Gave the F2 a short little run.

[salmonriverhotrock]

We have been over a 100 degrees each day for a while but went out in the yard this morning to get a first feel for the F2. Around 4 years ago, I put together sort of a test patch but have not needed it or used it in a long time so kind of forgot the exact spot. I did however recall a Quarter was the last coin to the right of the outer row as I had faced putting it together.

My first coil to try out on the F2 is the 11" DD and it found and identified the Quarter running full sensitivity and no discrimination at 4" that is or about what I planted it. I moved on to another area of the yard listening to the various tones but got in an location that it just went bonkers. I lifted the coil up, turned down the sensitivity all the way and put it back down to the ground but it was still going crazy. After a bit and moving away, it was back to normal. I reset for full sensitivity and worked my way back to that location from another direction and it did it again, even raised in the air. I again reduced the sensitivity and moved away and all was back to normal.

I went to another location in the yard not far from that one and got a hit on what may be a copper penny at 4" and another that may be a Zinc at 4". I will explain in the next paragraph.

This evening, I took my BH Pioneer 505 with an 8" concentric coil through the same locations, sensitivity all the way up, no discrimination. It found and identified the Quarter at 4". I went over to the location the F2 went bonkers and it ran the area like normal, sounding on a few low tone targets. No chatter what so ever. I then went over to the two Penny (?) locations. Now my 505 only has 3 tones but, the display has a marked place for a Zinc and another for a copper 1 cent or Dime and gives a lower tone for a Zinc and a higher for a Copper or Dime. The F2 has 4 tones but only one display marked Zinc that is for both Zinc and Copper pennies. The F2 does however, give a lower tone for Zinc and a higher tone for a Copper under the same display mark. The bad part is, if you Notch out the Zinc on the F2, you notch out both Zinc and Copper. The BH 505 has them separated so if you want to hunt copper, you can Notch out Zinc. Anyhow, both machines are at least by Tones and depth, telling me the same thing and I have also checked the tones by open air testing. I just have not dug them up yet to confirm the targets because I want to play with this some more with an 8" concentric coil on the F2.

As for the F2 going bonkers, it ran just wonderful this evening in the heat over the same locations, 2 and 3 times. This is just my hunch and based on cold weather metal detecting. This morning, my F2 came out of a cooler environment than outside was. This evening, the F2 had been outside for a few hours in the shade. The BH Pioneer 505 however, came right outside from an air conditioned environment. Now I have run a very sensitive all metal Gold Detector in all kinds of weather and one thing it don't like is being made to operate while it is trying to acclimate. Until it equalizes, you are constantly re-setting it. I'm suspicious this may have been the culprit. Down here in the Salmon River canyon, we have NO cell phone signals at my location. There is buried power lines for the well, sprinkler system, and for the houses and I know I was very near the one that services the well but it did not repeat what happened this morning. It has been my understanding that the F2 is very sensitive and so it is my thought the problem was not EMI but the F2 was simply acclimating to the temperature change. If it was an issue of Iron and minerals, I would be extremely surprised as my experience with DD coils has been one in that they cut through higher iron content than a Concentric will with the same sensitivity applied. If this location was that bad for a DD coil, my BH Pioneer 505 at full power with a concentric coil should have went nuts chattering and I have had it do that in some places here in the canyon. On the issue of the F2 becoming unstable, interestingly, I have not seen one write up consider or suggest temperature adjustment. Most everything leans towards EMI as the culprit or defective coil and or machine. I can not picture BH or Fisher having the number of failures I seem to read about. First Texas is not a company full of armatures.

