Iron bias story…

[synthnut]

I’m aware that Dilek is not fond of introducing iron bias to the Legend…..I am also aware of the Legend users who are saying that the machine is fine how it is…I can understand these feelings UNLESS the users have experienced a major moment….This was my major moment

My hunting partner and I hunted old NYC parks, and beaches…..Me with my trusty ML Soveriegn, and him with his ML Etrac……The Etrac had better iron bias, and was touted to have a “see thru” ability….We would set up a hunt whereby he would find a target and call me over to check it….He hit a target that he wanted me to checkout….My Soveriegn was popping on the target as it was discriminating the iron in the hole…..He gave me his headphones hooked up to his Etrac and there was this flutey like tone that the Etrac has when it hits Silver…. I spent the next 15 minutes adjusting my Soveriegn to hit this target to no avail…When we dug up the target it was a Barber Dime !….My Soveriegn missed that target !…. I did come up with some nice finds that day, but that Barber experience haunted me….So for all you guys that are happy with things the way they are…how many Barbers have you missed ?

Btw…I ordred an Etrac the next day !

 

[Ronstar]

I have no answer for that but a year ago I found a silver Washington that I knew a Nox800 had been over. I covered the plug and called Jeff over who scanned it again and nothing. Uncovered the plug to expose the coin at 4-5” deep and it still would not hit on that coin. I was running thd F75 but now running the Legend I offer the following.
At least with the Legend the approach angle is/can be very critical. I’m not saying 1degree but at least 5degree shift could be enough to miss. Was there iron in or near where I recently dug a Seated Liberty dime? I dont know but I was in F mode so 1-10 is out and the only tone I was getting ended up being the dime.
Settings. Im starting to think a simple one digit difference in a setting, say Sens or Thresh could be enough to make the object “appear” and thus recovered.
Now the opposite of that is I recovered a silver Canadian dime, a Barber quarter and a silver Rosie in a 50’ diameter area that should have been easily detectable by most any detector but totally missed by three good ML and two good Fisher detectors. Maybe that was simply an EMI issue but we may never know.
And finally, a couple months ago I hit a double target signal that ended up four Barber dimes in one hole that was again missed by all the other detectors! Starting to give the Legend a nod for working in known EMI and iron laced areas……

 

[DigDog]

I think all detectors miss stuff for whatever reason, if not how are you still finding stuff thats in ground hunted for years.
I seen the same detectors hit stuff in a test garden one day and nothing the next. Day to day probably hour to hour in cases.
I don’t know if running out and getting a new detector every time you miss something is going to help you get a lot more necessarily. But at least its a good excuse to get a new detector and im sure the manufactures agree. I cant keep up sometimes. people say you don’t have to have the latest and greatest to find more just get really good at using your current detector and then turn around and say this detector sucks the latest and greatest $1000 detector will find more.
My philosophy, use the detector you enjoy using, dig everything or cherry pick, and keep in mind you will never run out of targets and holes to dig so just enjoy what you are using and doing.
Otherwise its time to find a new hobby

 

[Elmy]

I have no answer for that but a year ago I found a silver Washington that I knew a Nox800 had been over. I covered the plug and called Jeff over who scanned it again and nothing. Uncovered the plug to expose the coin at 4-5” deep and it still would not hit on that coin. I was running thd F75 but now running the Legend I offer the following.
At least with the Legend the approach angle is/can be very critical. I’m not saying 1degree but at least 5degree shift could be enough to miss. Was there iron in or near where I recently dug a Seated Liberty dime? I dont know but I was in F mode so 1-10 is out and the only tone I was getting ended up being the dime.
Settings. Im starting to think a simple one digit difference in a setting, say Sens or Thresh could be enough to make the object “appear” and thus recovered.
Now the opposite of that is I recovered a silver Canadian dime, a Barber quarter and a silver Rosie in a 50’ diameter area that should have been easily detectable by most any detector but totally missed by three good ML and two good Fisher detectors. Maybe that was simply an EMI issue but we may never know.
And finally, a couple months ago I hit a double target signal that ended up four Barber dimes in one hole that was again missed by all the other detectors! Starting to give the Legend a nod for working in known EMI and iron laced areas……

AGAIN.......Working the target ....you must hit the part of the coin/target that is not masked by minerals/trash first....if you hit the masked part first , you will get no signal....if you hit an exposed part of the coin first, you get that chirp/squeal/ peep of a good target or maybe even an id number.

So if you can hit the coin first before any part of the junk surrounding it....yes you can pull it.

