Sovereign Depth Compared To Explorer/E-Trac/Etc?

[Critterhunter]

I've owned many detectors over the years including 2 or 3 Explorers. I ended up going back to the QXT Pro as it's always been one of my favorites and gets comparible depth on silver/copper coins, which is primarily my interest. However, I've personaly seen the Etrac get a good 2" more depth on two different undug silver dimes. I believe this is mainly due to it's roughly 2" size advantage of it's coil versus the 9.5" for the QXT. I would prefer to step up to a larger coil for the QXT but the only one available for coin shooting is the 12" Hot Shot. While I've heard good things about this coil on the XLT and 6000, for some reason the two brand new coils I used would become unstable on the QXT after about ten minutes of use, despite changing locations or trying lower sensitivity settings. This may have been due to the particular QXT I owned at the time but I'm not sure, as this coil should work with any of the Whites using the same frequency such as the QXT, XLT, 6000, and so on.

Anyway, while I made some good finds with the Explorer(s) there were several things I didn't like about them, including the tendency of the ID to "float", the weight of the machine, lousy pin pointing, and so on. Another particular thing that bothered me was the response time between targets. The QXT was much better in trash and about the fatest in response time between targets that I've seen. There are several things about the E-Trac that I feel fixed the complaints I had with the Explorer but as of now it's currently out of my price range.

I've looked at the X-Terra line and like what I see, but the lack of a 3khz coil in the 12+ inch size range for maximum depth on coins puts it out of my interest. I prefer a low frequency around 3khz to hit harder on silver/copper, yet the only coil at that frequency for it is 9".

So, I'm considering purchasing a used Sovereign for a few reasons. First, I would suspect that without the top heavy computer software of the Explorer/E-Trac that it's response time between targets would be quicker than them? Second, the range of various aftermarket coils for it for maximum depth on coins is something not available for my QXT, as said. I mainly hunt with zero discrimination on the QXT and assign high tones to the targets I'm interested in. This allows me to avoid target masking and also simply listen for a high tone mixed in with the lows, at which time I look at the target ID and investigate the target further. The one feature the QXT lacks that I would like to see, besides bigger coils, is a numerical target value of the target. The VDI numerical target display and multi tones of the Sovereign interests me for that reason as well.

Now to my questions: What coil do you guys consider to be the best for maximum depth on coins for this machine? And, secondly, how does the depth of the Sovereign with that coil compare to the Explorer and E-Trac? In other words, are there any other machines that you think go deeper on the Sovereign using the best coil for maximum coin depth?

Also, what is the difference between the various Sovereigns out there? Meaning, the GT versus the Elite and the other various older models?

Finaly, what don't you like about this machine? Is it heavy like the Explorer? Does it have trouble pin-pointing? Etc...

Thanks for your input on this matter.

 

[grumpy]

Critter; I dont know that the sov compared to the ex series is much diff in depth I have had both I like the sov gt because of the simplicity . The learning curve on the Ex series and all ant that bad you get used to it I just get tired of making a effort when the GT does it all with out the thought process involved with the computer models. Just relax and dig coins. The coils avaliable are the only gripe I h ave. I like the eliptical coils like on the other machines I have had you could get a wide variety of eliptical coils especially in the smaller ones and all the sov gt has aval is the Joey coil and I am not to fond of it. I would like a 4 by 6 and a 5 by 10 and 10 by 14 but there not there.
The stock ten tornado is a good coil it just wont let you fudge in next to things like and eliptical does.
Any hard core questions on the Sov give Rick ND a hollar he is really up on them.
Good Luck
Grumpy

 

[MonDak]

Grumpy said it all. I've used both for about 2 years now. The sov will consistantly give good
target ID at 6". With the exp, it will let you know somethings there, but after about 3" the
numbers and curser float all over the place and you wind up digging a lot more trash.
There's a couple of features I like better on the exp, but the feature of finding nice targets
without digging a lot of trash, the sov wins.

