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gain
- Thread starter dm
- Start date
txbluesman
New member
I run at Gain of 7 with stock, X8 and X5 coils.
Dick from NC
New member
To understand gain, it amplifies the signal. The more gain you have the more it will amplify the weak signal but at the same time it will amplify the loud signal also. If you have a deep target it may sound soft,so the more you turn up the gain the louder it will sound. At the same time it will amplify the shollow large targets. The higher the gain the more chance of falsing. I have an Explorer XS and I run the gain at 7 and if I get a soft target I may run it up to 8 or 9 to hear it, after I dig it I run the gain back down. Some people don't run high gain because they want to hear the soft deep targets. Sometimes you may get a iffy signal so you turn up the gain to see if something is there. The best way to understand gain is to get a good target and turn the gain up 1 number and listen to the signal, then turn it up another number and listen, and another number, and another number, you get the idea. You can also set you gain higher and see what happens.
A little tip on sensitivity. At the beach when you go from dry sand to wet sand you will hear some noise, each sweep you get the same noise. Most people will turn down the sensitivity down to get ride of the noise, but when you reduce sens. you reduce depth. I run sens. up almost all the way and listen through the noise and when you get a target, there will be no doubt that its a good target. This is something you will have to try to see what I'm talking about. Its not unusual to get a quarter at 12-14 inches or a dime at 10 or more. I run a Sunray 12" coil and wouldn't run anything else. When I run higher sens. I dig the targets that other people cann't hear.
You have to learn how to push your detector to get the most out of it. Happy hunting.
A little tip on sensitivity. At the beach when you go from dry sand to wet sand you will hear some noise, each sweep you get the same noise. Most people will turn down the sensitivity down to get ride of the noise, but when you reduce sens. you reduce depth. I run sens. up almost all the way and listen through the noise and when you get a target, there will be no doubt that its a good target. This is something you will have to try to see what I'm talking about. Its not unusual to get a quarter at 12-14 inches or a dime at 10 or more. I run a Sunray 12" coil and wouldn't run anything else. When I run higher sens. I dig the targets that other people cann't hear.
You have to learn how to push your detector to get the most out of it. Happy hunting.
I like a low gain of 4 with Koss headphones. It also maintains a steady and smooth sound, with a good lock on numbers and deep targets sound deep and clear.
Might not suit some, but for me "the proof is in the pudding".
The low tone threshold of 3 contrasts very well the higher tones of good targets.
Chris
My following program, using a low gain of 4.
MINELAB EXPLORER II
CHRIS LAUNDY
PLATYPUS 12x8
DETECTOR MODE ADVANCED
DISPLAY MENU
SENSITIVITY FUNCTION MANUAL
SENSITIVITY VALUE 24
THRESHOLD 8
IRON MASK VALUE -16
NOISE CHANNEL 5
DISPLAY TYPE DIGITAL
DISPLAY CONTRAS 10
LEARN CURSOR SIZE OFF
EDIT FRAME SIZE OFF
SELECT MENU
DISCRIMINATION NAILS ONLY
AUDIO MENU
VOLUME MAX.LIMIT 10
VOLUME GAIN 4
THRESHOLD TONE 3
VARIABILITY 10
AUDIO LIMITS 10
AUDIO SOUNDS FERROUS
OPTIONS
NOISE 5
RESPONSE NORMAL
RECOVERY DEEP
Might not suit some, but for me "the proof is in the pudding".
The low tone threshold of 3 contrasts very well the higher tones of good targets.
Chris
My following program, using a low gain of 4.
MINELAB EXPLORER II
CHRIS LAUNDY
PLATYPUS 12x8
DETECTOR MODE ADVANCED
DISPLAY MENU
SENSITIVITY FUNCTION MANUAL
SENSITIVITY VALUE 24
THRESHOLD 8
IRON MASK VALUE -16
NOISE CHANNEL 5
DISPLAY TYPE DIGITAL
DISPLAY CONTRAS 10
LEARN CURSOR SIZE OFF
EDIT FRAME SIZE OFF
SELECT MENU
DISCRIMINATION NAILS ONLY
AUDIO MENU
VOLUME MAX.LIMIT 10
VOLUME GAIN 4
THRESHOLD TONE 3
VARIABILITY 10
AUDIO LIMITS 10
AUDIO SOUNDS FERROUS
OPTIONS
NOISE 5
RESPONSE NORMAL
RECOVERY DEEP
First off let me say I have only been an Explorer (SE)user for about two months so I don't have the experience a lot of users here have, but the issue of running your sensitivity to the max can actually COST YOU DEPTH...Mike of Va. beach explained this to me & I found him to be 100% correct...I was having problems with the settings at first & was told to turn down the sens. to 22 or so & when I got a weak & DEEP signal that I was pretty sure was a coin, to go ahead & gradually raise then lower the sensitivity until I got the best signal...Also the falsing you are talking about MAY be caused by running the Sens. TOO high....& not at all with anything to do with gain...The gain in reality is nothing more than another volume control...IMHO
I have to politely disagree with your comment, that gain and sensitivity are not related.
