First Try Out With The ATX ??

[Fishers Ghost]

OK Here are my first hands on impressions of the ATX. in Australia.

Might not be what you expected.......And definitely not what I was expecting..

The ground iron mineral conditions were extreme and probably worse that many of our gold fields....So, maybe it was an unfair test.

I was not able to take the ATX to the beach this time.

The detector is not as bulky as I had imagined it to be but it is an overkill for what it is and the control box and entire set up could have been reduced to something like the Infinium or a more conventional detector lay out and still be rugged and waterproof.
It is compact when folded and stowed away.
The detector runs a smooth clean threshold while over mild iron mineralisation and salt conditions.

I tested the ATX in extremely tough iron mineralised ground and will admit now that I was very disappointed with the machines ability in this particular area which was not easy for me to get to, due mainly to my crappy knees, crook back and being totally out of condition and the day being hot and muggy. So by the time I arrived there I was not in any mood for a poor performing metal detector. The place is easy to get to for fit folk and is only approx 1.5 kays from a picnic ground, but for me now, it is a tad tough.

I actually ran out of puff at about the half way mark (Up the hill) so that is where I tried the detector. The ground was rough, rocky with enough iron in a square meter to build several Titanics.

Turned her on in the factory preset mode and proceeded to do a ground balance, there was zero EMI. Bounced the coil until the threshold settled down.I began to sweep.
Well away she went like a donkey on a barbie hot plate, GBd again and again but the ground was simply too variable for the detector to keep up. Tried all of the tracking speeds, all levels of sensitivity and even dialed in a bit of discrimination like I sometimes have to do with the Infinium..(My Infinium works way better on this hill than the ATX)

Even with the Threshold at 4 with disc at 3 I could not get the coil closer than approx 4 inches above the ground when the ATX Hee Hawed itself like a crazy thing with every movement of the coil. I tried several different locations on that hill side but the ATX was literally un usable.. I only tried the detector on that hill for about 15 minutes and that was all it took for me to realise that I was wasting my time and called it quits.

I then tried the ATX at a nice gentle wussy sandy beach river picnic ground and it performed absolutely beautifully. Silky smooth threshold, perfect GB buckets of depth on real handy items like bobby pins and tent pegs and baby nappy safety pins.:

Conclusion:
I am unable to comment on how well or poorly this detector will perform in the Aussie iron mineralised gold fields and I doubt that I will be rehiring the detector in order to find out. I suggest you talk to those who are using the detector in the gold fields already.

Wherever you can get this machine to run smooth and GB with no EMI it is capable of excellent performance and really does ping small sub gram nuggs very well. at around twice the depth of the Finny. (Air tested only) so long as you are able to run the sensitivity at between 10 and 13 (Max).

I feel that a sens setting of 8 on the ATX is about the same as the Infinium in normal operation, going by air tests only.

A 10 oz lead nugg that I used as test piece in my back yard at a depth of 17 inches was detected under very bad EMI conditions and at 20 inches the EMI overrode the Target signal. ATX could not eliminate the EMI in my back yard any better than my INF..

Sorry it is not a flash report guys. I guess I was a bit disappointed with the performance in the tough ground and as such I was not able to get very enthusiastic about even writing anything at all.

Having said all of that; There are people here in Australia using the ATX on the beaches and in the gold fields who are very happy with the detectors performance and in particular, on small gram and sub gram nuggs.

PS.
Almost forgot.
The coil mounting method is nothing short of ridiculous and the coil continually but slowly, drooped downwards during detecting no matter how tight I tensioned the adjuster screw. It was a hotish day at 32 C which may account for it due to the rubber type friction mounting, but this is the first coil on any detector that I have had where this problem occured, and I was using the small DD, Imagine trying to keep the big gun Mono straight an level.

 

[ABKen]

What coil were you using? DD or one of the monos?

Sorry I didn't read your post well enough the first time. I see you were running the DD. I wonder if the mono would work better on your hot ground.

 

[Fishers Ghost]

Was using the DD.

 

[ABKen]

See my edited post above. First time through I missed you were using the DD. I wondered how mono would work on hot ground.

 

[Fishers Ghost]

I am guessing that the large Mono would be tradgic.
If I could figure out how to put up a pic on this forum I would be able to let you see the type of ground I was trying to detect.
It is in the vacinity of an old copper mine.("Paddys River Mine"). This is in an area of large magnetite outcrops in addition to the magnetite there is copper, lead zinc, silver and gold. The area is highly mineralised and is a great attraction for amateur mineralogists

 

[lytle78]

Unless I'm very much mistaken, I saw this previously on an OZ Forum. Over there "Fisher's Ghost " is apparently known as "Adrian SS". The consensus was that no metal detector could have worked there and in fact, no other detector was tried there.

Here's one of the replies to his post - from the forum manager, in fact.

