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Is Installing Something Yourself Stealing?

C

Critterhunter

New member
One or two people in the Sovereign forum are sort'a implying that I'm being unethical or in moral if I want to install a volt meter (Sovereigns use volt meters as a VDI display) on my GT myself instead of paying a guy to have it done. Since I can buy this very same volt meter (or any other one I like better for that matter) from any electronic supply store I feel well within my rights to save money and install it myself.

I feel trying to shame me into paying to have it done would be like saying I have to have a certain brand of speakers installed in my GTO by a guy just because he was the first to put that brand in his GTO. So long as I can buy those speakers from the manufacturer I feel I have as much right to install them in my car as somebody wanting to charge me to do it.

Just like the speaker maker provides instructions to install them that I'll follow, the manufacturer of this volt meter also provides a data sheet I'll follow to install it. In other words, I will be figuring out the proper installation myself from the information provided by the volt meter manufacturer and not looking inside a Sovereign to see how somebody else did it. Are these companies stealing as well because they are showing me how to hitch this meter up myself without paying somebody to do it? And am I being in moral if I want to show other people how to do it themselves and save a lot of money?

This is an interesting debate and I thought it would be more on topic in this forum. I would like to hear other people's views on this.
 
You've hooked with a couple of far-left liberal types. Tell 'em to kiss your foot, do your mods and move on to some better folks. Where do these nut-megs come from? We all have out own opinions and these are mine. :clapping:
 
Thanks. Good to hear that. I was starting to feel like I wasn't in America anymore! :biggrin: I feel in this forum most people would probably understand that it's not unethical or in moral to install an existing product (a volt meter) that I can buy off the shelf myself and not have to pay somebody to install it for me. I wasn't planning on opening up my GT for a while since it's still under warranty but I changed my mind when I felt my freedom to do such things was being questioned. So long as this is a free country I feel I have every right to use an existing general purpose product (a volt meter) in any way I feel fit. Whether that
 
i completely agree with the others, how can you be stealing an idea when everything is already there to buy, like you said you didn't open and look at his work inside your GT. So what is the big problem. I know what Jealousy!
 
Years ago there was a guy who's name I believe was Jerry Winburn sold a display that was nothing but a voltmeter mounted on the shaft and people really liked it.
 
I mounted a volt meter/multimeter on my old Garrett Freedom many years ago.
 
I think you need to change your Avatar to include a pic of said modded Sov with voltmeter. You're obviously more patient with people's wacky notions than I am...LOL!
 
What you do to your own equipment is your own business. But I would not take someone elses idea that they are selling and try and make money off of it. There's nothing illegal about it unless they have a patent, but I wouldn't do it. Telling someone how is fine, Nothing wrong with free speech.
 
I think it boils down to these other people had to pay to have theirs done so they think you should as well. As someone else stated "jealousy". I modded one of my detectors a couple years ago. A White's Classic II. We all know that there's a person who sells this mod. It was my detector so I can do as I please with my detector with parts bought at an electronics store.Did'nt even think twice about it. Why would I? It's my detector. Again, like also stated here if it's someone's patent and you're making money from it that would be wrong in my opinion. When you're done doing it I would send the naysayers photos of your fine work and say "how do you like me now?" Please post it here as I'm sure alot of people would like to see it. Good luck with it.
HH, Mike in NJ
 
A Sovereign user implied in the other forum that I'm selling something. I'm in no way trying to sell anything here. I just would like to show people how to use just about any general purpose commercial volt meter with their Sovereign. They all pretty much work the same so once you know how to configure one you can do it to most others. The companies who make these volt meters are in business to sell them for any purpose under the sun and show you how to install them in just about anything. I don't see any terms or conditions for any of the ones I've checked into that state I'm not allowed to install them in certain devices or show others how to. If such a patent is even possible somebody please point me to it and I won't go any further.

