First hunt with xp Deus Disapointed

[Waterdog]

I went out with the XP Deus for the first time today. I had a friend of mine out there that had a XP deus with a nine inch coil. He showed me a few things to help me get started. I hunt for a while and was finding a few coins, but nothing deep. Then one of my other friends come by and buried a coin and went over it with his machine. We could all hear it beeping in his headphones. My friend with the Nine inch coil goes over the coin... Nothing. So I go over it with my 11 inch coil, and I get nothing. I am running with my sensitivity at 90 and this coin ( a dime) is about 6 inches deep. I have a machine I paid half the price for and it could find this dime. Any advice would help.

 

[Gary-B]

It may help us if you gave use your programming used at the time.
I have seen this test many times in the past, we call it a dummy test.
Some cheaper machines appear to find deeper coins if they are freshly buried, what they are actually doing is detecting the hole. However if you remove the coin there will be no signal.....Why ? I have no idea, for some reason the hole enhances the signal.

Eastern European manufacturers thrive on these tests you will see jaw dropping video's all over the web.

You can make the Deus pass this test if you drop the ground balance right down and maxx out the TX gain, and raise the sensitivity, depending on what factory pre set program you started with.

 

[Dirt Fishing Bill]

Let me say 1st I know nothing about anything. Gary and others have a vast knowledge on the Deus and I am sure will be able to help.

That said the weather here has been awful when its not raining its almost cold enough to snow, so today I was playing around with the Deus in my basement where its not 4C or raining

So I was just trying coins to listen to tones and see vdi numbers and I know that "air tests" are not that great but I thought it would be a good starting point, and what I found was the Deus would bang on Canadian large Cents (1850-1910) now I was not measuring the distance (not what I was looking for) but just eyeballing it was hitting those large cents at 12 to 16 inches, seems to love Canadian silver as well. Now it did not do as well on Canadian clad seemed to be all over the map (VDI) did seem to do better on higher frequencies (Canadian clad is sorry to say junk, mostly steel core).

You didn't say what type of dime it was

Now I could be mistaken and maybe Gary can answer this but I thought I read somewhere the Deus and its built in programs are really designed for coins in the UK where the Deus is "King" and not so much for Canadian or US coins........ And you sort of have to adapt the programs for the coins your looking for.

Hang in there
All the Best
DFB

 

[calabash digger]

my friend has a test garden and I set his deus up for him hes 76 but wait let me tell you the story he bought one and hated it it wouldnt perform like he wanted it wouldnt tag the deep coins in the test garden. this is what I was yelping about yesterday in high plains drifters post about learning the machine in a factory preset setting it limits it imo. Do you want to be able to hit a nine inch dime? then go get this program and put it in your machine ( vances deep coin program) goolgle it. I put this program in his machine and he said its the deepest machine hes ever hunted with. he has an etrac ,makro racer2, and has had all kinds of detectors. he sold his first deus because it wouldnt perform and he didnt know how to make it perform very important to learn the function of each setting. I was playing around with mine in my deep program last night air testing and it was hitting a silver half at 12 to14in or so I know air test dont mean much but thats a impressive air test to me.Of course I have my machine opened up sen was on 90 what I hunt with, hes been finding 3 ringers at a foot with his set up with the deep coin program.I do not use the deep coin program has to much discrim for me as I relic hunt but he loves it and its deep. Dont worry your machine will smoke most others just get it set up for your style of hunting. happy hunting btw my machine wont hit a coin over 7 in or so in my trash program so the settings will change this machine in major ways im not looking for depth in my trash program im looking for seperation,

 

[squirrel1]

I went out with the XP Deus for the first time today. I had a friend of mine out there that had a XP deus with a nine inch coil. He showed me a few things to help me get started. I hunt for a while and was finding a few coins, but nothing deep. Then one of my other friends come by and buried a coin and went over it with his machine. We could all hear it beeping in his headphones. My friend with the Nine inch coil goes over the coin... Nothing. So I go over it with my 11 inch coil, and I get nothing. I am running with my sensitivity at 90 and this coin ( a dime) is about 6 inches deep. I have a machine I paid half the price for and it could find this dime. Any advice would help.

