A
Anonymous
Guest
How deep would you expect a good PI unit to pick up a bobby pin in beach sand?
Louis
Louis
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A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Louis,
It will depend on the pin's orientation i.e. whether it is vertical or horizontal. Also the direction that the coil is swept across it can make a difference. Perhaps Bill could run a test when he next goes to the beach and also see if it is possible to identify it as a pin by the audio signal.
Eric.
It will depend on the pin's orientation i.e. whether it is vertical or horizontal. Also the direction that the coil is swept across it can make a difference. Perhaps Bill could run a test when he next goes to the beach and also see if it is possible to identify it as a pin by the audio signal.
Eric.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Thanks, Eric and Bill! I appreciate the response. I feel that I should elaborate a little here....
I have an opportunity to acquire a Minelab F1A4 for a reasonable price. This machine was designed for minimum-metal demining, not for treasure hunting. It does use Minelab's MPS technology. I'm trying to figure out if it has enough depth to make it cost-effective as a beach/gold machine. I have no gold fields to hand to test it on, and precious few beaches (all of them fresh water). I'm trying to acquire some notion of what kind of performance I should expect from a good TH'ing PI machine under these circumstances.
Louis
I have an opportunity to acquire a Minelab F1A4 for a reasonable price. This machine was designed for minimum-metal demining, not for treasure hunting. It does use Minelab's MPS technology. I'm trying to figure out if it has enough depth to make it cost-effective as a beach/gold machine. I have no gold fields to hand to test it on, and precious few beaches (all of them fresh water). I'm trying to acquire some notion of what kind of performance I should expect from a good TH'ing PI machine under these circumstances.
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
If you should get one,I'm shure everyone here would like to know something about Minelab's military demining equipment.
It should be very sensitive as it is designed to locate a small pin in a mine.
Russ
certified detector sales
It should be very sensitive as it is designed to locate a small pin in a mine.
Russ
certified detector sales
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Russ and Louis,
I remember being full of anticipation when I purchased an AN19/2 (AN/PSS-12) pulse induction mine detector. The US Marine Corps FactFile states,
I remember being full of anticipation when I purchased an AN19/2 (AN/PSS-12) pulse induction mine detector. The US Marine Corps FactFile states,
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, guys!
What I can tell you so far:
Detects hairpins down to 4-5 inches.
Screams on a silver ring at ~3 inches.
Gave me a signal on a Canadian $1.00 coin before I even got the search coil over it.
In air testing, picked up a gold chain at ~5 inches. This is a chain that most other detectors will not register.
On one beach, it found some small piece of something that my Vibra-probe wouldn't even register. I never did find that target. (Next time I take the Periscope: it's more sensitive to tiny bits of metal).
This unit is touted as being sensitive to the copper traces in electronically triggered mines. It also is described as having a CYLYNDRICAL detection field, as opposed to a cone. Testing so far bears roughly bears this out. The unit is built like the traditional LBS: it is SOLID. Looks like a Gold Hawk. Coil is 8". I will have the test unit for a few more days, and probably have until about Thurs. this week to decide...
Louis
What I can tell you so far:
Detects hairpins down to 4-5 inches.
Screams on a silver ring at ~3 inches.
Gave me a signal on a Canadian $1.00 coin before I even got the search coil over it.
In air testing, picked up a gold chain at ~5 inches. This is a chain that most other detectors will not register.
On one beach, it found some small piece of something that my Vibra-probe wouldn't even register. I never did find that target. (Next time I take the Periscope: it's more sensitive to tiny bits of metal).
This unit is touted as being sensitive to the copper traces in electronically triggered mines. It also is described as having a CYLYNDRICAL detection field, as opposed to a cone. Testing so far bears roughly bears this out. The unit is built like the traditional LBS: it is SOLID. Looks like a Gold Hawk. Coil is 8". I will have the test unit for a few more days, and probably have until about Thurs. this week to decide...
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Louis,
How does it react on salt wet sand?
Eric.
How does it react on salt wet sand?
Eric.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, Eric!
