Notch and Deep Targets with no VDI

[Nick A]

If notch is a function of target ID, how does this impact those deep targets that sound good, but do not give a VDI number? For example, if I set the notch to allow a VDI range of 80-90 only, is that then only allowing signals that have a VDI? Meaning that a deep target in that range would be discriminated/notched or not heard as it does not have a VDI number?

In other words, notch only works on targets that give a VDI number? If there is no VDI reported, then the machine would not give an audible response?

 

[CT Todd]

That is a very good Question. I never thought of that. Given that a deep or tiny target that is not showing any TID my thought would be that it wouldn't be affected by the Notch you have set. The Notch is completely driven by the assigned TID for any target and you set the tones per break points or maybe running full tones.

3 weeks ago I dug a lot of very deep targets with no TID. I had a Notch setting of 8-30. What I didn't do was pay attention to which tone I was listening to for these targets. I run 4 Tones. If I had listened to that tone then I would know the range at least that was assigned to the targets.

I don't know but will do some testing on my next deep target with no TID number.

Excellent Question

 

[squirrel1]

Well,
With my deus units, I can notch out a nickel-giving some lead way on both sides. And my 10" nickel in my test garden still rings in.

So notch with deus can be used as a shallow(er) junk target ridder, but a deeper target will come thru.

Just remember your sens, reactivity, freq, silencer setting , soil will effect the depth where the deus goes to tone only..

 

[CT Todd]

If you have notched a Target ID # of lets say 65 it will not matter how deep or shallow a TID of 65 is. You will not hear it.65 is 65. We are talking about a target without a TID.

 

[squirrel1]

I don't know exactly what you are trying to say.

I just went into my yard and did a test.
In deus fast nickel reads 63 on air testing.

I notched 00-72.

On surface nickel is knocked out.
Changed reactivity to 1 silencer -1.
Buried nickel roughly 7".
Nickel can be heard loud and clear with varying tid----higher tid than 72.
Notch doesn't work on deeper targets---- granted I guess I could have also notched additionally 80-99, and maybe the nickel wouldn't sound off, but who in their right mind would ever hunt like the that.

Btw air test doesn't seem to show this, but put the coin in the soil---yes.

And like I said previously with 00-72 notched, I can hear my 10" nickel in test garden---granted no tid at times sometimes 98.

 

[squirrel1]

And some additional info.
My 10" nickel in test garden- reactivity 1 silencer -1 loud and clear.
Now if I go to notch expert feature and start at 99 and notch backwards, I can notch down to around 99-94 and still hear the nickel---static//somewhat broken, when I approach 86, 99-86 notched nickel completely gone.

Btw i'm running 3 tone, guess which tone the deep nickel comes in at???? The highest tone, not the mid tone.

 

[squirrel1]

And for folks hunting old sites with loads of modern trash, try this. Notch 00-83 8 or 12khz reactivity 0 or 1 silencer -1. I'll bet you don't dig much shallow junk--- the deepest good stuff will still come through.

You see the Deus does have a surface blanker of sorts by using notch appropriately.
With the settings above you are blanking approx the first 6" of targets--- granted some of the smallest will still come through because the deus programming is being fooled somewhat.

 

[CT Todd]

Of course if your target is jumping around and it hits outside of the notch that you have set then it will give you a sound. This isn't the point of what has been asked. He has asked what sound any target would make if it shows NO TID Number at all Regardless of a notch being in place. That is the question.

 

[squirrel1]

I urge you to go back and read the ops questions again.

Your response to his questions was in fact incorrect.

You can notch a nickel and when it gets so deep depending on the detector's settings it will come through if depth detectable.

This no TID you keep referring to really has nothing to do with the ops question, and really has no bearing on the Deus operation when it comes to the notch function.

 

[squirrel1]

And I think I already proved even running a deus with hot settings all deeper depth detectable targets will come through tone wise as long as the approx 86-99 window is left open.
Granted this is somewhat freq dependent ---high conductors vs low conductors,

Soil mineralization will affect this to.

Deep targets that are providing the 94s/98s/no tid will provide the highest tone used at the time.

This does take into account a person would use the highest tone for the upper end spectrum I.e 90s range.