 

[Ron from Michigan]

The Sovereign and Explorer in my opinion are the two best detectors I've used for depth.I haven't used the Etrac but have used the Spectra Vision.The Explorer has an edge in depth on silver coins and will ID them better.The Sovereign is better at recovering and IDing Indian Head pennies and early wheat's.For large coils the Explorer ergonomics is off compared to the Sovereign so in the field use the Sovereign wins to continue a long hunt with a large coil.By the way I like both detectors and they compliment one another a good combo.

 

[Critterhunter]

I know what you mean about liking to use a machine that is easier to hunt with without worrying about if you have everything set up just perfect for max performance on a machine that has an overkill of bells and whistles. That's one of the complaints I have about the XLT versus the QXT. It's much easier to "run all out" on the QXT without constantly wondering if you've tweaked it out properly. Sure, you do need a certain amount of control over a machine to get it running at max depth and performance and the QXT offers that much control. Due to the XLT's top heavy software I find the QXT is also much more quicker to respond between targets and also has less ID float. These same complaints are why I didn't keep the Explorers I've owned over the years. You had to stay on top of the machine both physicaly and mentally to keep it operating at peak performance, which took a lot of the fun out of my hunts.

That's the reason why I think I might like the Sovereign. It has the key features needed to max it out, yet it isn't overloaded with software to slow it down or leave doubts in my mind as to exactly how it showed be set up at various sites. Add into this the fact that there are larger coils available for it to max my depth out on coins and it's numerical target display to split hairs better on various targets and it looks like a machine I might enjoy very much.

I have done a little reading on the various aftermarket coils for coin shooting for max depth. It appears from what I'm reading that the WOT coil is still the deepest but I'd like to hear more input on that. From the looks of it it's main competitor would be the 14" Excellerator coil and that other odd sized one (name escapes me at the moment) from a different company...which is said to have slightly less depth than the WOT at dead center. Are all these coils DD designs? I prefer concentric as they pinpoint easier, mask targets less, and get slightly better depth with a cone shaped signal rather than the wider style of a double D. Double Ds will handle mineralized ground better (not a problem in my area) and offer wider sweep areas for target detection. Still, I prefer the little extra depth and ability to laser out targets next to trash better of a concentric.

I would be interested to hear which coil gives max depth on coins in the opinion of others as well as the pros and cons of the various ones out there.

 

[Minermangold]

I personally found that the WoT coil is the most powerful of the large coils , forget the excel or butterfly coil (as it is very fussy during pinpoint) . I use the WOT coil for all my beach hunting , and it is a little much for parks , so I use a sunray a-5 coil. That little coil has fantastic depth and superior separation of trash that is too much for larger coils even stock. The sunray s5 will " poke" between targets to sniff out good signals , Example: I DO NOT swing this coil but move in small "S" shaped motions , it is a dream come true in parks. Other detectorists I observed quickly moved thru an area and I would work methodically slower around the same trees using this coil and technique and produced finds in the range of 4 to 1.
The sovereign comes in various forms each operating very similar except where knob settings are a little different than another sov model. I use the black box XS-2A on a straight shaft for more balance. They don't require a long learning curve , you need only to learn the way targets tone. Some people hate the iron nulling feature naturally built in , but it is a great feature to alert you of soil conditions and with a small coil you can investigate closer to see if any goodies are masked.

So if going with a SOV try these coils.

WOT 15"
Sunray 12" ( great coil too)
Sunray 8". (better than stock)
Sunray. S-5 (parks, playgrounds, etc.)

 

[UtahRich]

Is the Sovereign GT compatible with the older aftermarket Sovereign coils and meters?