Just for play this morning, the F2 in the all metal Pin Point mode will detect Hot Rocks held in the air or placed on the ground. I tried the F2 out on all of my test Hot Rock collection, even a real small rascal. While in the normal mode of detecting, full or lowest sensitivity, no discrimination, it auto ground balances and does not respond to them at all on the ground. In the all metal Pin Point mode, the F2 will also hit on about a 1/2 lb. bag of river Black Sand (magnetite). In the normal mode of detecting, low or full sensitivity, no discrimination, it auto ground balances and will not respond at all to it on the ground. I tried this by having the coil in the air first before touching and holding the Pin Point and I did the same near the ground off to the side a bit from the bag. Just my opinion but the F2 may have potential for detecting Black Sand pockets but will never out do the White's GMT. I did try detecting a .22 lead bullet on the surface of the ground and I think if anyone is looking to try and find Gold Nuggets at about the same size or smaller than that bullet, you may be in for a real challenge with the 11" DD coil. My White's GM V/Sat will distinctly hit on a half Grain with it's smallest DD coil but for the F2 and the 11" DD, I would think your going to have to possibly be in the Gram sizes for a good repeatable Iron Tone. I did not do this with my BH 505 today because i already know it will hit on Hot Rocks and Black Sand. Some time ago, I also while doing air testing on the BH 505, saw what a coin behind a Hot Rock would detect like. I can not recall though if I tried this on the ground but it was amazing how it effected identity of the coins or missed them completely. Not all Hot Rocks are equal but I thought I determined that a Hot Rock can partly or completely mask a coin under it no matter how small the Hot Rock as the auto ground balance will balance it out.

What I also found this morning with the F2, there is a potential for it to want to Tone identify a Zinc and a Copper penny very near each other just on the surface of the ground, as a Zinc tone. I just could not get the F2 to over ride a Zinc Tone and distinctly Tone for a Copper. So if you get a good Zinc Tone but with a broken Copper tone very near (remember both fall under the Zinc display), you may want to go after the Zinc instead of leaving it and then re-check again for a Copper. This was using the 11" DD coil so the 8 and 4 inch concentric's could have much different results. I did forget to try this same set up with my BH Pioneer 505 this evening, sorry.

I only write this to share, it is by no means scientific in a controlled setting or cast in stone and is only a first run out of the box here in my yard. There is a long ways to go seeing what this F2 machine will do and like any others I have operated all my years, none cease to teach you something new.

 

[REVIER]

I have dug a zillion pennies, (with concentrics, not a DD), and they don't ever fall under the same area for me.
Copper pennies will be in the dime slot at numbers from 68-71...usually 71...and zincs will come in from 58 to 61...usually a 61 most of the time.
The disc on a DD coil is not as sharp so if you are getting these crossed that might be the reason.
There are actually some small differences in those 4 tones, but you have to do a lot of swinging to even begin to hear the differences.
I know a quarter sound in my bones, that was the first one I learned and once you do you never forget it.
Recently I am usually guessing correctly am a copper penny vs. a dime.
They both can come in between 71-73 on mine, but the dine does have a slightly different sound to it....most of the time.

Anything you swing over on the surface will give really jumpy numbers if it is 1/2 inch or closer to the coil.
From 1" or more the targets will stabilize and won't jump too much.
Again, this is with concentrics.
I have 3 coils for my F2 but never swung a DD coil on it.

 

[salmonriverhotrock]

For our discussion, I took the F2 with the 11" DD coil back outside after work this evening and is 99 degrees in the shade, and ran it with a very oxidized Zinc and tarnished Copper Lincoln laid on the surface of the ground where I detect nothing else to be. I honestly have no words to explain but now it reads the Zinc penny with the Zinc display tab and the Copper with the Dime. The tones and numbers are correct and unchanged from yesterday.

Thinking I made an error, I went over to the location my BH 505 and the F2 are both telling me there is a Zinc and a Copper, both at 4 inches deep that I still have not dug up. This evening unlike yesterday, it is now showing a Zinc under the Zinc display tab and the copper under the Dime.

I know what I saw yesterday because I swung over the targets several times and took several looks just like this evening. I have never heard of this but do you think it possible that some electronics have to do a sort of run or break in? Also to add to this, my F2 went from about 70 degrees into 99 degree air temps and did not act up at all, even over the same place as it did yesterday. Not trying to be mean but this F2 is acting like a Female.

