Just bought a new Deus W/11inch coil and controller - GBing issue in fresh water?

[glasartisan]

Hi guys, wondering if any one here has used the Deus in fresh water. I bought it to work some of my trashy fresh water sites for fur trade type relics. I have the Deus water proof kit also. My issue is GBing in the fresh water, about 2 feet deep. I do have the antenna hooked up. Using 18 KHTZ, Im doing the pumping method and get a 89-90 GB #. Sometimes when I use this pumping method I even will get a GB fail. Holy cow, this hot for fresh water and I have 5-6 bars show up. I add 2 points to the # and start hunting in descrim mode at 92 GB. Im still getting ground feedback when I bring the coil to the lake bottom and then lifting it up about a foot from bottom. There should be no noise in both directions if balance is set correctly. It is specifically making noise, ground feedback falsing when coil is being lifted up. So I assume I need to add more GB but Im already at 95 max and 5-6 bars showing. I believe the detector is still too negatively set. It will run smoothly as long as I keep the coil at an even keel but if I start bumping into things or hit low and high spots on the lake bottom I start to get falsing. The detector itself is very stable, very little emi and or chatter. I ve been to 3 fresh water lakes now with one of the lakes over 100 miles from the other. All 3 have the exact GB issue and I get the same GB numbers. It is interesting to note that when I go to GB on the adjacent dry land I get no problems. I get about 10 points less than when in the actual water. And I also can set the Deus either negative or a few points positive and there is no ground feedback or falsing when on the dry land.
I have played with the different settings to see if this can be minimalized. It seems that bringing the frequency down closer to 8 KHTZ the detector gets more closely GBed. Not sure why that is. Also moving up the reactivity to 2-3 almost quiets the GB totally. And then I try to run as close to negative 1 as I can on silencer. But I realize that running in 3 reactivity will kill my depth, and some areas are just not that trashy to warrant it. My descrim is set between 7-10. I had the sensitivity set as low as 75 with not much difference. TX at 1or 2. All 3 of these fresh water lakes I have had other detectors at over the years. CZ-21 W 10-1/2 inch coil, Excal 10-1/2 incoil, detector pro headhunter, Tesoro water detectors and the CTX. All had on the 10 to 11 inch coils.Never had an issue with any of these pertaining to GBing. Either single or multi freqs worked in same areas that I just took my new Deus to. I love this detector for its depth and extreme sensitivity to small low conductors. The Deus is still finding me deep small nonferrous targets despite the GBing being off but am I loosing much depth and optimal performance by using it this way? Could this be a characteristic trait of being wireless? Any help, suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Steve

 

[wltdwiz]

steve
i use mine in hot az ground in the water & i dont even have to ground balance it
you might try turning down the sensitivy a bit & mabie tracking?
your ground may be a problem child

some 1 else may have a idea on this

 

[HuntinDog]

Steve,
I've only used my Deus a few times in fresh water and just as a test so I have only ideas.
I would try running in freq 12. 18 really picksup the little stuff.
Reactivity at 2. You shouldn't loose any depth.
If pumping works I would run it at what it is.
Disc at 8 depending on iron trash. much higher and you loose depth.
Sensitivity at around 85
TX 1
Do you run any ground notch? I would drop it down to around 80-85

My only other suggestion would be to drain the lake and let it dry out. HaHa

Good luck and let us know what you end up running and finding.

 

[EtracTom-AdirondacksNY]

The GB could be way way lower than you think or believe. Try going down to 20 then start to try the pumping GB method and see what happens. Reactivity won't kill depth as much as the Silencer number will so at -1 or 0 you will get max depth.

