other words - on those deep targets that even register a target ID - the overwhelming majority of the time the ID reads higher than when the target is recovered...

I've had 88's drop down to 58's many times.

 

[Andy Sabisch]

Rich

As Barry has indicated, the bias seems to be a false high . . . . however, in most of my areas, what tends to happen on the deep stuff (up until the 11 inch coil) is that beyond 9" or so, the TID is gone or is sporadic; i.e., one pass it give a number, the next few passes nothing and then another number - but the consistency or lack thereof tells me to ignore the TID and make a decision as to dig or not. If I am in an area where I can remove a few inches of dirt - relic hunting or field hunting, I can check the area and the result will usually be a good TID.

Rusted iron tends to give me TID's that seem good but the audio comes across as "strangled" or chopped which in 99% of the time when I dig to see what it is, turns out to be crap.

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How do you guys interpret a A) good tone, B) appropriate and desired ID, but C) ferrous reading on the horseshoe? For example, you hear a great tone, see a value of 88 (in 12 kHz), but the horseshoe goes half-way down on the left side.

I hate to say this but I have not seen this . . . . . if the signal is giving a consistent TID of 88, I have never seen the horseshoe register to the left side . . . . did you happen to dig any of these to see what they were? Be interested in hearing if anyone else has seen this . . . . may be something worth sharing with XP to see if they have any ideas . . . .

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On those REALLY faint sounds with just a sliver on the horseshoe, does it stay consistently on the non-ferrous side, or have you ever dug a good target that showed up on both sides?

On of those deep and faint signals that sounds good (based on the tone settings) and is just giving a little sliver of black on the horseshoe, it may flicker to the left side but it should stay on the right most of the time . . . I have two identical programs when deep coin hunting that has only the GB different and what I have found is that if you are in the TRACKING option, the Deus can try to track out faint signals thinking they are ground anomalies. Toggling to the MANUAL GB tends to give a better shot of what is down there.

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Hope this helps

Andy

 

[samandnoah]

Awesome feedback, Andy. So thank you.

On the first point, I have experienced both the good tones and the "strangled" tones as you put it, so I understand what you mean. I'll try digging the clean ones next time. It has been very wet & muddy (11" of rain Sat night in some areas!) over the last several days, and I did not have the appropriate digging tool with me to go for a really deep target. The one I did try to go after turned out to be a very small zipper pull, and was not as deep as indicated since it was much smaller than a coin.

I recently got a gopro, and I will try to film & dig one of those targets that sound good but seem to indicate a ferrous object. May not be until the weekend, and if I can find one! But I have seen it on more than one instance. This seems to happen only in the couple of very trashy parks I regularly hunt.

Thanks again,
Rich

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

The reason I answered the way I did is because those deep targets the machine is not consistent. #'s are the first thing to go. I have seen it hit higher AND lower on the scale of where the target hits once out of the ground.

My point I was trying to get across was if you get good repeatable audio and it "sounds" like a good target you better dig. With practice a coin at any depth give a much smaller and clearer audio tone. That is what your looking for in my opinion. It sounds cleaner if that makes sense. I have found many a good target when the audio was small/good but #'s were higher or lower than where they should be. Nothing consistently higher or lower in my opinion.

The XP Deus is one AWESOME machine but all the variables can throw things off, other close targets, on edge, iron in the hole, not properly ground balanced, emi etc etc etc. standing around a target watching the screen to long trying to second guess the detector is wasting time that you could be using to find the next good one. I am very guilty of that and always kick myself if I investigate it more than 30-45 second without digging it out.

Hope I made sense.

 

[samandnoah]

Hey Bart--

That's a great response and I appreciate you sharing your experience. So thanks for coming back and explaining, and my apologies if I seemed dismissive. I do know what you mean about cleaner sounding, at least on shallower targets. But my area of TX has been in a 3 year drought, and we have JUST started getting some rain (literally, we've had more rainfall so far in Oct than we've had in any 1 month in the last 3 years!), so I am starting to listen for the really faint "whispers" so many talk about. I've had the Deus for about 6 months, but this is the first time I've had soil I can dig beyond 4" without a jackhammer! Honestly, I don't know what good REALLY deep signals sound like since I have little experience with the Deus in these favorable soil conditions. And I was trying to avoid digging numerous 8"+ holes in a park. So was trying to see if I could do anything with the other available data to determine when to dig selectively.

Not surprising, the answer really is "dig it all" if it sounds good. So I'll be doing a lot of heavy digging and taking notes. Wanna help me out and cut me a great deal on a Sampson 18"?!?!

Take care,
Rich

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

We don't carry the 18" as it seems it's either to short to dig standing or to long to dig on your knees.

I find the if you get a signal and your having to "work" to make it sound or look good, more often than not it's junk. Even deep targets have good repeatable audio.