 

[tometusns]

AGAIN.......Working the target ....you must hit the part of the coin/target that is not masked by minerals/trash first....if you hit the masked part first , you will get no signal....if you hit an exposed part of the coin first, you get that chirp/squeal/ peep of a good target or maybe even an id number.

So if you can hit the coin first before any part of the junk surrounding it....yes you can pull it.

I think you’re absolutely right. That’s why they say to hunt an area in different directions. It’s just too easy to miss a good target, especially one that’s hiding. How many times have you gone back over a place you hunted using the same machine and found more stuff.
So when someone goes over it with a different machine that’s where you get a lot of “this machine found it and that one didn’t”. It’s nothing more than you went at it in the right direction, heard the right sound, worked the target and the machine gave you enough good info to say better dig.
There’s also a lot to be said about learning your machine. Whether you buy used or new spend your time learning one that’s recommended by some seasoned hunters.
There are a lot of good machines out there that will find good stuff. The Legend being one of them. It’s already proven that to me.

 

[Elmy]

I think you’re absolutely right. That’s why they say to hunt an area in different directions. It’s just too easy to miss a good target, especially one that’s hiding. How many times have you gone back over a place you hunted using the same machine and found more stuff.
So when someone goes over it with a different machine that’s where you get a lot of “this machine found it and that one didn’t”. It’s nothing more than you went at it in the right direction, heard the right sound, worked the target and the machine gave you enough good info to say better dig.
There’s also a lot to be said about learning your machine. Whether you buy used or new spend your time learning one that’s recommended by some seasoned hunters.
There are a lot of good machines out there that will find good stuff. The Legend being one of them. It’s already proven that to me.

A whole lot of wisdom in your response.

 

[DigDog]

I think you’re absolutely right. That’s why they say to hunt an area in different directions. It’s just too easy to miss a good target, especially one that’s hiding. How many times have you gone back over a place you hunted using the same machine and found more stuff.
So when someone goes over it with a different machine that’s where you get a lot of “this machine found it and that one didn’t”. It’s nothing more than you went at it in the right direction, heard the right sound, worked the target and the machine gave you enough good info to say better dig.
There’s also a lot to be said about learning your machine. Whether you buy used or new spend your time learning one that’s recommended by some seasoned hunters.
There are a lot of good machines out there that will find good stuff. The Legend being one of them. It’s already proven that to me.

Don’t forget soil conditions for that day, emi, etc could effect a target being picked up or missed.
The detectors don’t necessarily change but how we use it and environmental conditions do.
Nobody can do everry swing the same exact speed, hight, angle and so on.
Maybe close but that very slight difference could be all it takes on the fringes

 

[Ronstar]

Amen to all that!

 

[synthnut]

The one thing that I did was to change the height of the coil over the target when I was doing the foil/quarter scenario…This was a planned scenario…. I had every opportunity to change direction, angle,etc…..It was all in the same area, same day, no special soil or anything else….The fact that the Legend DID hit the quarter when the coil was elevated was impressive to me because other detectors did NOT hit the quarter….I’m not dissing the Legend at all…..I would simply like to see this technology brought further along and Nokta if willing is the one company that could do this…You guys can continue to make up scenario’s (excuses) all you want…angles, ground conditions,emi, ground dampness, ect…..My experiment had constants and was tested by other machines…AND it’s the ever changing technology that brought us altogether on this forum because we all bought a shiny new Legend !! WHY ?…” Because of the wonderful things that it does”….and does it better than xyz detector on the market…I’d be willing to bet that this is not the only detector that most of us own… Sit back and let things happen, or question what is, and MAKE things happen !!..Discussion is what makes change, and hopefully progress happen….We’re all in this together !

 

[synthnut]

I think all detectors miss stuff for whatever reason, if not how are you still finding stuff thats in ground hunted for years.
I seen the same detectors hit stuff in a test garden one day and nothing the next. Day to day probably hour to hour in cases.
I don’t know if running out and getting a new detector every time you miss something is going to help you get a lot more necessarily. But at least its a good excuse to get a new detector and im sure the manufactures agree. I cant keep up sometimes. people say you don’t have to have the latest and greatest to find more just get really good at using your current detector and then turn around and say this detector sucks the latest and greatest $1000 detector will find more.
My philosophy, use the detector you enjoy using, dig everything or cherry pick, and keep in mind you will never run out of targets and holes to dig so just enjoy what you are using and doing.
Otherwise its time to find a new hobby

Tmops50,
Why did you buy a Legend ?…..Why didn’t you just continue to use your old faithful machine that you have used and found great finds with ?