"C'mon Adrian,don't you think you're being a little harsh in the testing process,by testing the ATX over a Highly concentrated iron stone hill? That's like taking a pea shooter to hunt down elephant,it just don't work. The GPXs will be just as noisy over similar ground conditions. Both will false over basaltic rock formations or heavily impregnated,high in ironstone loads.For your average mineralized detecting areas within the golden triangle,the ATX will work and work well.It's just not fully on par with the GPX series detectors when it comes to larger gold at depth.Both you'll find have their trade offs,but you can't say that the Garret ATX wont work well on a variety of areas within the gold fields of Australia."

 

[Fishers Ghost]

HI Rick.

I have tested many detectors in that area and few have been able to function there to a usable degree.
The only two metal detectors that I have that can be used there and can detect button and coin size targets are the Tesoro LST and my Infinium. The Infinium has detected brass buttons in that ground down to 8 inches and I am certain that it will go much deeper than that. I was able to put the Inf coils to the ground without any sort of an overload signal. It did produce some loud long drawn out low tones occasionally but not anywhere near enough to make me want to pack up and go home.

I was expecting the ATX to also be usable there with the sensitivity set low and the GB in fast track but it was a no go. What surprised me even more was the fact that I could not get the coil any closer than approx 4 inches above the ground when it would signal loud combinations of High /Lows and Low /High tones in all areas.

 

[John-Edmonton]

I have monitored many forums around the globe on the ATX, the majority comment on the ATX as a great alternative to the $5,000.00 machines, as in most cases (but not all) it is at good. Simplicity at it's best. Fisher's Ghost's post is very radical, biased not in line with experienced users comments.

 

[Fishers Ghost]

HI John,
I am in no way biased, I simply called it as I found it. I was the one person on the Aussie forum that was spouting how great the ATX appeared to be after reading reports from the States and watching several videos produced in Australia and the USA.

There is no question at all that the machine works beautifully in lesser iron mineralised areas that have fairly evenly distributed mineralisation but where the mineral density varies foot by foot as it does in many of our gold fields, the detector cannot not keep up with the mineral changes and so was sounding off all of the time. There was no way at all of picking out a good target from in amongst all of that noise..

The detector I used is fairly new being used only three times at the time I hired it and it had already found gold for previous operators. who used the detector in fairly quiet ground down on our South coast.gold fields.

It is a case of using the right detector for the area being searched and in the case concerned the Infinium was a far better detector.

 

[Night Crawler]

Hmm, just an off the wall thought here FG, is you mentioned the machine was going nuts sounding off with HI - Lo then Lo - Hi tones after you ground balanced it a few times, as the machine being more sensitive to the smaller metals than the INF and that maybe the ATX was doing it's job properly and the way the machine was made to sound off on small metal pieces it sees under the coil.

Maybe that's what the machine was telling you it was seeing. The fact that you were getting both Hi - Lo then Lo - Hi from the ATX tells me it's seeing different metals in the ground other than Magnetite. Magnetite is a world wide occurance and their doesn't seem to be to much of a problem GBng it out with the ATX in other places. If you could just concentrate on one tone (Hi - Lo) or (Lo - Hi) dig it and see what it gives you, if it isn't any good, then focus on the other tone, dig that, and see what that gives you.

That's the way I would have done it myself before giving my final conclusion on it.

The two different tones you were getting tells me the machine was seeing a lot more than one metal in the ground at any given time and maybe why other people who have gone into that same area haven't been successful their (misreading what the machine is telling them).

I know AUS is Brutal in some areas for metal detectors no doubt about that, maybe give her another go at it and just dig some different tone samples to make sure that's all. Just an off the wall thought here FG for what it's worth.

 

[Fishers Ghost]

HI Night Crawler.

Fair enough comments.

Digging targets and finding out what is causing a detector to sound off is something I have become fairly good at after 54 years in this game and having worked through 48+ detectors and several field tests.

You can rest asured that I checked for what was under the coil. I am well aware of what causes High/Low tones on the Infinium and the ATX is a similar but far more sensitive detector.
The was no metal other than natural ferrous minerals where I tried the ATX. The ground is simply extremely variable and iron mineralised.

Here is a bit of info re the area concerned:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geology_of_the_Australian_Capital_Territory

Scroll down to the heading "Mining" and see the bit about "Paddys River"
Meanwhile I will try to find a link to better information.

A bit more info here:
http://www.johnevans.id.au/Pages/Paddys%20River%20mine.pdf

 

[WaterWalker]

Most of the reading was Greek to me. But it has given me a much better respect for different detectorist using a detector in many varying areas than I have searched. I guess we all tend to think we all detect under the same conditions...salt and fresh water, sand and dirt. We have no understanding of what the conditions half way around the word are. We all know what we know, which in the scope of the earth's area is nothing. You can bet I will to be as judgemental as I have thought of being. Glad I have not jumped in where I knew nothing about the entire situation. Thanks for opening my eyes to places beyond my small area on the planet.