 

[glasartisan]

Say Walt and the others, thanks for the reply. I would be curious to know what GB # you are getting as you are detecting out in at least 2 feet of water. And if you could bob the coil and see if there is no audible sound as you move coil to lake bottom and then bring coil off lake bottom about a foot. This is where I get my ground feedback, at the point of lifting coil off the bottom it gets noisy. I don't think it is a sensitivity issue because I did lower it to 75 and ground feedback was still there. The Deus actually runs quiet as I swing it under the water at 90 sensitivity but as long as I don't lift the coil up to far from bottom. There is very little chatter or emi as I move thru the water. I even did notch out 98-99 for the iron wrap around and any other ground chatter. And that didn't work either. Swinging too fast cant be an issue because you can only swing slow in water. Like I mentioned before I can drop the freq from 18 to 12 or 8 and the feedback does get reduced but then I loose my sensitivity to small brass and pewter objects. If I set reactivity as high as 3 and silencer to -1 it just about goes away. I just like the fuller sound that 0 or 1 gives you on reactivity and without worrying about depth loss to a higher react #. I will have to try tracking but not sure if that will really get rid of the ground feedback. I tried to go in manual the other direction to 60 GB and that was really bad. It just seems like Im running to negative. I need more GB, like 96-100 to bring it to a neutral setting. Someone mentioned ground notch but I already tried max GB 95 and got the same ground feed back on the up lift of coil. I know all these lakes I tried are not that hot of ground underwater. I had many other detectors at these same locations, single freqs and multi freqs and never had a problem GBing using them. I just wonder if this is some inherent trait being the Deus is wireless. Any of you lake hunters go thru the bother to GB? Do you worry about performance loss if you don't?Thanks again guys, Steve

 

[HuntinDog]

Steve,
When I mentioned Notching the ground I was referring to what XP refers to as Notch Ground.
You can find it under the Expert menu in the GB screen.
Do you have Andy's book??
I go back to his book and re-read over different sections from time to time to refresh myself.
His ground balance section starts on pg.36 and mentions Notch Ground on pg.39 #3.
In his General Tips & Techniques pg. 78 he goes over how it works. pg. 85.
In the XP manual always good to go over the GB section pg.16.
On pg. 40 describes how to set Notch Ground up.

Ok,
So you say that you pump GB and get 89-90.
I would pump and then set it manually some where around there (lower for hotter-higher for quitter) and set the Notch Ground down to around 83 or so.
It's kind of a try and see thing. I've found that Notch Ground works great to quite my machine when it's acting up and it doesn't effect depth, so you can go even lower.
I'd still try running the settings I mentioned.
The lower the reactivity the slower you need to sweep.
Running in 12 still picks up the small stuff and doesn't get over loaded with the tiny stuff and will help with quieting down your machine.
Good Luck
Herb

 

[glasartisan]

Hi there HuntinDog, yes I have Andys book. It is a great work. I read about the ground notch and know what you are referring to. I take its meaning as I read about it that if your GB comes in the 70s or maybe even lower is that you can dial in a block of higher #s in 80s or 90s to notch out the higher number that hot rocks come in at. But since Im already GBed in the lower 90s as the Deus is telling me, I don't think that feature will help me. Now possibly can you notch backwards? Would a hot rock read into the 70s or low 80s. But I think if Im running that high a GB number, 90-95 most all hot rocks should have disappeared at that setting anyway. But it is the ground mineral Im detecting, even at 95 GB. But I know the ground is not that hot for being in a fresh water lake. Had other detectors at the same spots, and all GBed just fine W/ no feedback. When you use ground notch what GB number is Deus giving you? And where do you dial in the notch?
Yes 12 freq might be the way to go as I can notice a reduction in the ground feedback. Thanks for the thoughts Herb, Steve

 

[HuntinDog]

Steve,
As I said before I haven't hunted in the water to any extent, so I don't know if any of what I said will work. Just where I would start.
Running on some of my mineralized ground with a GB of 80s -90 I have run the Notch Ground down to around 80.
Using Notch Ground helps me with annoying Falseing with impact or bumping the coil against rocks and brush.
I also use it on a lot of the time to help quiet my Deus down.
I would run Notch Ground down to at least 80 to start and move it up and down to get the best results.
I know Andy wrote about the use of Notch Ground to help with Hot Rocks, but it will also help in other ways.

herb

 

[glasartisan]

Very well HuntinDog, I can see that it just might help with other erroneous noises to help reduce the overall feedback Im getting. Thanks again for the help Herb, Steve