Could it be that the Legend happens to do things a little bit better ? Could it be because technology has changed and companies make much lighter detectors ? Could itbe that there are some wonderful features that that the Legend packs inside that just plain change the game ?…Nokta is one company that listens to it’s user base…Every new version of the O.S. makes the Legend better and better…Is this not important to you ? …This is called Progress , and I’m thrilled to be part of it…

 

[DigDog]

The one thing that I did was to change the height of the coil over the target when I was doing the foil/quarter scenario…This was a planned scenario…. I had every opportunity to change direction, angle,etc…..It was all in the same area, same day, no special soil or anything else….The fact that the Legend DID hit the quarter when the coil was elevated was impressive to me because other detectors did NOT hit the quarter….I’m not dissing the Legend at all…..I would simply like to see this technology brought further along and Nokta if willing is the one company that could do this…You guys can continue to make up scenario’s (excuses) all you want…angles, ground conditions,emi, ground dampness, ect…..My experiment had constants and was tested by other machines…AND it’s the ever changing technology that brought us altogether on this forum because we all bought a shiny new Legend !! WHY ?…” Because of the wonderful things that it does”….and does it better than xyz detector on the market…I’d be willing to bet that this is not the only detector that most of us own… Sit back and let things happen, or question what is, and MAKE things happen !!..Discussion is what makes change, and hopefully progress happen….We’re all in this together !

Just real quick in what you just said and please don’t take this the wrong way but as before i understand what your saying as you are impressed with the legend as it hit the quarter but the other metal detectors did not but you still want improvements done on the legend?
If it outperformed the others than why is it not good enough? Shouldn’t it be the other detectors need technology brought further along then. Or am i not getting what you are saying. Maybe I’m just misunderstanding everything and it is confusing me

 

[D&P-OR]

Tmops50,
Why did you buy a Legend ?…..Why didn’t you just continue to use your old faithful machine that you have used and found great finds with ?

Could it be that the Legend happens to do things a little bit better ? Could it be because technology has changed and companies make much lighter detectors ? Could itbe that there are some wonderful features that that the Legend packs inside that just plain change the game ?…Nokta is one company that listens to it’s user base…Every new version of the O.S. makes the Legend better and better…Is this not important to you ? …This is called Progress , and I’m thrilled to be part of it…

Jim----I think v 1.09 is plenty good enough for me.----What is it on the Legend that you feel needs further improvement/updates?--------Del

 

[DigDog]

Tmops50,
Why did you buy a Legend ?…..Why didn’t you just continue to use your old faithful machine that you have used and found great finds with ?
.

When i was doing the hobby years ago i had ML sovereign, Xterra, and excalliber for the beach. Tesoro’s sand shark, cibola, compadre, vaqueros. And couple other stragglers. Towards the end i just had the excalliber II for the beach and Vaquero for the land.
Due to health reasons i had to stop for years and wasn’t sure if i was ever going to do it anymore so i sold the last two i had which were the excalliber and vaquero.
Just couple months ago( 15 years later ) I decided to start again. If i had kept the excalliber and vaquero I would just be using those now. With that being said I always wished the vaquero was waterproof, my only gripe with it.
But i went online to order a new vaquero thats when I realized Tesoro was out of business as with Whites. As I searched for a new detector i also realized technology had changed and there were new lightweight, waterproof detectors, smf, BT, etc. I said “ what the heck is a Nokta Makro? “
As i researched at first I thought a ML vanquish would fit the bill only problem not waterproof. I didn’t want to start with two detectors again, one for beach and one for land. I looked at simplex at first then as i looked at the Legend it was a little more than I wanted to spend but as i was looking at the features, lightweightWaterproof BT headphones option for external battery ability to choose frequencies run in smf or vlftwo detectors in one, a beach machine and land machine
$600 vs ultimately over $1000 for two separate detectors
Sold. And there you have the story.

 

[DigDog]

Jim----I think v 1.09 is plenty good enough for me.----What is it on the Legend that you feel needs further improvement/updates?--------Del

Thats what i was asking but it got taken the wrong way

 

[synthnut]

I’d like to see targets like the quarter in this example, shine thru with the foil closer…..Even if it was a good tone with an averaging number…Depth is nice to have, but to me, separation is key…..If ground conditions are totally littered with trash, and there is a good target under the trash, then yes, dig away the trash if you are so inclined….This is understandable…..If you have a couple of pieces of foil or a couple of nails an inch or so away from a silver barber dime, I would surely like to get at least a chirp from the dime, and hopefully some odd averaging number that would make me want to investigate further….Am I being too picky ?….I’m sure that a lot of you think so….and that’s ok !….I’m not bashing the Legend….I just want to know that I’m not missing any great targets that could have hit with one more step of tech…If everything remains the same, I will still be happy with my Legend….Heck, I might even get to enjoy the updating process …….Thanks for putting up with me !