 

[bearkat4160]

Interesting report there Adrian. I have encountered very bad iron here in N. California that made the ATX a bit noisy also. It was kinda like using a VLF in hot ground but not that bad and it was just up to the operator to figure out what was dirt or target. One thing I had experienced was that if the coil connector is not tight or even just a bit loose the ATX will be noisier. The coil conector has to be TIGHT AND SNUG!

From what I have read from the other forums a GPX does not even fair well in this ground you were at. So your report is kinda on the neagative side. Maybe you should go to the common gold fields and give it a try.
As far as the Infinium working better...I believe it has a better ground balance circuit than the ATX but my Infinium is not even close to the sensitivity of my ATX.

Hope you can take an ATX to more average Australia dirt and give it a whirl, geez if the GPX performs poorly at that spot, why did you even try the ATX? Did you think it has super powers more than a GPX?
The GPX 5000 is still the King, but my ATX is pretty close and in most conditions would not miss the gold that a GPX runs over.

To close the gap on the GPX performance, Garrett needs to make a mono 12"x10" coil! Same size as the stock DD, but a mono! My test with the 8" mono on the 5.4 oz nugget in hot dirt at 18" did better than the stock DD.

Bearkat

 

[Fishers Ghost]

HI Alan.
Well I guess as things have turned out, that the try out in such bad ground was an unfair test for the ATX but because the Infinium was very usable there I was hoping that the ATX would go a bit deeper even with the sensitivity wound down a little. The detector is very similar to the Finny and if it could be used in that ground and be more sensitive then it would have an edge over the 5000 in extreme nasty ground which I believe the Infinium has.
Any detector that can work ground that stymies the 5000 is going to be an desirable item in particular areas.
The ATX is capable of Ground balancing iron minerals better than the Infinium but where the ground changes from foot to foot and even inch to inch.
The small inner coil of the DD picks these changes out easily and so the GB tracking and threshold was jumping about like a cat on a hot tin roof..
In retrospect, as someone suggested, maybe using the big mono may have helped smooth things out.

I will admit that I did not check the coil connection. I used the detector as it was supplied to me.........This was probably a mistake on my part.
I will not be trying the ATX on our beaches because it clearly is performing exceptionally well for that type of metal detecting as shown by a couple of our more experienced beach hunters.
Even though people have told me not to bother trying the 5000 on the area. I will be giving it a go with the 11 inch DD , but not until I have learnt a lot more about this detectors settings and operation.

 

[Night Crawler]

Thanks for the links FG. My comment above wasn't to question your ability or experience FG, it was simply giving another view of the picture you painted in your first post. I do greatly respect your dedication to this hobby for that many years and my hat goes off to you for that. Whether we have 50 + years of experience or 3+ years of experience (like myself), a new machine is just that, a new machine with a new personality and langauge that we all must learn from an entry level.

I really admire you Aussies having to deal with such adverse soil conditions in your country and making a go of it, that in itself truly amazes me FG.

Have you thought of using a mono coil FG? As bearcat mentioned, maybe the mono might handle things a bit better (I'm just guessing at this point). What type of coil did the Infinium have in that area FG?

I'm reach'n here FG, but I would like to see you have a better experience with the ATX than what you have at this point.

Everyone/thing deserves a second chance agreed?

 

[bearkat4160]

As far as the auto ground track setting being engaged - Garrett has told me that the actually speed of the ATX tracking on "fast" is similar to the Infinium in slow setting...

I have used it in rapid changing ground in California, it helps a little but you have to grnd bal the ATX before it actually starts to track - which is strange.

BK

 

[Fishers Ghost]

G/Day NC.

I used the large DD and Mono and the 8 inch mono on the Infinium; They all performed well but I prefered the 8 inch because it was easier to manage in and around the rocky ground.
Maybe I will give the ATX another try but definately not in the Paddys River area because it was clear that the ground was beyond the ability of the ATX to cope with.
Using the large mono may well smooth the ground noise out a bit but that coil is impractical in the rough terrain.

I recall saying on another thread that anybody who thought the ATX was heavy must be a bit of a wuss.
Well it did not feel heavy on the tryout but two days later I found myself at the chiro getting my shoulder fixed up plus an hour with a thai massage lady who loosend up my neck muscles. So I guess it was heavier than I thought.

 

[Fishers Ghost]

HI BK,

I did GB first. I did try the four ground tracking speeds but was not able to notice a difference between them over that ground.
In Manual GB I was ground balancing every couple of foot or so, which is likely the main reason I called it quits after just 15 minutes.
I am begining to think that the problem may have been the very sensitive DD coil and that if I had used the small mono instead of the DD, at a sensitivity of between 4 and 8 the results may have been better..... That is just a guess though.

 

[GoldChaser]

15 minutes can hardly be considered a fair test. I've spent over 100 hours on my TDI and MXT and am still learning unique ways to ground balance and set up both machines in differing conditions. And with a machine with as many variables as the ATX, it could take a very long time to go through all of the subtle setting, and coil, combinations to find the best one(s) for a specific site. Then again, maybe I'm just a little slow.