John in Nawth Carolina
Active member
I would be interested in pure air tests and tests where the target is on the ground. In disc and all metal. And please don't point me to any videos as I don't have the bandwidth to watch them.
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Has anyone done any air tests on this new marvel of detecting technology?
- Thread starter John in Nawth Carolina
- Start date
Gonehunting
New member
will work on that this weekend... but I'm still new.. There is so many different settings that I bet some targets may have different readings...
John in Nawth Carolina
Active member
Thanks!
Andy Sabisch
Active member
John
Not trying to sound like a wise guy but since the targets we are searching for are in the ground and the ground is what impacts detectors in terms of detection depth, what is the benefit of air tests to compare detectors? I remember watching someone demonstrating a Whites XLT a few years ago and by maxing out the AC Sensitivity and Gain, you could hit a 25c at 2 feet . . . . . but that was not achievable in even mild ground . . . . . air tests are a good way to start learning the target ID values or sounds from targets but I have found with any detector including the Deus that taking notes of targets in the ground and then seeing what they are is a better indication of how deep it can detect and the type of response to expect.
The post "Deus Conductivity Scale....and some thoughts" provides some good reference information to start working from but even with these tables, I have found that in-ground readings are different slightly from the numbers posted . . . . running in 12kHz, nickels read a consistent "53" in the ground in my time in the field.
Andy Sabisch
Not trying to sound like a wise guy but since the targets we are searching for are in the ground and the ground is what impacts detectors in terms of detection depth, what is the benefit of air tests to compare detectors? I remember watching someone demonstrating a Whites XLT a few years ago and by maxing out the AC Sensitivity and Gain, you could hit a 25c at 2 feet . . . . . but that was not achievable in even mild ground . . . . . air tests are a good way to start learning the target ID values or sounds from targets but I have found with any detector including the Deus that taking notes of targets in the ground and then seeing what they are is a better indication of how deep it can detect and the type of response to expect.
The post "Deus Conductivity Scale....and some thoughts" provides some good reference information to start working from but even with these tables, I have found that in-ground readings are different slightly from the numbers posted . . . . running in 12kHz, nickels read a consistent "53" in the ground in my time in the field.
Andy Sabisch
You are a very WISE GUY.... An Air Test can be an indicator of Potential. I have gotten my hands on a Chinese Unit that is preset and can't pick up a dime 5" away in an Air Test, Do you think it is going to do any better in mineralization..... I Think Not.
There is also the Halo Effect from a Long Term Target in the Ground which could make it go deeper than in an Air Test..... Variables, Variables. Last time, I met up with you, you were touting the Explorer II as the Cat's Meow. What happened to you, Andrew???
There is also the Halo Effect from a Long Term Target in the Ground which could make it go deeper than in an Air Test..... Variables, Variables. Last time, I met up with you, you were touting the Explorer II as the Cat's Meow. What happened to you, Andrew???
TheMarshall
New member
Hello John.
May I offer you some professional advice?
This is related to the E-trac initially if you have one, but also is relevant to any other detector in its basic form.
With the DEUS, you will need to check against the differing frequencies used to realise how that effects values of conductivities,
I would recommend that you follow your basic instincts and do carry out whatever air-tests on any range of targets/materials, that you personally consider of interest.
Do that with your E-Trac's Smart Screen CLEARED of any rejection patterns.
Also, set your gain to a low level whereby there is no interference from domestic sources. (finally, do a Noise cancel)
The initial aim is simply to collect a stable BASE REFERENCE set of Fe and CO numbers.
The fact that numbers may be a few digits high or low from those other folk have acquired, is not a problem, for that is obviously expected when doing a simple hand waiving exercise. never the less, it is no less accurate than waving your detector over an unknown object buried out of sight in the ground.
The E-Trac ( within its 'compressed' range of analysis) is capable of detecting the variations of wear and metallic contents degradation in a metal disc (i.e. coins etc)
John. Anyone who argues about 'air testing' is certainly not an engineer, and implies that they lack knowledge about the principles of detector design, or background concepts of the science upon which this detector is designed.
Once you have acquired the basic data of interesting targets, you can then begin to realise how the 'soil conditions' and depth, interact with those targets when 'embalmed' by the soil in which they are buried.