No idea, I'm afraid... nearest wet salt sand is about 500 miles away, on the other side of the Rockies!!
It's designed for use in Laterite soils, so I figger it OUGHT to be OK... but can't test it. My primary concern is that, being designed for mine detection, it won't have the power of it's gold prospecting siblings. Any idea as to how I could determine this? Would measuring the output pulses give any clues?
Louis
No idea, I'm afraid... nearest wet salt sand is about 500 miles away, on the other side of the Rockies!!
It's designed for use in Laterite soils, so I figger it OUGHT to be OK... but can't test it. My primary concern is that, being designed for mine detection, it won't have the power of it's gold prospecting siblings. Any idea as to how I could determine this? Would measuring the output pulses give any clues?Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Louis,
Wet salt sand is quite different to laterite. The first is conductive and the second is magnetic. A detector that works on one, will not necessarily work on the other. Detectors that are designed for small, low conductivity objects, will generally give a big signal on a conductive beach. Again, with objects, there is always a trade-off. A small object detector will not give the best range on medium/large objects. Measure how far you can detect a nickel in air; that will give a starting point for comparison.
Eric.
Wet salt sand is quite different to laterite. The first is conductive and the second is magnetic. A detector that works on one, will not necessarily work on the other. Detectors that are designed for small, low conductivity objects, will generally give a big signal on a conductive beach. Again, with objects, there is always a trade-off. A small object detector will not give the best range on medium/large objects. Measure how far you can detect a nickel in air; that will give a starting point for comparison.
Eric.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, Eric!
Did the nickle test: one Canadian nickle, air test, solid sigal at 6" (measured), barely detectable at 9 - 10". How does that stack up?
Louis
Did the nickle test: one Canadian nickle, air test, solid sigal at 6" (measured), barely detectable at 9 - 10". How does that stack up?
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi Louis,
Comparable to my Beachscan. Mr Bill did a post on 17th June, quote "A buried nickle was detectable at 11" with a good signal. This was about the same depth it gave laying on top of the ground also. I was using the 8" coil".
Both detectors have an 8in coil although I suspect that the F1A4 is a DD type, or maybe a concentric, while mine is a mono. Wonder how they claim a cylindrical detection field? With the nickel at 10in, is it detectable only under the centreline of the coil, or over the whole coil diameter?
Eric.
Comparable to my Beachscan. Mr Bill did a post on 17th June, quote "A buried nickle was detectable at 11" with a good signal. This was about the same depth it gave laying on top of the ground also. I was using the 8" coil".
Both detectors have an 8in coil although I suspect that the F1A4 is a DD type, or maybe a concentric, while mine is a mono. Wonder how they claim a cylindrical detection field? With the nickel at 10in, is it detectable only under the centreline of the coil, or over the whole coil diameter?
Eric.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, Eric!
The whole coil diameter. I'm not sure how they manage a cylyndrical signal either... The signal at ~10" was a faint fluctuation of the threshold tone. The machine seems to be designed for a very slow sweep speed: the slower the sweep, the more positive the signal.
Louis
The whole coil diameter. I'm not sure how they manage a cylyndrical signal either... The signal at ~10" was a faint fluctuation of the threshold tone. The machine seems to be designed for a very slow sweep speed: the slower the sweep, the more positive the signal.
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Louis
would you have a U.S. nickel around ,I'm not shure if a canadian nickel is the same as a U.S. nickel to a metal detector.
Russ
would you have a U.S. nickel around ,I'm not shure if a canadian nickel is the same as a U.S. nickel to a metal detector.
Russ
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, Russ!
You're right... some Canadian nickles read up in the coin range, rather than down in the nickle range. I just tested the one that I used: it reads the same as a US nickle (at least the Mark 1 thinks so!! <IMG SRC="/forums/images/smile.gif" BORDER=0 ALT=""> )
Louis
You're right... some Canadian nickles read up in the coin range, rather than down in the nickle range. I just tested the one that I used: it reads the same as a US nickle (at least the Mark 1 thinks so!! <IMG SRC="/forums/images/smile.gif" BORDER=0 ALT="
"> )Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Hi, Eric!
