Little more time with the Racer

[Rick(ND)]

My wife and myself tried a yard we had permission on, she has a MXT while me with the Racer. She got the oldest coin with a 1899 Barber dime while I got 3 older coins a 1919 and a 1942 wheat penny and a 1943 merc dime, plus a Bugs Bunny car (looks like a Hot Wheels, but is not or a Match box either)that was made in 1974 and complete other than the ears are broke off. Dug about 10 new coins too and I seem to get my share of trash too.
I run 3 tones with the factory Gain and after a little while had to up my disc to 50 as it seem to be a lot of lower tones, like 4 or 5 to each sweep, got it down to a couple or no low tones. The Racer and the MXT didn't like each other and even changing the freq on the Racer didn't do a lot, but it did quiet down some. The funny thing was at time we couldn't get within 20 feet of one another and then the next we got 6 feet away and it wasn't bad at all.
The things i notice with the Racer is I am starting to tell the rusty trash from good items like coins and some pieces of copper or brass by moving the coil back from the signals and see that it nulls and also pinpointing the target and then rechecking it in my 3 tone disc, tried to do 2 tones, but found it was better for me in 3 tones.
Now the things I was concerned with was the merc and both the Wheaties that were down around 5 inches as these were not solid signals, but they were there with the ID jumping like 83-86 and the tones were high and med tones when I first got them and were smaller signals which is what to expect with something a little deeper than normal, but felt they should have been more solid signals and didn't see any other targets even in pinpoint after the coin was out of the hole. Another thing and wonder if others are seeing this is the depth meter always is 1-3 inches deep with mostly 1-2 every target even the coins at 5 inches when pinpointed I went for the lowest number so I knew I was right over the target. When pinpointing I could tell more on the audio how deep it was than the meter.
I also see I lost my rubber cover over the trigger switch too, I am sure there was one on it, but not when I got done and never notice it was gone until the last couple of targets.
I also ground balance sever times being so easy to do and ran from 66-80.
Just got to learn more and to do this means I have to use it more as the more I use it the more I will learn and the better it is going to get Right??

Rick

 

[doc holiday]

Good finds and writeup--thanks.

 

[squirrel1]

Sounds good. The site you visited sounds like a good place for the small OOR 5" coil on the Racer.

 

[Monte]

It is a nicely designed unit, and mastering when and how to use it and the accessory coils will result in some rewarding success.

My wife and myself tried a yard we had permission on, she has a MXT while me with the Racer.

Curious which search coils you were each using?

She got the oldest coin with a 1899 Barber dime while I got 3 older coins a 1919 and a 1942 wheat penny and a 1943 merc dime, plus a Bugs Bunny car (looks like a Hot Wheels, but is not or a Match box either)that was made in 1974 and complete other than the ears are broke off. Dug about 10 new coins too and I seem to get my share of trash too.

Both of you scored so that's good. Along the way you've had the opportunity to learn more about the Racer, and that's better.

I run 3 tones with the factory Gain and after a little while had to up my disc to 50 as it seem to be a lot of lower tones, like 4 or 5 to each sweep, got it down to a couple or no low tones.

The default Gain for 3-Tone mode is '70' and that's often ample for most hunting. I usually set mine at '85', and reduce it if the need arises. Where was your ID Filter [size=small](Discrimination)[/size] set prior to bumping it up to '50?' The default is '10' and that low you will hear almost all ferrous and non-ferrous targets. I like to hear some iron but not all, so I set the ID Filter to '23' which is just enough to reject most iron nails and some other iron.

An ID Filter setting of '40' will reject most ferrous targets [size=small](unless they were shaped my man to form a more conductive target)[/size], yet let you hear most small non-ferrous targets. Foil, especially, will often fall in the '40' to '46' range, depending upon size/mass, that I usually encounter in urban trashy places. Small, thin gold chains, baby rings, toe rings and other gold jewelry will mostly respond in the middle-tone range, the weakest from about '40' to '50' perhaps, and many women's and men's gold rings I have found or tested read from about '48' on up to the mid-'60s.'

So, I usually run ID Filter at the default of '10', and if iron nails are a problem or in abundance it is bumped to '23,' but if I don't want most iron, I never set it above '40' because I do want gold jewelry and low-conductive 'keeper' artifacts I might encounter. Naturally the types of sites we search sure makes a difference, too.

The Racer and the MXT didn't like each other and even changing the freq on the Racer didn't do a lot, but it did quiet down some. The funny thing was at time we couldn't get within 20 feet of one another and then the next we got 6 feet away and it wasn't bad at all.