A target in soil, therefore is seen by your detector as something similar to a 'CLAD COIN'. (Consisting of two or more combinations of conductive materials)
The target's values don't change, but the soil's make-up can.
It is the extra conductivity and magnetic permeability of the surrounding soil that alters the 'in soil' reading' that adds their 'ten-cents-worth'.
The conductivity of the soil is LESS effective on a target's CON value, if the ground is DRY, and only comes into play as it saturates and / or becomes acidic due to chemical additives from any source...natural or man-made.
The 'killer' factor....which affects the Fe values, is our old enemy, FERROUS.......be it derived from man-made metals, or nature's basic ground make up.
Fe3-O4 being only one of the natural elements...there are other sources also.
So Fe and DEPTH are the primary factors that MASK our targets, as well as other nearby iron junk.
Only experience gained from digging TARGET WITH FE NUMBERS HIGHER THAN 12 will enable you to discover the 'goodie' that other less ambitious detectorists miss.
That is where the E-Trac excels. It can, and does, show you the subtle variations in target readings IN Fe terms, whereas CON values are LESS likely to be as helpful.
So John, please do your tests, then with that basic knowledge, and your E-Trac, learn the art of metal detecting with a greater awareness that you are doing it from a sound scientific base, and not ignorance.
The ground is an INFINITELY variable medium as far as your detector is concerned, the numerical values of any target are more predictable, so therefore you must start from that point, and develop your knowledge and skills accordingly.
Come back if you think that I may be able to help you further.....Matt.
TheMarshall
May I offer you some professional advice?
This is related to the E-trac initially if you have one, but also is relevant to any other detector in its basic form.
With the DEUS, you will need to check against the differing frequencies used to realise how that effects values of conductivities,
I would recommend that you follow your basic instincts and do carry out whatever air-tests on any range of targets/materials, that you personally consider of interest.
Do that with your E-Trac's Smart Screen CLEARED of any rejection patterns.
Also, set your gain to a low level whereby there is no interference from domestic sources. (finally, do a Noise cancel)
The initial aim is simply to collect a stable BASE REFERENCE set of Fe and CO numbers.
The fact that numbers may be a few digits high or low from those other folk have acquired, is not a problem, for that is obviously expected when doing a simple hand waiving exercise. never the less, it is no less accurate than waving your detector over an unknown object buried out of sight in the ground.
The E-Trac ( within its 'compressed' range of analysis) is capable of detecting the variations of wear and metallic contents degradation in a metal disc (i.e. coins etc)
John. Anyone who argues about 'air testing' is certainly not an engineer, and implies that they lack knowledge about the principles of detector design, or background concepts of the science upon which this detector is designed.
Once you have acquired the basic data of interesting targets, you can then begin to realise how the 'soil conditions' and depth, interact with those targets when 'embalmed' by the soil in which they are buried.
A target in soil, therefore is seen by your detector as something similar to a 'CLAD COIN'. (Consisting of two or more combinations of conductive materials)
The target's values don't change, but the soil's make-up can.
It is the extra conductivity and magnetic permeability of the surrounding soil that alters the 'in soil' reading' that adds their 'ten-cents-worth'.
The conductivity of the soil is LESS effective on a target's CON value, if the ground is DRY, and only comes into play as it saturates and / or becomes acidic due to chemical additives from any source...natural or man-made.
The 'killer' factor....which affects the Fe values, is our old enemy, FERROUS.......be it derived from man-made metals, or nature's basic ground make up.
Fe3-O4 being only one of the natural elements...there are other sources also.
So Fe and DEPTH are the primary factors that MASK our targets, as well as other nearby iron junk.
Only experience gained from digging TARGET WITH FE NUMBERS HIGHER THAN 12 will enable you to discover the 'goodie' that other less ambitious detectorists miss.
That is where the E-Trac excels. It can, and does, show you the subtle variations in target readings IN Fe terms, whereas CON values are LESS likely to be as helpful.
So John, please do your tests, then with that basic knowledge, and your E-Trac, learn the art of metal detecting with a greater awareness that you are doing it from a sound scientific base, and not ignorance.
The ground is an INFINITELY variable medium as far as your detector is concerned, the numerical values of any target are more predictable, so therefore you must start from that point, and develop your knowledge and skills accordingly.
Come back if you think that I may be able to help you further.....Matt.
TheMarshall
TheMarshall
New member
n/t