Once again I checked with a friend who is an electrical engineer to see what his opinion was on this. He told me that you can not patent a general use application of a product that is put on the market. Volt meters are designed to read voltage, whether installed in my GT or put in a control panel for something else. The only way I would be able to protect a product is if I designed it from the ground up for the sole purpose to be used in one specific application. Even if the product was built for a specific purpose he said so long as it's available to the public for seperate purchase there is nothing illegal about the free exchange of information to tell people how to install it.

I'm not sure which meter I want to use yet but I do know that I don't want to drill out my control box to mount it. I don't want to alter my machine in that way and would rather provide a port for it to plug into for remote mounting anywhere I like based on how I have my control box mounted. Since nobody even offers this kind of configuration as far as I know I don't see how I possibly can be told by others that it's unethical for me to do it myself.

Because all this information already exists on the net anyway I feel it's a mute point. The manufacturers of volt meter provide you with the information to install them in anything. Sovereign owners have already provided the details to install meters on a Sovereign in various ways. I'll simply be bringing all that information into one thread where people don't have to search for it.

I'll tell you what. If somebody would care to show me the letter of the law that says I'm not allowed to share this kind of information with people I'll have my lawyer look it over and tell me if I'm breaking any kind of law, or if on the other hand somebody would be infringing on my rights of free speech by trying to stop me. If he says otherwise I won't go any further with it. I'm not looking to break any laws here so let's be sure, even if the odds of that are one in a million.
 
If you have the knowledge to do it, do not let some jealous arse who could not do it themselves tell ya otherwise...I have modded many a detector and pinpointer...I have even added the ground balance and threshold mods to my White's Classic II...Did I steal from Mr. Bill...He might think so, but the parts and the knowhow were not invented by him...If I have the knowledge to do it myself, why shell out cash to have someone else do it???
 
Thanks. I'll provide the general information on how to wire up a volt meter to a Sovereign GT in various ways. When I get around to buying a few meter styles to try out I'll provide details on how I configured them. I plan to plug them into the box by adding an external port and have the meter it's self mounted in a small project box so I can velcro it where I want based on if the control box is hip or shaft mounted. Less mess/weight and I'll still be able to unplug the unit and use a Minelab or Sunray meter.
 
I think 99% of any mod is not the parts or knowhow, more than likely its the labour cost, if you can do it you will save, if not, pay to get it done. How many people pay to get thier house decorated or Car fixed as apposed to those that do it themselves. I don't see many painters and mecanics getting all hot under the collar.Just take a glance at our "to do honey" lists :rolleyes: if we had to pay to get all that done we would be forever shelling out hard earned $$$, i say do it if you can and the rest that can't you still have a choice.
 
That would be like saying, just because you own a Honda you have to have a Honda mechanic service it... If I can buy the parts and have the know how to service the vehicle myself, why would I waste the extra money to have someone else do it??
 
Exactly. Thanks again for the opinions. It's still an interesting debate never the less. Funny thing is I wasn't even planning on doing any of this stuff for a while until I was told in so many words that it would be in moral and unethical. That's when I decided to excercise my rights a little, and If I can help others save a bunch of money by doing things themselves all the better.

This reminds me of an old debate in the RC forums a while back. We showed people how to build a shunt to measure very high amp draws of brushless motors to compute wattage. Some people who had paid upwards of $60 to $150 for a commercial watt meter designed to do this were'nt too impressed with our homemade jobs using a $3 harbor tool & freight volttmeter and a few simple/free modifications. Turns out somebody tested the homemade ones versus the commercial units using some calibrated lab equipment and found the homemade jobs were much more accurate. :biggrin: Score one for us cheapskates...
 
Most do it your selfers are quite competent, although some lack a little polish they still get the job done. Creativity, and ambition is what drove many successes in the US, I view doing it yourself as in line with that spirit. Saving a few bucks on a mod, sounds good to me. I suppose in some respects the people that think you're "stealing", would probably send a nice donation at the end of the year to the IRS thinking it was a worthy cause. Your money is better left in your own pocket, you can use the few extra bucks to buy a beer, or something for the kids/grandkids stimulate the economy close to home first.
 
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