Gain, I understand, is used to boost the volume on faint signals, the higher the gain the closer the faint signals are boosted, in relation to intensity of surface targets.
For stability, the sensitivity and gain need to be adjusted together, if the gain is increased the sensitivity needs to be reduced, or, if the gain is reduced the sensitivity can be increased.
I like to know when a target is deep and with experience the likely depth might be quickly judged, also, in some cases it can provide indications with large iron.
On the Explorers I prefer calculated low gain and sensitivity up to 28.
Off course, settings used depend upon site conditions, but this still does not alter the fact that the two functions are co-related.
With my Whites DFX and Red Heat Lightning detectors the sitiuation is somewhat reversed. I start with a high gain, DFX gain 4 and Red Heat gain FULL, I then back-wind sensitivity until falsing is reduced.
My Explorer program with low gain of 4 is shown in my earlier post in this thread.
If you try my program you should notice a higher and smoother stability and the screen ID SMART/DIGITAL locks more positively.
On sites in the UK I have not been aware of any problem in achieving good depth. You may be aware that the Explorer is fitted with a stereo sound card and I use Koss UR-30 headphones without volume control that perhaps are more suited to the higher quality Explorer sound card and fainter deep signals, although those signals might be faint, they are positive and are not missed.
I have not tried a selection of "Hi-Fi" headphones, but I shall. Some might suit the quality of the sound card in the Explorer, pehaps more so, than the more durable headphones designed primarily for metal detecting, especially those with built-in sound limiters and volume controls???
Amongst a selection of metal detector headphones tried (
, in my opinion some have been useless on the Explorer and most have had a flat response compare to the Koss UR-30 which to my ears seem to have a better seperation of tones in the high frequencies, the frequencies I am listening for on those faint and narrow deep signals.
I have measured a coin English 10p at a depth of 13.5" using low gain and sensitivity 28, that is deep enough for me, I don't aspire digging through to Australia.
A Last observation, perhaps, because of less gain distortion my deeper signals can sound less "iffy".
Your opinions both good and bad would be most welcome and of interest to me.
I know I can be narrow minded somtimes with my singular opinions and appreciate that opinions of other can offer widened views, forums are great,in offering this facility.
Gain, I understand, is used to boost the volume on faint signals, the higher the gain the closer the faint signals are boosted, in relation to intensity of surface targets.
For stability, the sensitivity and gain need to be adjusted together, if the gain is increased the sensitivity needs to be reduced, or, if the gain is reduced the sensitivity can be increased.
I like to know when a target is deep and with experience the likely depth might be quickly judged, also, in some cases it can provide indications with large iron.
On the Explorers I prefer calculated low gain and sensitivity up to 28.
Off course, settings used depend upon site conditions, but this still does not alter the fact that the two functions are co-related.
With my Whites DFX and Red Heat Lightning detectors the sitiuation is somewhat reversed. I start with a high gain, DFX gain 4 and Red Heat gain FULL, I then back-wind sensitivity until falsing is reduced.
My Explorer program with low gain of 4 is shown in my earlier post in this thread.
If you try my program you should notice a higher and smoother stability and the screen ID SMART/DIGITAL locks more positively.
On sites in the UK I have not been aware of any problem in achieving good depth. You may be aware that the Explorer is fitted with a stereo sound card and I use Koss UR-30 headphones without volume control that perhaps are more suited to the higher quality Explorer sound card and fainter deep signals, although those signals might be faint, they are positive and are not missed.
I have not tried a selection of "Hi-Fi" headphones, but I shall. Some might suit the quality of the sound card in the Explorer, pehaps more so, than the more durable headphones designed primarily for metal detecting, especially those with built-in sound limiters and volume controls???
Amongst a selection of metal detector headphones tried (
, in my opinion some have been useless on the Explorer and most have had a flat response compare to the Koss UR-30 which to my ears seem to have a better seperation of tones in the high frequencies, the frequencies I am listening for on those faint and narrow deep signals.I have measured a coin English 10p at a depth of 13.5" using low gain and sensitivity 28, that is deep enough for me, I don't aspire digging through to Australia.
A Last observation, perhaps, because of less gain distortion my deeper signals can sound less "iffy".
Your opinions both good and bad would be most welcome and of interest to me.
I know I can be narrow minded somtimes with my singular opinions and appreciate that opinions of other can offer widened views, forums are great,in offering this facility.
Been running mine at 8 and don't know why, I think that's where I settled at back when I first messed with it and haven't changed it since. Now that I got new headphones, I might see if 8 is my number or maybe I'll find a setting that I like better. Anyway, it's 8 for now.