 

[Ron from Michigan]

Critterhuter,All Sovereign's coils will interchange with every model from the GT to the Original.The larger coils are great, but a beginner should avoid these and stick with the Coinsearch 8 inch coil or 800 coil to learn the Sovereign.A Sovereign with a BBS 800 coil should give you greater depth than what you are getting with your Whites.HH Ron

 

[Rick(ND)]

Any of the Sovereign coils will interchange with the newer GT, but none of the Explorer coils will on the Sovereigns and only Sovereign coils will fit on the GT including all aftermarket ones made for the Sovereigns. Now on meters I only seen one that didnt work for the GT, but worked on the older ones but cant remember which one it was.

 

[Rick(ND)]

I have used most all the different coils for the Sovereign in my last 13 years using a Sovereign and find that I have differnt opinions on them as some do. I tried 3 or 4 differnt WOT up here in ND for our hunting of parks, ballfeild and schools and let others Sovereign user try it too and found it OK, but not as good as we expected it too be for this type of hunting. If we were doing beaches or area where you want bigger coverage I think it would good better. The Sun Ray S-12 sees to work best for me for a bigger coil while for a all purpose coil the Sun Ray S-8 or the 10 inch Tornado coil work good and for the real trashy area the S-5 seems to be the best. The S-12 when I did the field test for park hunting I found it was by far the best coil I have ever used on a Sovereign and while doing this test I was able to have James ND with his Explorer XS at this park and we compared signals and seen it got every GOOD signal the Explorer could see.

Rick

 

[UtahRich]

Thanks Rick, this reference is very helpful.

 

[Southwind]

I've owned the X-Terra 70, Sovereign GT, the Explorer SE and now own the E-Trac. The GT is very close to the ET on depth, but it lacks in a good target ID. If you're a dig-it-all type hunter, then target ID isn't such a big deal, but I'm a selective digger. I had the 180 meter on my GT but it was accurate on the deep stuff like the ET is.

In my opinion the E-Trac is a step above all those I have owned, but out of those the GT was the closest in depth.

 

[terrywl]

I hunt with the Xcal II ( a water proof sovereign) and with the E-Trac. Depth is about the same for both these machines. My Whites are collecting dust now. I just don't find as much with them. One thing I have learned is that a really good hunter that knows his machine will produce regardless of brand name.IMO

 

[Critterhunter]

Thanks for all the input. I'm still wondering if the WOT is the deepest coil for coins or if there might be another that has better depth. I hunt a lot of open areas where trash isn't a factor and so I need to know what the deepest coil is for coin shooting. In trashy parks it sounds like that 5" coil might be very useful for pulling coins mixed in with heavy trash. Is there a smaller coil that lasers out good targets even better for it, or one made by another company that some feel might do a better job than the Sunray?

By the way, if anybody has a used GT they'd like to sell let me know. I'll pay cash or might even trade a QXT Pro and whatever amount in cash to make the trade even if anybody is interested.

 

[JHM]

In my opinion the WOT is the deepest and the heaviest. I weighed the sovereign the other day. With the coinsearch which is a light coil and a sunray meter, it tipped the scales at 6 pounds. No wonder my back hurts after about 3 hrs. But it's worth it. I'm scared to weigh it with the WOT.

 

[Beachnut]

Having just gotten my hands on a 1 year old used Sov. GT, with a total experience with it of 3 hours on the beach today, hear is my 2 cents worth.
With the stock 10" coil, you can not get as close to the swing set steel pipe supports. My Whites could get within about 12 to 14" away from the steel pipe before being overcome from the steel. With the GT, it is effected 2 feet out! I would say it is more sensitive than the whites, sideways, to a target, (and possibly depth), but this keeps you from hunting near anything metal.

When it nulls, (From iron or trash), The GT does take about 1 and 1/2 times longer to recover than my old Whites 6000 DI Pro SL, and it was not that fast on recovery either. I would assume the newer faster computer Minelabs would handle the null recovery better than the GT, but with the GT just slow it down when you hear it null, it could be a good target anyway!