 

[synthnut]

When i was doing the hobby years ago i had ML sovereign, Xterra, and excalliber for the beach. Tesoro’s sand shark, cibola, compadre, vaqueros. And couple other stragglers. Towards the end i just had the excalliber II for the beach and Vaquero for the land.
Due to health reasons i had to stop for years and wasn’t sure if i was ever going to do it anymore so i sold the last two i had which were the excalliber and vaquero.
Just couple months ago( 15 years later ) I decided to start again. If i had kept the excalliber and vaquero I would just be using those now. With that being said I always wished the vaquero was waterproof, my only gripe with it.
But i went online to order a new vaquero thats when I realized Tesoro was out of business as with Whites. As I searched for a new detector i also realized technology had changed and there were new lightweight, waterproof detectors, smf, BT, etc. I said “ what the heck is a Nokta Makro? “
As i researched at first I thought a ML vanquish would fit the bill only problem not waterproof. I didn’t want to start with two detectors again, one for beach and one for land. I looked at simplex at first then as i looked at the Legend it was a little more than I wanted to spend but as i was looking at the features, lightweightWaterproof BT headphones option for external battery ability to choose frequencies run in smf or vlftwo detectors in one, a beach machine and land machine
$600 vs ultimately over $1000 for two separate detectors
Sold. And there you have the story.

So it was through all of these wants and needs, and technological advancements brought about by Nokta Macro that got you to purchase a Legend ….I don blame you, and hope that your health continues to get better…advancements are good…I’m looking for advancements too….They’re just different advancements…

 

[DigDog]

I’d like to see targets like the quarter in this example, shine thru with the foil closer…..Even if it was a good tone with an averaging number…Depth is nice to have, but to me, separation is key…..If ground conditions are totally littered with trash, and there is a good target under the trash, then yes, dig away the trash if you are so inclined….This is understandable…..If you have a couple of pieces of foil or a couple of nails an inch or so away from a silver barber dime, I would surely like to get at least a chirp from the dime, and hopefully some odd averaging number that would make me want to investigate further….Am I being too picky ?….I’m sure that a lot of you think so….and that’s ok !….I’m not bashing the Legend….I just want to know that I’m not missing any great targets that could have hit with one more step of tech…If everything remains the same, I will still be happy with my Legend….Heck, I might even get to enjoy the updating process …….Thanks for putting up with me !

No not picky, seems very reasonable to me and I’m sure everyone else.

 

[DigDog]

So it was through all of these wants and needs, and technological advancements brought about by Nokta Macro that got you to purchase a Legend ….I don blame you, and hope that your health continues to get better…advancements are good…I’m looking for advancements too….They’re just different advancements…

Everyone has different preferences and wants in a detector. Some may be for performance, some comfort and convenience.
Was there anything wrong performance wise in the old detectors i had, not to me.
I wished one was lighter, one was waterproof. When i went to purchase a detector, if the old ones were still available, which one is at $600 more now new, and i also compared the Legend, i would have still chosen the Legend. Simply because as i stated, it is close enough to me to both detectors in one, add all the features i wished the old ones had, at a fraction of the price both detectors would have cost.
I could have found and purchased both for around $2500 and still not have everything feature wise or the Legend at $650 with a lot more features and customization. If i had unlimited funds and my health great i might have just purchased all three.
It was the most logical decision for me and satisfies my wants and needs.
It’s different for everyone, and everyone is “picky” in their own way. Can the excalliber hunt deeper and better, diving in the ocean, yep. But thats not for me anymore. You can get specific detectors made specifically for just certain types of hunting that will outperform others if thats your thing, but as a general all around multipurpose detector the Legend is hard to beat especially at a $600 price. The next closest probably the Nox 800 is over $1000 and notorious for leaking when wet. You may not use it at the beach but nice to know if you get caught in rain which happens here quite a bit or simply rinsing it off to clean you have to take precautions. Its a good detector from what i hear, not nocking the performance, just more money and has some quirks as they all do. All preferences and what you are willing to tolerate. Me personally not worth the extra money to find possibly what? And peace of mind of a waterproof machine.
To each his own. Maybe one day we will get a consensus on a perfect flawless detector that is made.