 

[CT Todd]

I'm out

 

[squirrel1]

Well I believe I answered all the ops questions.
And I did just go back to my 10"nickel in test garden to reconfirm.

If highest tone is being run in the 90 plus region--- high tone provided.
I then changed tone of the 90 s upper region to a much lower freq tone even lower than my mid tone setting running in 3 tone--- sure enough after the change the new lower tone rang on the 10" deep nickel.

 

[Nick A]

I have no idea what you're saying squirrel1. CTTodd understood my question correctly. I'm going to go back and read through your replies and see if I can understand what you're getting at. I feel like you confused what was a rather simple question.

 

[squirrel1]

In a nutshell,
Notch doesn't work on deeper targets---at least a way a person would think it would.


As far as tone provided on the deeper targets, whatever you have your the tone set in the 90 s range--- this is what you will hear.

Now if you had 2 tones set in the 90s region and hit a deep target, you couldn't say which tone you would hear.

Now you want to get rid of deep targets, sure it's simple---- just notch 90 plus, that'll do it.

Btw,
I believed you asked 5 questions total. Maybe not quite that simple.

 

[Nick A]

Ok, I think I got this. CTTodd was understanding my question, but I think Squirrel1 did too in a way. Is notch a function of a TID number? It would seem that it would have to be. Targets without a TID would not be notched. Squirrel1 seems to have answered this, "Notch doesn't work on deeper targets."

But I also don't want to confuse my simple question with talking about any other settings, ONLY Notch.

It occurred to me in reading what Squirrel1 wrote that indeed, a way of testing this would be if you had a target that would only show that sliver of black on the depth gauge, with a good repeatable sound but no TID. Then if you notch out 00-99, basically all possible TID numbers, would the target still sound off?

And this is where this gets interesting... because if I only wanted to be seeking out those deep targets with the sliver of black and no TID and ignore more of the modern junk that has a TID, this would be a way to really hone in and focus on only those deep, iffy signals with quieter tones. Squirrel1 says, "...who in their right mind would ever hunt like the that?" Someone like me, looking to cherry pick some old and interesting targets out of a site with some modern trash, zinc cents, canslaw and pulltabs within the range that TID is giving numbers. Why? Because the targets I really want are those deep ones that don't ID. Listening to all the modern garbage is distracting and if you're listening for whispers, those loud tones blow your ears off. Additionally, if this worked you could turn up the response volume to make those whispers louder too, without worrying about the sound being the same as a shallower target as you won't be hearing many signals from those shallower targets since they're going to tend to give TID numbers. It's something like surface blanking, but with the speed of the Deus and the way Notch works (without the depth killing discrimination). So, how about that?

In a site where you can't dig all, and have to be very selective about the holes you do dig this could get a few old keepers. Will some things be missed, yes, but perhaps a way to squeak out a few more pieces of good old stuff.

So, if squirrel1 has a 10" nickel in his test garden that only gives a silver of black signal on the depth meter and NO TID, a sound only target, he could do this test. If he notches out 00-99, does that nickel still sound off? If it does, then I think this might be very interesting to see how it would perform in the field. I know I wouldn't mind spending my time focusing on and digging only deep targets.

 

[squirrel1]

The answer is you notch all numbers--- no tone provided.

If you'll go back up and read, you'll see where I in fact started notching backwards from 99 and down. Once I got to 94 nickel tone scratchy/broken, then as I progressed to 86-- nickel gone.

Sure one can run loads of notch and still hit rather deep coins, but you had better not notch above 84 IMO----while at the same time getting rid of shallower stuff.

Just remember this depth blanking is dependent on sens setting, reactivity, silencer, and freq depending on what conductive range you are seeking.

And more folks besides us will read this.
It is rather strange sounding--- meaning you can notch out a nickel or a gold ring based on Vdi, yet still be able to find them.
Actual genius with the xp folks.
And folks you can't do this with the fisher f series detectots, because they up average on a too gradual a basis.
Another arrow in one's quiver--- should they decide to use

One note: a person electing to run a load of notch, they might want to consider running an adjacent program with no notch to check the broken or signals heard trying to sneak through.