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new to homebrew-coil help

A

Anonymous

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my apologies to all,I'm as green as they come. I am going to hopfully get one of Eric's pi machines soon, but I have a facination for coil designs. I understand only the basic of ideas of pi and want to build some experimental coils for the unit. The dd style is the one I would like to tackle. The info I've found sofar is a 4:1 ratio for transmit/recieve size and about 40-50 wraps with 28 gauge w/copper wire and overlap at 50/50 for the coils.
I have found geotech forums and this one.
I am unclear on the resitor placements and size and if there is another part of the coild design I have missed totally.
Once(and IF) I can build a working coil comparable to the stock units,I can start to learn and experiment. Thanks for the forum, Wyndham
 
Hi Wyndham,
No need to apologize about being "green as they come". We all start out that way.
Now, as to your request about info on building coils for one of Eric's PI's, it is something that has been discussed several times on this forum. So there is quite a bit of info that can be accessed by searching.
Now, as to the specifics, one has to be a little more exact as to which PI the coil will be for. It does make a difference in the selection of wire, the final inductance, etc. Fortunately, Eric's PI's are very forgiving so a wide range of wire sizes can be used and still obtain the desired results. However, if you want to try to duplicate Eric's coils as much as possible, I do recommend you try to use wire similar in size and try to follow his steps in building coils.
Now, it really helps to have some test equipment including a scope, an inductance (LCR) meter and a decent digital voltmeter. These tools make it much easier to tell just what is going on. A coil could be built without them but it would be much more difficult and it would be almost impossible to assure reliable operation. Many of these items can be purchased used to keep the costs down.
As for the coil winding ratio's, I prefer a 1:1 ratio between the xmit coil and the receive. In other words, my receive coil is basically the same as my xmit. At some point I may change that, but right now, I am leaving it alone. This makes the design much easier.
Now, as to the number of turns of wire needed, that is determined by the physical size of the housing and desired inductance. The housing will actually determine the size of the coil windings, which will determine the number of turns to obtain the desired inductance.
I found it is best to use one of the various programs available to help in determining the actual number of turns requires. I will then double check each coil with my LCR meter.
As for the exact overlap amount, that is something that can be experimented with. Generally, the overlap is such that there is a minimal signal in the receive with no metal present. This will occur with an overlap that is much less than you mentioned. In most cases, the width of the overlap area will be quite small. As an example, if an 11" round DD coil is to be made, the windings will have an overlap less than 1" or so to meet the criteria mentioned. This could vary some, but not a tremendous amount.
Now, I do have a wider overlap area on my DD coils for different purposes, so my DD coils are a little different, but even then, the overlap area is still much less than the overlap amount you mentioned.
Now, my main PI is a form of a GQ clone but my coils are built a little different than a standard GQ. In doing so, I decided to make the coils so they would work on three different machines including one of Eric's earlier designs the Goldscan. To do this, the inductance of my coils is less than the standard GQ and the wire size was increased. The coils still work fine on the GQ, work well on another PI, and should work on the Goldscan (GS). I just need to modify the GS so they all have the same plug.
Like I said, Eric's design allows for some differences in design. However, when making such changes, a scope is a necessity so a person can determine the ideal damping resistance.
Drop me an email if you need more info and I will try to help you.
Reg
 
Hi Wyndham,
Eric's PIs are a good choice if you what to experiment a bit. The Goldquest (GQ) is fairly simple in theory, but it soon becomes obvious when you look deeper, that many many years of experience and insight has gone into the selection and fine-tuning of its components.
I would first attempt the mono if you've never built a coil before. As Reg says, do a search on this forum and you will come up with a wealth of information, to get you going.
Because the GQ does with finesse, what the Minelabs do with brute force, it is easy to make very light compact coils. The maximum flyback voltage is less than 50 volts, and the coil current is below 300 mA, therefore you can use thin wire and small resistors.
As Reg pointed out you need to wind your coils (the TX at least) to match the inductance of the stock mono, so you will need some instruments to measure these values. This also means that you leave the damping circuit set one the board for the mono and damp each new coil independently. The picture, which I hope you can see, shows the type of connector I use, and the damping resistor soldered inside the plug housing.
A 10" DD I recently made had equal turns in the TX and RX windings, I used 0.25mm Kynar wire. The effective size of this coil is only 8" but it will detect a mans wedding band at 10" in highly mineralised ground, which means that I can build a much larger coil, and get a substantial depth increase beyond this.
Cheers
Kev.
<img src="http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/9348/Connector.jpg " alt="" />
 
Hi Wyndham,
I forgot to mention, and I hope that Eric, Reg, or others will correct me if I've got it inverted.
When making replacenment coils, fix the inductance of the TX coil at about 10uH lower in value than the stock mono, then you will need to add a resistor to your coil to effect critical damping. This will align parallel with that on the board, and no further adjustment will be needed. <img src="/metal/html/smile.gif" border=0 width=15 height=15 alt=":)">
If the new coil inductance is greater than the stock mono, the coil alone will now be OVER dampened by the on board damping circuit. <img src="/metal/html/frown.gif" border=0 width=15 height=15 alt=":(">
You could otherwise attempt to make its inductance EXACTLY equal to that of your mono, but its more involved.
Cheers
Kev.
 
Hi Wyndham,
This will only work if you keep the coil capacitance equal. It's a bit of a balancing act, one that Eric has down pat....and I for one have a lot to learn.
Cheers
Kev.
 
Hi Kev,
Yes, you figured it out correctly. The coil/cable capacitance is very important, particularly at short delays. What could be done, is to measure the resonant frequency of the existing coil and cable, and to make one that has the same fr.
Eric.
 
Thanks Kev & Eric for the help. Right now I am starting to see where the parts fall into place. The coil(s) and cable,though seperate parts are one. (I see it I just can't say it well)
Eric, Since I am going to use the detector on dry land, the jumper on the pc board for the mono/dd coil could be modified to an external switch, would this mod change any values(noise) for the coil? If it does, would both be affected or just the recieve signal. thanks wyndham
 
Hi Wyndham,
On the GQ version 2, the TX and RX are brought out to the 3 pin plug. When a mono coil is plugged in, there is a link in the coil connector that joins the two together. If a DD or concentric is used, then the link in the connector is left off. In other words there is no jumper on the pc board. You would need an additional damping resistor across the receiver winding, and this would best be mounted in the plug as Kev shows.
Eric.
 
Thanks, Starting to get parts and equitment together to work with. Are concentric coils on par or sub par to either mono or DD?
 
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