The Racer is sparky and is susceptible to EMI, but I have relied on the MXT and MXT Pro for fifteen years and I have had EMI issues if close to other MXT's, M6, MX5, and quite a few competitor's models as well. That's just how some detectors are, but all I do with my Racer is move a little farther away. I haven't used the Frequency Shift at all to try and deal with any of it.

The things i notice with the Racer is I am starting to tell the rusty trash from good items like coins and some pieces of copper or brass by moving the coil back from the signals and see that it nulls and also pinpointing the target and then rechecking it in my 3 tone disc, tried to do 2 tones, but found it was better for me in 3 tones

It's easy to learn to deal with most ferrous junk with the Racer. I back the search coil off a pinpointed target to get an EPR response, and other iron sings out it's low-tone tune. Been using that technique to 'classify' iron since about '71 and it comes pretty natural. It is easier in a densely littered site in 3-Tone mode, but doable in 2-Tone as well.

.

Now the things I was concerned with was the merc and both the Wheaties that were down around 5 inches as these were not solid signals, but they were there with the ID jumping like 83-86 and the tones were high and med tones when I first got them and were smaller signals which is what to expect with something a little deeper than normal, but felt they should have been more solid signals and didn't see any other targets even in pinpoint after the coin was out of the hole.

I don't consider '83' to '86' to be that jumpy. Yes, read-outs are often pretty tight, but that's not really too bad and can be cause by several things. One could be not sweeping directly over the targets with the center of the coil. Another thing could be a target, such as a coin, that is at a bad angle. There could have been a nearby masking target, too, but you checked for that after recovery.

Another thing and wonder if others are seeing this is the depth meter always is 1-3 inches deep with mostly 1-2 every target even the coins at 5 inches when pinpointed I went for the lowest number so I knew I was right over the target. When pinpointing I could tell more on the audio how deep it was than the meter.

I don't care which brand or which model I have used, from any maker in more recent years, the Coin Depth Read-Out is frequently a little off. So far, using both my Racers, I have had Coin Depth estimates that were pretty close as long as I did my part and have the coil off to the side and centered when I triggered into the Pinpoint and Coin Depth function.

I also see I lost my rubber cover over the trigger switch too, I am sure there was one on it, but not when I got done and never notice it was gone until the last couple of targets.

My pre-production Racer arrived as tight as possible, but they didn't have the rubber boot on the trigger toggle. When my friend got a recent production Racer, both the arm cup bolts were on okay, but they were not snugged up and he had to tighten both of them. When I got my production Racer, it also had both armcup bolts that needed to be tightened. When I met a friend last Monday and he opened and assembled his production Racer, it, too, had the armcup bolt in place and mostly fitted, but they needed to be tightened with a few twists of the bolt & nut.

Now, I mention this for others to maybe check and see is things are tight on their Racer. That would include both of the armcup bolts and nuts, and possibly it might be good to make sure the rubber boot has been installed snuggly on the trigger toggle. It's possible that yours wasn't.

I also ground balance sever times being so easy to do and ran from 66-80.

Good to check and adjust as needed when the ground phase varies across that broad a range.

Just got to learn more and to do this means I have to use it more as the more I use it the more I will learn and the better it is going to get Right??

Yes, and enjoy every minute of working that Racer. Learn it, and learn any accessory coils you have for it, too.

Monte

 

[Rick(ND)]

The coil I was using on the Racer was the stock coil 11X7 and the coil my wife uses is the 5X7 or something like it as this and the little 4X6 is the only 2 coils we use with it.
I tried my filter at the stock 10 then switched to 23 and wound up at 50 to get most of the small iron rejected from the audio for now until I learn more about this detector as I want to make learning it as easy as possible and then mess with most lower tones.
On the depth meter I find I don't like most of them as the audio is what I go by more myself and most show deeper than the target is, but this is the first one that shows almost the same depth no mater how deep it is. I read the meter when I have pinpointed as it helps when I get the lowest depth reading as I know I am right over the target. Pinpoint has been right on most of the time as I do come from more than one direction to pinpoint as I learned with my Sovereigns as it help with the ID too, do find a few off a bit, but that could be the targets is at a angle.
I believe the arm cuff bolts are left a little loose so they can me adjusted to the person using it then tighten them as mine was this way too and I guess I should have checked my rubber cover on the pinpoint toggle switch and will have to get another one from the dist if possible.
I ordered another extra lower shaft for my small coil and I also ordered in the 11X7 coil with another lower shaft to , but that coil is back ordered from the dist and will be sent when available. I will say after buying lower shaft for the Minelabs these for the Racer are very reasonable and a person can get a extra shaft for any of the coils you may have as it sure make changing coils easy.


Thanks again for all the info as it will help us all.