What sort of signal pattern do you get from a mono loop?
Louis
What sort of signal pattern do you get from a mono loop?
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
The f1A4 is a close cousin to the SD range, it is in laymans terms a 2200 with all the knobs missing.
It is only available with a 8" Mono, and is built robustly, but is not as good as a 2200 especially on gold.
My understanding was they were never allowed for domestic sales, - did that one fall off the back of a truck?????
John
It is only available with a 8" Mono, and is built robustly, but is not as good as a 2200 especially on gold.
My understanding was they were never allowed for domestic sales, - did that one fall off the back of a truck?????
John
A
Anonymous
Guest
As I understand it, the domestic sale rule is Minelab's. Normally this has the desired effect: however, sometimes things are surplussed by the purchasers. I haappened to be in the right place at the right time. <IMG SRC="/forums/images/smile.gif" BORDER=0 ALT=""> While there are never likely to be very many of these in civilian hands, there will be a few... <IMG SRC="/forums/images/glasses.gif" BORDER=0 ALT="">
Louis
"> While there are never likely to be very many of these in civilian hands, there will be a few... <IMG SRC="/forums/images/glasses.gif" BORDER=0 ALT="">Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Under the "If my head weren't firmly attached, I'd loose it" category.... <IMG SRC="/forums/images/smile.gif" BORDER=0 ALT=""> I should have asked in my previous post! John, you seem fairly familiar with this machine. Could you please tell me:
Will any of the coils for the SD series work with this machine? (With or without connector changes)
Do you know if there are any internal adjustments on the PC board that could be used to increase the sensitivity to gold, and/or to bring the overall performance of the unit up to that of a 2200?
Thanks muchly,
Louis
"> I should have asked in my previous post! John, you seem fairly familiar with this machine. Could you please tell me:Will any of the coils for the SD series work with this machine? (With or without connector changes)
Do you know if there are any internal adjustments on the PC board that could be used to increase the sensitivity to gold, and/or to bring the overall performance of the unit up to that of a 2200?
Thanks muchly,
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Under the "I can't read the email address because the foot in my mouth is blocking my view" department... <IMG SRC="/forums/images/smile.gif" BORDER=0 ALT="">
My sincere apologies, John. I did not twig to the fact that you were THE John Kah from Coiltek. Of COURSE you'd know something about the machine!! :#) That's what I get for posting when I'm mostly asleep...
Good to see you back, by the way!
Louis
">My sincere apologies, John. I did not twig to the fact that you were THE John Kah from Coiltek. Of COURSE you'd know something about the machine!! :#) That's what I get for posting when I'm mostly asleep...
Good to see you back, by the way!
Louis
A
Anonymous
Guest
Louis:
The unit only works on monoloop coils which is no real problem as you I gather live in the US, I can not speak for any Electronic mods, the unit is loosly a 2200 with many of the adjustments unaccessable (I suppose they didnt want the mine clearers to be too bothered about fiddling with knobs).
The only problem with accessory coils is the mechanics of attaching them to the shaft, and fitting of the 2 pin 'mil' plug. I would say a larger mono coil will be a good thing on the unit, (it was sold in limited numbers with an 18" mono coil on it called the F1B2 I think, and works quite well). If there is anything we can help you with - I assume you have purchased the machine, let Doc know - you can find him below.
john
The unit only works on monoloop coils which is no real problem as you I gather live in the US, I can not speak for any Electronic mods, the unit is loosly a 2200 with many of the adjustments unaccessable (I suppose they didnt want the mine clearers to be too bothered about fiddling with knobs).
The only problem with accessory coils is the mechanics of attaching them to the shaft, and fitting of the 2 pin 'mil' plug. I would say a larger mono coil will be a good thing on the unit, (it was sold in limited numbers with an 18" mono coil on it called the F1B2 I think, and works quite well). If there is anything we can help you with - I assume you have purchased the machine, let Doc know - you can find him below.
john