Pinpointing with the GT is mostly a guess. This could be due to my total lack of experience. Whites units has this down, pull the trigger, highest loudest tone in the center of coil, your dead on it! (in a 3" circle). GT so far is go all metal mode, swing the coil around the suspected target until you get "an eye" on the general area (about the size of the 10" coil), and dig it! This is no problem in sand at the beach, but in a park, with lawn? I am sure someone hear can tell us how it is done better than what I have found in 3 hours!

Trash targets are cut down by 2/3Rd's compared to my Whites, (using the GT), but not sure yet if i might be missing something due to less trash noise, yet. (First GT use, 3 hours = 9 Penney's, 2 nickels, 1 very large triple hoop gold earring! Impressive!)

I ordered a EXcellerator 12 x 15 due to what someone on this forum said. I did not copy and paste his name when I saved it, so sorry i can not give credit to whom it is due, but here is what they said:

When i used the sovereign as my main machine i had a Wot 15" for the beach, i then bought the Sef 15x12 and never put the wot on again and eventually sold it, great depth, coverage, separation and sensitivity to smaller targets, i bought one for the explorer from new and now use it on the etrac. The only thing against it is its a tad hevier than the others but well worth it, i also have the next size down 10x12. Waterproof no problems but check the nut where the wire goes into the coul before use, on both this was slack as if tightened by hand

Hope this helps

Beachnut

 

[kered]

the 12" x 15" is not a Excelerator but a S.E.F (symetrical electromagnetic field) although they are made by the same people Detech. Glad my post was of some use to someone
You may find you can get closer to the pipe head on rather than sideways and also turning down the sens a bit.
Pinpointing wise the centre should be just forward of the conecting lugs(10" coil) you could try it on a target on the surface then paint a corespondent spot on the coil at the sweet spot, by the time it wears off you'll have it sused, also try the backward wiggle, as soon as the target disapears its just in front of the coil, or in the V at the front of the 12x15

 

[Neil]

Having just gotten my hands on a 1 year old used Sov. GT, with a total experience with it of 3 hours on the beach today, hear is my 2 cents worth.
With the stock 10" coil, you can not get as close to the swing set steel pipe supports. My Whites could get within about 12 to 14" away from the steel pipe before being overcome from the steel. With the GT, it is effected 2 feet out! I would say it is more sensitive than the whites, sideways, to a target, (and possibly depth), but this keeps you from hunting near anything metal.

When it nulls, (From iron or trash), The GT does take about 1 and 1/2 times longer to recover than my old Whites 6000 DI Pro SL, and it was not that fast on recovery either. I would assume the newer faster computer Minelabs would handle the null recovery better than the GT, but with the GT just slow it down when you hear it null, it could be a good target anyway!

Pinpointing with the GT is mostly a guess. This could be due to my total lack of experience. Whites units has this down, pull the trigger, highest loudest tone in the center of coil, your dead on it! (in a 3" circle). GT so far is go all metal mode, swing the coil around the suspected target until you get "an eye" on the general area (about the size of the 10" coil), and dig it! This is no problem in sand at the beach, but in a park, with lawn? I am sure someone hear can tell us how it is done better than what I have found in 3 hours!

Trash targets are cut down by 2/3Rd's compared to my Whites, (using the GT), but not sure yet if i might be missing something due to less trash noise, yet. (First GT use, 3 hours = 9 Penney's, 2 nickels, 1 very large triple hoop gold earring! Impressive!)