Well,
For one thing sensivity isn't the only thing that affects depth,,,depending on the conductivity of target-- freq selected could affect,,,for example,, 4 and 8khz not as deep on nickels vs 12 and 18 kHz.

Next reactivity setting,,3 will be shallower than 2,, 2 shallower than 1 , etc.

Also silencer setting can affect depth,,,and here ground minerals can affect too,,,-1 setting deepest,,the. 0, and so on.

As far as comparing the 9" coil to the 11" coil at depth,,,a close rule of thumb,,,this on solo sitting targets in the ground,,,whichever reactivity setting is necessary to hit the target with using 9" coil,,,a person using a 11" coil can usually dial reactivity up one level and hit the same target.

Overall running Deus flat out,, one can expect about 1-2" extra depth when comparing coils-- using optimum settings when comparing fringe depth detectable targets.

I have 2 complete Deus units,,one with 9" coil, and one with 11" coil,,,and have an extra 11" coil to boot.

I also have countless hours on a Deus,,,and have coin hunted, relic hunted with them,,no water hunting.

Deus is a very good detector,,,some folks who hunt a lot of modern trash sites,, get discouraged and many bolt from the Deus--- well I can say without reservation,, Deus if set up correctly will flat out hunt in modern trash---- key is notch setting,,and or freq selection used.

And the notch setting used,, can be somewhat misleading--- meaning you don't want to just notch out targets you don't want to hear ( Vdi wise),, an operator needs to come over the top about 10-12 points Vdi wise--- doing this will clean the Deus tone up ( not meter reading) on targets where the Deus is blending signals. With correct notch,,Deus can sniff out silver and copper out of smaller can slaw and tabs very good-- actually better than some of the higher priced minelabs-- I also have a Minelab CTX. And have also run Etrac,,,so again,, trust me on this. I have both tested and hunted,, and I see the overall results.

Folks need to give their Deus units a chance,,,,I have seen many folks bail from them,,only later to return to them after they saw folks finding the good stuff, and many of these folks,,the light bulb tuned on.

Deus doesn't" act like most detectors on deeper targets,,,this though in some respects is a good thing,,, once a person realizes what the Deus depending on the settings is telling them.

You have an specific questions,, fell free to ask.
No question is a dumb question.

 

[squirrel1]

Water dog,,

Some info to accelerate your learning with Deus.

First and foremost,,, learn how to navigate your Deus menus.

Experiment with changing,,,don't worry, even changing stock programs' settings,,,once you power down Deus,,,all stock programs revert back to default settings-- sort of idiot proof,,excuse the term.

Beginners should opt to stay on Tx power 2.

Audio report of 3-5 will do.

I highly recommend folks turn iron volume off--- this will let only the nonferrous tones through and simplify things a bit.

Silencer setting,,,new operators should be aware,, silencer setting should be double checked when going to reactivity levels 0,1, and 2. Deus when transition to these levels will press silencer setting to what I think are generally levels that are not the best generally for better/ best performance,


Deus reporting on targets,,,,Deus is different than most other detectors. But not always.
On shallower and mid depth targets--- Deus generally reports targets based on " true" Vdi reading ( based on freq setting) if normalized is not selected.

Deeper targets-- this is where Deus is different,,,it tends to range these deeper targets into the 90s region ( meter wise),,this is not a true Vdi reading btw.
Also since the Deus likes to report these deeper readings in the the 90s range on the meter--- wherever you have this range set up tone wise--- this is generally what an operator will hear----- most folks opt to run higher tone freq here in this region.