So, I guess now we can figure that the 11"DD coil will detect a Zinc and Copper penny correctly in relation to the Display tabs and that the F2 will Notch out the Zinc alone while being able to hunt coppers under the Dime display tab like my BH 505. What ever has happened, I stand very corrected and don't allow my experience to keep you from an 11" DD coil.

 

[REVIER]

I am no Dr., but all I can suggest is some Midol for the F2, and you might think about cutting waaaay back on your meds.

To be serious I have gotten a few copper pennies come in real low in the mid 60's, and a couple of zincs real high almost to dime.
Who knows why, it can be pretty weird out there sometimes.
This is rare, but it could happen.

I became a mostly dig it all hunter type because of this stuff.
If it is solid and doesn't jump more than 2 numbers I dig it, no matter what those 2 numbers are.
I look for gold, always, and any solid signal, (especially at numbers from about 52-54 and below), could be gold.
Some iffy, jumpy numbers could be gold, too, but all the shiny stuff I have found so far has been solid and repeating.

 

[salmonriverhotrock]

Have to comment on this.

There are actually some small differences in those 4 tones, but you have to do a lot of swinging to even begin to hear the differences.
I know a quarter sound in my bones, that was the first one I learned and once you do you never forget it.


I have found this to be absolutely true on my BH Pioneer 505 though it only has 3 tones. Matter of fact, you are the only person I have run across who has had the same experience with factory pre-set tones. I used to believe a turn on and go machine with pre-set tones simply gave you a tone for each set of target segments and that was strictly it, no more, no less. If you have an ear for them, there are subtle but distinct variances in the pre-selected tones for what ever they ball park identify. I believe my experience with the strictly by sound manual set up machines is what helped me find this that you are talking about. Like using a true all metal Gold detector, you are not listening so much for the loudest response as much as you are listening for that repeatable and very distinct one even if it is very faint. So, I also used to think for turn on and go machines, a person did not have to have very good headphones. Now a days I'm re-thinking that a little.

For example though it is a manual setup machine, my Garrett Freedom II instruction manual does not tell you what an aluminum can sounds like but yet I can tell in the all metal Pin Point mode. I had to dig a lot of them up to learn it but the sound is very distinct to me. When I got my BH 505 turn on and go machine, same thing with the instruction manual, what was it I ran into? In the Pin Point mode I can tell with almost 99% certainty, I have a can. Mater of fact with my BH 505, there are times in the Pin Point mode, I know that I have detected a blob of camp fire melted aluminum. Yes, the all metal Pin Point is just one factory pre-set sound to get yourself set over a target but I have learned to discern and get something more out of it that discrimination will not tell me. That goes for both the Garrett and BH 505. Well that is good news to hear you are having a similar experience with your F2 and that I can have hope for the same out of my F2.

Like yourself, I tend to discriminate less or none at all and dig more. I really do like those in the Hobby who detect with a lot of discrimination.

I ran my F2 for a short while before eating breakfast with the guys this morning. I did not dig but knew the spot would be full of trash and wanted to see how the 11" DD coil was going to do. Amazingly, I still have not had a repeat of the other day and was near an overhead power line and I know the Cafe has wireless Internet and lots of traffic was going by. At full sensitivity and no discrimination, I expected the larger coil to hit on multiple targets and just drive me nuts but this F2 has such a fast recovery, I was able to get very good repeatable with very short swing over targets clearly identifying as coins.

We have been well over a week at temperatures 102 up to 105 degrees and after today, it looks like we may drop into the lower 90's. For right now I have just tried a few things to see how this F2 is going to handle but I would like to get a day I can stretch it's legs and with all the coils but the 10" concentric that I don't have yet. I'm thinking this F2 and it's 11"DD coil are going to be great together. I have located missing highway culverts with my BH 505 and it has produced a lot of coin finds for me but for now, I do not think it has the recovery speed like the F2 and that was what possibly allowed me to use that large of a coil though DD coils do run more quiet with less ground interference, allowing more power to the ground. I have used my 4" coil on the BH 505 and it does make a world of difference in heavy trash so if this F2 and 11" DD ran as well as I believe they did, it will achieve some great separation with a 4" coil.