Excalibur 2 Slight Tonal Variations

[Tony in FL]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

 

[dewcon4414]

May be the coil size. Different size coil may not read a target the same. A good example of this is a really large coil looses sensitivity on tiny objects. Since the coils read conductivity and size they may react slightly different based on the send and receive.

Dew

 

[Tony in FL]

May be the coil size. Different size coil may not read a target the same. A good example of this is a really large coil looses sensitivity on tiny objects. Since the coils read conductivity and size they may react slightly different based on the send and receive.
Dew

In this particular case I am indeed comparing different coil sizes. However I noticed this same phenomenon when comparing two Excal II 1000's I had access to toward the end of last year. Back then I thought it was just a fluke but now I am not so sure.

 

[Neil]

Tony you can change the range on a sov so probably on the excal as well.

 

[Tony in FL]

Interesting Neil! I never owned a Sov. Is what you are referring to an undocumented feature that is accessed by taking it apart?

Since the Sov and Excal basically use the same technology it stands to reason the Excal may have something similar. Of course getting to it would be tougher on the Excal due to the seals.

 

[Electro]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

 

[Neil]

Interesting Neil! I never owned a Sov. Is what you are referring to an undocumented feature that is accessed by taking it apart?

Since the Sov and Excal basically use the same technology it stands to reason the Excal may have something similar. Of course getting to it would be tougher on the Excal due to the seals.

I know there used to be a pot on the older sovs boards but Ive never looked on either the Elite or GT models but I would guess there is. One of my GTs has the Dixie mod and its tonal range is higher than my other sovs.(Ive no idea what all involves the Dixie mod but the tones being higher is one thing).
There used to be a sov mods site by wildhere who had the pics of this adjustment on the older sovs. you might try sending an email to either wildhere or perhaps Mel parker(Mel seems to be up on the excals inner workings) and see if they can provide the info for you.
As electro points out headphones can make a difference also.

 

[Tony in FL]

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

Hi Electro. Anything is possible, but I don't believe headphone age is related to the slight tonal range difference I have noticed. In one case I noticed this same anomaly when running sound tests against one Excalibur 2 that had about a dozen or so total hours of use while comparing it to another Excalibur 2 fresh out of a new box.

 

[Neil in West Jersey]

You can only use one at a time. I have a few white's detectors where a quarter will have a slightly different VDI number even when they are set to 2.5KHz. While modern metal detectors are miles ahead of where they were 20 years ago, they are not precision scientific instruments. They are calibrated in the factory for hobby use, which means there is a lot of acceptable margin +/-. If you were to use the 800 on one day and the II on another, I doubt you would notice any difference.

Just my opinion.

 

[OldBeechnut]

You can only use one at a time. I have a few white's detectors where a quarter will have a slightly different VDI number even when they are set to 2.5KHz. While modern metal detectors are miles ahead of where they were 20 years ago, they are not precision scientific instruments. They are calibrated in the factory for hobby use, which means there is a lot of acceptable margin +/-. If you were to use the 800 on one day and the II on another, I doubt you would notice any difference.

Very true



I have five of the monsters, and a sovereign..... each has a slight difference. Due to different years made, different venders parts, settings, etc......but it only takes a couple targets to get you in tune when your in the field, then at that time the others don't matter.

 

[Tony in FL]

Hi Neil / OldBeechnut. You are both right, it is probably not a big deal, but I wanted to rule out a possible problem with my new machine. So thanks for the sanity check. Of course with that being said I do think it would be nicer if one Excalibur 2 with the stock coil and headphones would always produce target tones that are indistinguishable to another Excalibur 2 with stock coil and headphones, provided the same settings are used.

 

[erikk]

I have 3 and they are all a bit different but since I dig all targets not a problem. I can still call most of them but dig anyway

 

[Buried Crap NJ]

I just put a new different headphones on my Excalibur II. I can say that each set has it's very own tonal sound. The stock phones were easily affected by the outside sounds, when I placed them in a different housing all the tones changes slightly to my ear. I have now upgraded to a much better pair ( Goldmasters ) Its like learning all over again. The first thing I notice is the target volume needs to be turned way down otherwise I would be deft in a short while. I hunted only 4hrs with the new set and I have notice certain targets (Aluminum) is lower than before. Several times I thought I had a keeper only to see it was NOT!
Steve NJ

 

[erikk]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

Maybe however I have 3 excals the Blue, Yellow 1000 & the 2 All are encased in Peltor cups. I find the old Blue have the most accurate sounds. With them I can tell 99% of aluminum can slaw but others it is maybe 5%