So,,let's take a nickel,,running Deus fast stock program,,,,on clean ground nickel will read 64 approx.
And before I forget,, air testing Deus can help a person out to see what targets can read,,key word here CAN,,,for example if I air test a nickel with some hot settings,,I can get it to hit at a pretty good distance--- but the meter readings and tone witnessed here--- NOT the same generally as what would be seen with the nickel buried,,,,,Deus over buried coin will act differently,,and how different can be caused by Deus settings and or ground minerals,,and target depth.

Now back to the nickel,,, bury it at 5" inches,, sweep with Deus fast program,,,user should get a good tone corresponding to where they have the nickel range set up tonally along with a pretty good actual nickel reading Vdi reading on meter.

Next bury the nickel at 6" and repeat sweeping,,,paying close attention to tone and meter reading.
Bury at 7" and try again,,,,,,eventually you see see the nickel go meter reading wise into the 90s range and with higher tone.

Once you get to the level depth wise on this nickel where the nickel provides a 90 plus reading Vdi wise,,,start running your reactivity level down from 3,, and keep silencer at 0 or level -1 when changing,, , then sweep nickel and see if you notice the signal gets stronger,, and meter reading may actually read closer to actual nickel Vdi reading on the meter.

Now remember this experiment above is with Deus fast stock program,,, which uses 18kh approx.

A person should repeat the above using 4 or 8 kHz,,,,using the same nickel---- notice the differences

Next repeat the entire experiment with a silver or clad dime,,,,notice how much deeper and stronger the dime is compared to nickel using 4 and 8 kHz freqs


After you do this,,, do the following,,,get a clad dime and a nickel or pull tab.

Go back to Deus fast stock program,,lay the dime and tab or nickel down on clean ground very near one another...

Sweep both close positioned targets and listen,, and notice the meter--- you should see 76 approx in the meter.

Pick up one of the objects one a t a time and sweep the dime solo and listen and look at the meter,,,sweep either the nickel or tab solo and watch meter and note tone.

When you sweep both targets together,,,notice how dirty sounding the tone is

Pick up dime and leave either the tab or nickel there solo,and sweep again,,,note meter reading.

Go to notch in menu, expert setting,, notch 00- a couple points higher than what either the tab or nickel was you swept,,,if you use nickel true reading is 64 so dial to 69,,meaning notch 00-69,,, then sweep the dime and say nickel and listen,,meter should still be reading 76 approx,,and tone should still sound dirty,,,so go back to notch setting and adjust notch up,,meaning notch from,,, 00- 76,,, now sweep the nickel and dime and listen,,,tone should be clean high tone.

With this particular notch setting,, again sweep nickel solo,,,nickel should be gone,,, sweep dime solo,,dime should sound off,,replace the nickel and dime back on ground about 1/4" to 1/2" apart and sweep again-- notice how the dime is ringing in,,with nickel lying close..

Remember a tab or nickel can be used to simulate a junk target.


Now remember even though the notch setting of 00-76 above knocked out a surface nickel and tab,,and let the dime through,,,if a hunting situation,,this may or may not happen.
What do I mean by this. Remember a deep/deeper nickel the way Deus is engineered,,,it will depending on settings, ground depth, ground minerlals,,,the nickel will start IDing in the 90s range,,meaning even with the notch setting here,,,deep/ deeper nickels can sound off tone wise--- now granted an operator won't know it is a deeper nickel,, but with experience an operator will realize it is a deeper nonferrous target---- remember unless dirt has been moved around,,,more trash targets are generally more shallow ve deeper.

Something else,,Deus is a good loose dirt machine-- IMO the best made I've run---- meaning freshly buried tests are much closer to real life digs in the field compared to most other detectors ---- so a new user if it will aid them,,by all means bury some targets and experiment,,,,just remember results can be faluty to skewed if one doesn't realize some iron and nails are present where the decide to do their test.

And operator can also do test with coins and nails,,,and even 3D test with nails sitting above coin levels and get some ideal of what to expect/ how the Deus reacts.