Rick

 

[Monte]

I ordered another extra lower shaft for my small coil and I also ordered in the 11X7 coil with another lower shaft to, but that coil is back ordered from the dist and will be sent when available.

Comment #1: The lower roads are advertised with the two washers and coil bolt, so make sure that is part of the order.

Question #1: Did you mean you ordered the 5½X10 solid DD?

I will say after buying lower shaft for the Minelabs these for the Racer are very reasonable and a person can get a extra shaft for any of the coils you may have as it sure make changing coils easy.

Comment #2: I agree, the Makro and Nokta lower rods (the same washers and rods, but different bolts/nuts) are a very reasonable price, they are durable, and keeping spare coils already mounted makes coil changes afield quick and easy, PLUS it can eliminate the loss of a nut, bolt or washer during a physical regular coil swap.

Thanks again for all the info as it will help us all.

Rick

You're welcome and I am happy when anything I contribute is of some help to someone.

Monte

 

[Cal_Cobra]

I'm so used to detecting with my F75 at zero discrimination that 10 on the Racer is fine, and it's actually really pretty quite as it still knocks out the tiny iron.

Still lots to learn, I'll be hitting a couple of old sites later this week and then off to the races with the Racer at a big weekend long SoCal competition hunt.

I'm actually thinking the overload may be an advantage here as they typically just kick dirt of the coins, so as long as it doesn't get blasted out by EMI crosstalk from other machines, it might do pretty well with that Star Wars blaster sound effects hitting the surface coins

 

[Monte]

The Racer: Definitely a very functional and useful set of features, and in a Competition Hunt, when you know most of the targets are relatively shallow, you'll still get ample performance from the Racer with a reduced Gain, and that might help curb some of the EMI potential.

Question: I'm curious about the So. Cal. Competition Hunt. If you wouldn't mind, could you e-mail me the club/hunt info to: monte@ahrps.org

Invitation: Our Detector Owner Rendezvous metal detecting group is having an Open and Informal Outing to several ghost towns out of the Wendover, Nevada area. We are using Wendover as our "base camp" which is on the Utah/Nevada border, and this will be the weekend of May 16th and 17th, plus as many days after that attendees would like to stay. I believe many plan to stay through Wednesday or Thursday, or even longer.

There are at least 6 or 7 participating from our meeting group, and as of right now I have heard of 1 from California, 3 from Nevada, 2 from Colorado and 2 from Utah who intend to be there. Most of us have our motel reservations already made. It wouldn't surprise me if we pick up another 3 people, or perhaps even a half-dozen more who would like to enjoy a few days hunting some ghost towns.

If you can get away and would like to join us in Wendover, e-mail me and let me know. Matter-of-fact, this is an open invitation to anyone who would like to experience some fun with an opportunity to find some old coins, trade tokens and neat old artifacts that others have missed. Interested? Just e-mail me at the address above and I'll get back to you and add you to the list. Let me know who you are, how long you've been detecting, and what detector(s) and coils you plan to bring. I will be e-mailing out more May Outing information in a day or two.

Monte

 

[bubbadirect]

I'm actually thinking the overload may be an advantage here as they typically just kick dirt of the coins, so as long as it doesn't get blasted out by EMI crosstalk from other machines, it might do pretty well with that Star Wars blaster sound effects hitting the surface coins

Cal_cobra, I'm not sure if the racer will have this issue, but on my CoRe, I can hear my buddy and his Garrett ATPro within about 20 feet or so, pretty loudly actually!

Just FYI buddy! Let us know how the hunt goes! Sounds fun!

Bubba

 

[Cal_Cobra]

Bubba I'm a bit concerned about the EMI crosstalk at the hunt as well, as someone did mention getting some EMI xtalk from a MXT, and as you can imagine there's every type of machine imaginable at these planted competition hunts.

I'll bring my DST enabled F75 for a backup machine just in case the Racer gets blown out

 

[bubbadirect]

Bubba I'm a bit concerned about the EMI crosstalk at the hunt as well, as someone did mention getting some EMI xtalk from a MXT, and as you can imagine there's every type of machine imaginable at these planted competition hunts.

I'll bring my DST enabled F75 for a backup machine just in case the Racer gets blown out

Cal_cobra, just fyi also my xlt didn't seem to both the CoRe at all. And I did some air testing with them side by side. So hopefully the whites will not be an issue!

Bubba

 

[squirrel1]

XLT operates on a far lower freq than MXT. MXT, CoRe, and Racer very close. My Buddy has Fisher F-5 it operates near the XLT operating freq. With my F75 wide open in disc 9.0. My friend can run his F-5's coil with it on up to about 2.5 ft of my f75'ss coil before my F75LTD2 will even make a squeak.