 

[Electro]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

Maybe however I have 3 excals the Blue, Yellow 1000 & the 2 All are encased in Peltor cups. I find the old Blue have the most accurate sounds. With them I can tell 99% of aluminum can slaw but others it is maybe 5%

Hello Erikk...That is an awesome ability with the slaw.....What is it about the sound that gives the can slaw away from the gold? The thing I have experienced the most is that gold signal starts and stops (fast attack and fast release) similar to the word "tot" while slaw can sound like the word "none" with the beginning and end exaggerated like " nnnnonnnnne". But I have been fooled quite a few times so I have found this is not a consistence difference. Are you hearing a difference in the attack/release or is it a tonal difference with harsher mid frequencies? Thanks in advance for your reply!

 

[erikk]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

Maybe however I have 3 excals the Blue, Yellow 1000 & the 2 All are encased in Peltor cups. I find the old Blue have the most accurate sounds. With them I can tell 99% of aluminum can slaw but others it is maybe 5%

Hello Erikk...That is an awesome ability with the slaw.....What is it about the sound that gives the can slaw away from the gold? The thing I have experienced the most is that gold signal starts and stops (fast attack and fast release) similar to the word "tot" while slaw can sound like the word "none" with the beginning and end exaggerated like " nnnnonnnnne". But I have been fooled quite a few times so I have found this is not a consistence difference. Are you hearing a difference in the attack/release or is it a tonal difference with harsher mid frequencies? Thanks in advance for your reply!

I keep a nickel glued to the inside toe of me boot. With the Blue headphone s can slaw is lower in tone than a gold ring or the nickel. I always dig but am 99% correct on the call-the other 1% will be a stainless ring. On the other (yellow 1000 or the 2) there is no difference that I can tell

 

[Neil in West Jersey]

I currently own both an Excal 2 1000 and 800. I recently bought the Excal 2 800 and have been hunting with an Excal for close to 2 years. When I test the same target I get a slightly different tone from each machine. If I did not have a finely tuned ear for the Excal I might not notice the difference, but it is there if I make a comparison hearing each response one right after the other (detectors laid out without the rods, just the control pod, headset, and coil, waving the target over each coil in succession and hearing the tone broadcast from the headset just lying there). It is like the machines are ever so slightly out of sync with each other with respect to the tonal range produced by targets. They both do exhibit the classic responses i.e. low to medium tone for gold, medium tone for pull tab / nickle, and high tone for penny, dime, quarter, and silver. It is just that one machine produces a slightly higher tone than the other machine with respect to any given target. I have noticed this phenomenon with other Excal 2 machines I have used/tested. This tonal difference is very subtle and I am not sure how many would even notice it unless the test is done in such a way that the sound responses of both machines are heard in rapid succession.

I am wondering if there might be some sort of internal (inside the control pod) setting that determines the baseline tone range at the factory and perhaps there are minor inconsistencies with this setting. Or perhaps sourcing of the components responsible for sound processing coming from different vendors during manufacturing might add a slight tonal difference to otherwise identical machines. Anyone else who owns or has used multiple Excalibur II's notice this phenomenon?

Are your headphones the same age? Headphones will get stale over time. If you have an Excal that has seen two years of hard use (especially if left in a hot car) and you compare it to a brand new Excal (same model) it will sound different. Fresh Headphones usually will sound better

Maybe however I have 3 excals the Blue, Yellow 1000 & the 2 All are encased in Peltor cups. I find the old Blue have the most accurate sounds. With them I can tell 99% of aluminum can slaw but others it is maybe 5%

Hello Erikk...That is an awesome ability with the slaw.....What is it about the sound that gives the can slaw away from the gold? The thing I have experienced the most is that gold signal starts and stops (fast attack and fast release) similar to the word "tot" while slaw can sound like the word "none" with the beginning and end exaggerated like " nnnnonnnnne". But I have been fooled quite a few times so I have found this is not a consistence difference. Are you hearing a difference in the attack/release or is it a tonal difference with harsher mid frequencies? Thanks in advance for your reply!

I keep a nickel glued to the inside toe of me boot. With the Blue headphone s can slaw is lower in tone than a gold ring or the nickel. I always dig but am 99% correct on the call-the other 1% will be a stainless ring. On the other (yellow 1000 or the 2) there is no difference that I can tell

I kept a nickel in my flip flop, for about a minute

Good post!