The horseshoe will help a person out sometimes in telling a person they have a nonferrous target--- but horseshoe can switch sides at times on targets mixed with iron,,, and an op can be fooled if they base their digging solely on horseshoe reading...

A lot of things can be learned about the Deus by doing some test,,the one thing though that can't be seen many times with test,,,is getting the iron wrap signals on old buried iron,,,once you disturb this most times generally it will npread correct and not provide the error signal--- wrapping and bringing better than average tone.

Iron wrap signals can usually be sorted out,,,by how they sound,,and how the report as the coil approaches,,,blunt sounding and fast to ramp up,, not smooth are the best clues.


This info and experiments if they are done--- will shed a lot of light on the mighty Deus.

 

[unearth]

Squirrel1, "an operator needs to come over the top about 10-12 points Vdi wise--- doing this will clean the Deus tone up ( not meter reading) on targets where the Deus is blending signals." Could you explain this statement. I can't figure out what you mean by "over the top". Thanks

 

[calabash digger]

I think he means if a junk target reads 53 notch above that number 10 or 12 points on the notch so you would notch up to 65 or so to clean the signal up. dont quote me on that!

 

[squirrel1]

Squirrel1, "an operator needs to come over the top about 10-12 points Vdi wise--- doing this will clean the Deus tone up ( not meter reading) on targets where the Deus is blending signals." Could you explain this statement. I can't figure out what you mean by "over the top". Thanks

Very easy,,,when hunting modern trash sites,,say a tab and dime are close to one another--- when you swing over,, an op will never now the dime is there,,,meaning the tab will drive the meter reading down,,in my example above to around 76,,, and Deus will blend the tones as well--- tone will sound like a junk metal target sound wise.

So if a person just tries to notch a solo tab signal out,,,sure solo tabs in a trashy site won't sound off unles deep. But a tab next to dime,,op can't see or hear. Now granted a person in a dig all mindset-- this all means nothing to them really,,,but if a person can notch over the lower conductor junk target ( actually more like notching just slightly above blended signal),, an operator can use just their ears to find the high conductors-- and meter reading on combined targets would be lying to operator-- so sound is the key.

Can some good targets get missed by doing this?? Certainly..but how many pull tabs will an op dig generally,,and how many copper and silver coins may be found???

I have done test,,,and made some finds comparing to another higher priced I won't say--- no contest. Person with Deus can hunt behind folks using this higher priced,,if they are cherry picking,,they are leaving high conductors in the ground.

Something else here,,, using Deus with this higher than junk target notch setting,,,any signal heard that is chopped substantially ,,, dig-- the reason is if the junk signal and say a high conductive coin are real close,,and or deeper--- the Deus may only give a hint of a signal. But overall this process of using notch will help,,,and the bonus here is,,,an operator is not sacrificing any depth. Solo deeper even lower and higher conductors will sound off.

Now I don't want folks to think this is the only way to hunt a site and be productive,,,and in sites loaded with nails,,some targets will get missed,,,but in those sites where pull tabs and such as numerous,,,or a person wants a shot at so,e coins with limited digging-- this will do nicely.

And remember my example above involved 18khz,,other freqs can be used,,but different notching is needed.

Also,,for anyone out there hunting in sites with loads of nails---- if you are running any other freq besides 18khz,,, watch out,,you are likely leaving finds in the ground.

18khz will see more masked targets in and around iron-- no matter the conductivity of the nonferrous target...
Sure you can use other freqs,, and make some good finds in iron sites--- but 18khz is the king of the mountain. Make no mistake. A $1 dollar gold coin in a site with many nails and iron bits-- it's survival rate is heavily favored if an op uses anything but 18khz--- and this has less to do with the $1 gold coin being a low conductor,, but more to do with how the Deus separates in iron using 18khz.

 

[sprchng]

The Deus sucks in modern trash , just resign yourself to digging all those solid hits.