I ordered a EXcellerator 12 x 15 due to what someone on this forum said. I did not copy and paste his name when I saved it, so sorry i can not give credit to whom it is due, but here is what they said:

When i used the sovereign as my main machine i had a Wot 15" for the beach, i then bought the Sef 15x12 and never put the wot on again and eventually sold it, great depth, coverage, separation and sensitivity to smaller targets, i bought one for the explorer from new and now use it on the etrac. The only thing against it is its a tad hevier than the others but well worth it, i also have the next size down 10x12. Waterproof no problems but check the nut where the wire goes into the coul before use, on both this was slack as if tightened by hand

Hope this helps

Beachnut

Hi Mike,

try using a smaller coil around the steel poles with your sens turned down all the way. you will still get good depth. also make sure and move the coil very slow.
a good way to practice pinpointing in disc mode is put a coin on the ground and visually see where your getting your signal at. its not as difficult as it initially apprears. you can see where your signal starts on both sides and then in the middle is your coin. the beach is a great place to practice/learn.
Ive never heard of a lower man rod for the sov series, you should be able to see if they have one by either calling one of the forum sponsors who sell minelabs or just to to minelab.com and see if they have one listed for it. at each detector page they have an accesories tab you can click on to view whats available from minelab.
best of luck with it!
Neil

 

[Critterhunter]

Hey Rick(ND), I've been going through all the old threads reading up on what I can so as not to ask more questions that have already been answered. Anyway, forgive me if I have the wrong guy, but on several occasions I think it was you who said that the Explorer seems to have just a tad more depth than the Sovereign on silver coins. For the most part I've seen that most guys who have owned and used both seem to think they are about evenly matched depth wise, but there are a few say that the Explorer does get a hair more depth on silver.

Anyway, I think you said in prior messages that in the field you've tested Sovereign/Explorer signals and found that you could get 95 to 99% of them that the Explorer heard. I think you also said that there were a few times were the Explorer user thought the target was a deep coin but the Sovereign said it was iron, and it turned out to be.

Beyond all that, what I'm wondering is if these comparisons were with a GT or an older Sovereign and with what size coil? My thinking is that the slight edge on depth over the Sovereign that a few say it has may be either due to an older Sovereign (GT is said to be a bit hotter and ID deeper than older ones), or somebody using something like the 8" coil instead of an equal size one to the Explorer like the 10". Can you chime in on this at all?

My other defensive logic is that I know from experience that the Explorer can be a bit tricky with sensitivity settings. Foul that up and performance drops real quick. Less chance to screw things up with the GT IMHO just based on my experience with both. Also wondering if the Sovereign used in the field to compare targets was tweaked out to maximum sensitivity (a little falsing) versus set lower with a nice easy smooth threshold

Just a few things I was kicking around after reading through all the old Explorer/Sovereign comparison threads in this forum. For the most part people say depth is pretty well even, with maybe a slight lean towards the Explorer edging a little deeper on silver. But again, I'd like to know if that was with a GT and same size coil used in comparisons. I guess if anything the "performance tune" for the GT might make any difference nill between the two. The other consensus seems to be that the Explorer is much more apt to be fooled by deep junk. Less junk dug with the Sovereign from what people say.

Just trying to justify my GT over the 3 Explorers I used to own. Even if I could be convinced to go back to one I wouldn't because I simply can't handle it's unbalanced weight with no possibility to hip mount it. BBS or FBS technology is pretty much where it's at these days for depth and performance. Quatro/Safari is out of the question. Etrac is a little bit out of my price range at the moment. Explorer is the old girlfriend I don't want to go back to. Hoping the GT is something I can have confidence in.

 

[nick hunter]

Hi !

I've been using a GT for about two months now, coming from a Quattro (still own this one). If I'd compare those two units, well, the GT is definitely deeper with a smaller coil (10 vs10.5 "). Inches deeper when I use the "reverse disc" tip I learnt a few weeks ago on this forum.

I cannot compare to Explorer and Etrac, but I downloaded their respective emulators. From what I could make of it, The Explotracs cannot seperate the coins I'm after, nor can they give more info than the Quattro does.

So I don't need digital, plus I'm more of an "audio" hunter.

The Quattro (and the explotracs) are way too heavy for me, but they are (at least the Q i own) great beach machines.

But I think I "saw the light" when I first thought of buying a Sovereign.

Grtzzz