Depth/Discrimination.

[Teknetics2]

Hi Folks,

I'm posting this one again as my last post seems to have been mysteriosly deleted/disappeared. I felt compelled to post following a quote from Matt R as follows:

The above section was typed up yesterday, before OC

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

That sounds right I know when you up the disc on my whites and there is a target that is close to the disc setting it gets cut off.

 

[JM]

my post yesterday evening was deleted in answer to your post ,I said ,if you hear a coin at discrim 40 you do not lose depth if you put discrim up to 65 it could be that you no longer hear the coin has you have disced the coin out .
I see your copy of the original post which was deleated ,has been worded differently to suite yourself ,after you have had my answer to your post.
john moore

 

[JM]

Teknetics2 ,yousay a copy off your earlier delated post BUT your wording has changed from your original post, after my answer to you ,it seems your hell bent on trying to drag down Matt R and myself , YOUR POST SAID, you lost the signal turning discrim from 40 to 65 so you lost depth now your saying just a very weak signal or not audbile ,I SAID YOU MAY OFF DISCCED YOUR COIN OUT .here is your post I saved to show what your trying to do ,by moving the goal posts to suite your self .

 

[coenwolf]

n/t

 

[Teknetics2]

Hi John Moore,

My memory is not like it used to be hence the re-wording, but if you read both the screen print you took of my original post and the re-worded post you will see that in essence the scenarios are exactly the same.

I can't understand the difficulty you seem to be having with quite a simple explanation ie: if you turn up your discrimination too high, the T2 will only sound off on the 'good' shallower targets therefore targets at depth will not sound off, which means you have lost depth on potentially 'good' targets.

Whether you want to call it a weak or no audio signal is just a play on words, the fact is if you turn your discrimination up too much coins at depth will not be signalled, so whether you want to call it loss of depth or loss of audio signal the end result is the same.

I'm sorry that you feel I am trying to 'drag' you down but that wasn't my intention at all, as I don't know either of you from Adam.

I am just trying to save T2 users a lot of time and confusion regarding the issue in hand, which hopefully will result in a lot more finds in their pouches.

Happy hunting

Teknetics2

 

[MattR]

That isn't the full story though is it LB?

I'm glad you've used the DFX as an example, for that is the one machine that proves my point.

If you own a DFX as well as a Teknetics T2 you will realize that the DFX can illustrate unequivocally that the detector DOESN'T loose the target when YOU disc it out.

For example. Set the DFX into MIXED AUDIO. and VISUAL DISCRIM OFF.

Now you can really see what is happening

 

[El]

n/t

 

[Captain Kirk]

I agree with MattR. People just do not seem to be able to understand what he is saying.

As the target gets deeper, then it becomes increasingly difficult for detector electronics to recognize the target for what it is. This challenge is compounded by the ground mineralization, nearby trash and the deteriorating quality (or strength) of the detected signal. Also, the way the coil sweeps over the target becomes more critical in making a proper target ID. The ID will move up and down the ID scale as the signal characteristics vary from sweep to sweep.

When the discrimination is set very low, then the user may hear a strong signal, but there are still variations in the tone and the visual ID. As you increase the discrimination, the detector continues to have all the same information presented to the detector electronics, but the detector just no longer tells you about any information that falls into the discriminated out region. This gives the user the false perception that the target is not being detected. That is not true. The detector is just not telling the user everything the detector knows because you have instructed the detector not to tell you everything.

I have not done a particularly good job of explaining what Matt is trying to say, but maybe it will give you a different way to look at the process.

HH,
Glenn

 

[Frank in NH]

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[rink123]

So the discrimination,is more like another sensetivity contro,less discrimination more depth ? so if there is a lot of iron about i wont find as much, cos i would have to put my discrimination up is that right ? sry if this sounds newbe cos i am wen comes to the T2 thx .

 

[JM]

n/t

 

[rink123]

Not much good on iron infested sites then

 

[Captain Kirk]

As you increase the discrimination the detector does not lose any depth performance, but you will generally not find as many deep targets in trashy areas because you have limited the detectors ability to communicate with you everything that it sees. That is why I like to use the least amount of discrimination as my state of mind will allow. If you are hearing all of those unwanted signals, then your mind tends to become numb and you lose concentration. With experience and training you can tolerate the "flak" so to speak. You will be able to take advantage of the T2's ability to give you a very short "beep" amongst the dominant "boing" of the iron next to a silver dime.

Hope this helps,
Glenn

 

[Captain Kirk]

The T2 is very good in iron infested sites because it has very fast recovery. Just do not over-discriminate.

Glenn

 

[rink123]

Thanks mate, So does this mean I'm likely to dig a lot of iron in order to go deep on sites? Is the T2 a bit like the explorer then a load of noise? Would I have to dig a lot of iron to get a coin at six inches on iron invested sites? sorry about all these questions but I need to know before mine comes thx

 

[Captain Kirk]

Thanks mate, So does this mean I'm likely to dig a lot of iron in order to go deep on sites? Would I have to dig a lot of iron to get a coin at six inches on iron invested sites?
Not necessarily. Many good deep finds can be dug with no trash in the same hole. But, there are many good targets that have not been dug by others because they are "hiding" amongst the iron and other trash.
* Some of those targets will be unmasked by a fast recovery detector in the hands of an experienced hunter.
* Others will be very difficult and can be detected only by sweeping coil in many different directions.
* The most difficult ones will only be found by just a feeling that you get from the nature of the tone as you sweep the target.

Note that shallow targets can also be masked by trash.

Is the T2 a bit like the explorer then a load of noise?
We have to be careful how we use the term "noise". Generally speaking we use the term "noise" to describe interference caused by electrical interference, circuit noise of the detector or other such sources. I think that we should not use the term "noise" to describe the detectors response to "junk" in the ground. The detector does not determine what is junk. It just tells you there is a metal or non-conducting ferrous item passing the coil.

A better detector will detect more targets that a not-so-good detector. That does not mean they are noisier. If there are a lot of targets in the ground, then there will be a lot of audio tones generated. That does not mean that the detector is "noisy". The manufacturer leaves it up to the user to determine (by the discrimination setting) what targets he wants to be indicated or not indicated to the user.

Hope this helps.
Glenn

 

[MattR]

Glen, your post is a like a breath of fresh air blowing through the forum.

Helpful, instructive, and well presented.

It carries the hallmark of a person who knows what he is writing about, not only in the technical sense, but also in the practical application of your experience in the hobby.....MattR.UK

 

[Frank in NH]

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[Captain Kirk]

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