On your hearing, type of headphones, amount of mineralization and also dial in users preferences and ability and you can see what works for one may not for another...Basically its a form of modulated audio and if you set at 5 the shallow will be loud and the deep much softer and will gradually change and at 10 all signals will be loud...Some like to know approx. depth from the get go so therefore use 5 and others want the real deepies to sound off loud so they use 10..I am sure if you asked a bunch of Explorer users you might get a variety of settings. So as always whatever works....for you in your area....
Just a passing note, since I have had my EX II for about one year now and been trying different experiments (most suggestions from reading the forum), I change my Gain to 6 - by far it seems to be the best balance, but pushed the sensitivity to about 24, and Recovery to Deep and it has given me MUCH better performance in depth, and doesn't seem to have changed anything shallow - just highlighted the deeper targets. I have gone from 30 down to 20 according to the area I'm in for better stability (I believe the semi-falsing of to much sens WILL make you loose a good target - regardless), but have settled for 22 min to 26 (rough max) for most search areas here (mainly sand based - Northwest Florida).
So far the result from hunting a park I, Savage and Sunzabeach use for our testbed and fall back site, I have pulled the following from two short afternoons there (and all areas have been previously well covered by all three of us, at different angles, temp and wet & dry ground conditions) - a 1895 Indian Head (11"), two Barbers 1905 (6" on edge) & 1916 (11") and five Mercs 38, 2-42,2-44 (all 10" & plus).
The sensitivity helped, but the others here are correct, it is easy to overdo it and ruin it, so you have to find the falsing, and back down from it, but the Gain set at 6 has seemed to be the best, by still allowing me to hear (using the KOSS Headphones) the deeper targets clearly, but still knowing they are deep besides the reading and good to have the depth gauge and the sounds tell me the same thing. I didn't think I could go that deep and be a strong clear signal.
For the beach, I run the sensitivity no more than 22 but generally around 20, and have (without falling sand to rebury it) found quarters over 20" - seriously, and many-many times, including after meeting someone with a nice Fisher, and him swinging away from me, asked him if he wanted to dig the quarter that he just went over, and pulled one about 13 or 14 inches down - AND he did not seemed to be pleased at me (Oh well, I really wasn't trying to be mean) and the look he gave me was not - well not pleasing.
Lastly (since so bloody long - sorry all) - SLOW SWEEPS, especially with the higher sensitivity and to assist the gain to let it work for you. That was the hardest thing of all to learn to control.
Good luck all - and I had fun razing my hunting buddies with what was my FIRST Indian Head! That we had all missed more than a dozen or times before.
Krusty
(EX II)
So far the result from hunting a park I, Savage and Sunzabeach use for our testbed and fall back site, I have pulled the following from two short afternoons there (and all areas have been previously well covered by all three of us, at different angles, temp and wet & dry ground conditions) - a 1895 Indian Head (11"), two Barbers 1905 (6" on edge) & 1916 (11") and five Mercs 38, 2-42,2-44 (all 10" & plus).
The sensitivity helped, but the others here are correct, it is easy to overdo it and ruin it, so you have to find the falsing, and back down from it, but the Gain set at 6 has seemed to be the best, by still allowing me to hear (using the KOSS Headphones) the deeper targets clearly, but still knowing they are deep besides the reading and good to have the depth gauge and the sounds tell me the same thing. I didn't think I could go that deep and be a strong clear signal.
For the beach, I run the sensitivity no more than 22 but generally around 20, and have (without falling sand to rebury it) found quarters over 20" - seriously, and many-many times, including after meeting someone with a nice Fisher, and him swinging away from me, asked him if he wanted to dig the quarter that he just went over, and pulled one about 13 or 14 inches down - AND he did not seemed to be pleased at me (Oh well, I really wasn't trying to be mean) and the look he gave me was not - well not pleasing.
Lastly (since so bloody long - sorry all) - SLOW SWEEPS, especially with the higher sensitivity and to assist the gain to let it work for you. That was the hardest thing of all to learn to control.
Good luck all - and I had fun razing my hunting buddies with what was my FIRST Indian Head! That we had all missed more than a dozen or times before.
Krusty
(EX II)I use the standard 10". Heavy after a while, but I like it a bit over the 8" Savage & Sunzabeach use for just that wee little bit of depth gain, but they still get good depth with their Sunrays.
If I'm running a beach line at an angle, that little bit more of weight wants to hurt ya' though.
I have had to adapt, that's why I'm interested in the WOT Coil, but don't know if it will really help or not.
Otherwise, nice posts and reading from you all.
Krusty(EX II)
If I'm running a beach line at an angle, that little bit more of weight wants to hurt ya' though.
I have had to adapt, that's why I'm interested in the WOT Coil, but don't know if it will really help or not.
Otherwise, nice posts and reading from you all.
Krusty
(EX II)