 

[martygene]

this was/is a great discussion. much food for thought. I knew the Deus blended targets but it really didn't sink in til i read this discussion. i've had my Deus for 2 years and have yet to get good at finding good targets in heavy trash.
eg: lowering TX to 2, raising sens, running reativity to 3 and lowering silencer to -1

get me in where it's a little open and I'll find stuff deep. I will have to give the notch thing a try. so far i have only used 12K so do you think that going to 18K will make things a bit better?

 

[squirrel1]

this was/is a great discussion. much food for thought. I knew the Deus blended targets but it really didn't sink in til i read this discussion. i've had my Deus for 2 years and have yet to get good at finding good targets in heavy trash.
eg: lowering TX to 2, raising sens, running reativity to 3 and lowering silencer to -1

get me in where it's a little open and I'll find stuff deep. I will have to give the notch thing a try. so far i have only used 12K so do you think that going to 18K will make things a bit better?

My experiences are,,18khz definitely the best in and around iron and nails.

For just separation in nonferrous trash-- I don't think 18khz has as much as an advantage vs hunting in iron,,but still has some.

You see,,,these blended sounds provided over say a comingled dime and tab--- a lot of times ,, other detectors will do the same,,,but other detectors have blocks to use to notch,,where Deus has exact setting possible.

Also Deus separation and speed,,again other detectors will be shy here most times.

And a smaller coil here isn't really a true answer here either,,,and smaller coil will yield less depth-- so there are drawbacks.

Deus users need to do these tests,,and try this,,, put your dime down,, a nickel,,,and get your Deus to give the nice clean tone on the dime,,,then add a pull tab to the mix-- this will complicate matters for the Deus,,,but keep arranging the coins,,and an op will see,,,,just how close the nickel and tab can be to dime in different arrangements.
Also remember the test here are same plane test--- and to have junk targets and good targets on the same plane or close to is very possible,,but if say a tab towers distance wise above a deeper coin--- this is a very troublesome target ( dime) for any detector to hit,,even the Deus-- but Deus still does possess a slight advantage here however slight over most other detectors.

 

[Metal Magnet]

all i have to add to this is listen to seasoned folks on this forum - they know what they are talking about.

Also, and this is super important, give the Deus a chance and you will be rewarded. Amazing machine - but you have to put the time in to learn it. I typically recommend people hunt easier grounds at first to learn the machine. Slowly progress into trashier areas (or quickier if you are putting lots of hours in) and increase your skill.

 

[Stix]

We have to keep things in perspective here. The deus is a fast machine but it is not the deepest machine out there. You have to have some give and take. The ground conditions and angle of coin make a big difference. You can't beat a deus for speed. You can in depth. It is a deeper machine. There are better for depth though. You will always hear stories of 12 to 14" coins. Take them with a grain of salt.

 

[calabash digger]

which machines are deeper?

 

[Stix]

which machines are deeper?

We don't include other brand detectors and start comparing in xp forums. It's just not a good idea.

 

[squirrel1]

N/ t

 

[Stix]

It just depends on the ground conditions. Water hunting salt/fresh. etc etc Just don't want someone new to the machine wondering why he is not always grabbing 12" coins or giving up on a great detector. As you get better you can get more depth but just starting out and depending on where you are hunting makes a big difference. Some machines handle different ground and water conditions better.

 

[unearth]

I think he means if a junk target reads 53 notch above that number 10 or 12 points on the notch so you would notch up to 65 or so to clean the signal up. dont quote me on that!

Ok, got it. Unfortunately, when doing so at this junk target number, 53, you will definitely notch out some gold.

 

[squirrel1]

I think he means if a junk target reads 53 notch above that number 10 or 12 points on the notch so you would notch up to 65 or so to clean the signal up. dont quote me on that!

Ok, got it. Unfortunately, when doing so at this junk target number, 53, you will definitely notch out some gold.

Sure a person after gold jewelry and smaller gold coins,,, notch can get rid of them,,,,but a person chasing high conductors,,,this use of notch can cut down and both identify high conductors targets mingled with trash targets.