Tried 2 Tone Ferrous Today

[OhioCoinHunter]

Today I decided to give two tone ferrous a try with my E-trac. For three hours I hunted a local park that I've hunted to death. I hunted the first two hours in two tone ferrous with a wide open discrimination screen. During that two hours I dug some trash, two memorials, two wheat cents, a bracelet with an eagle on it and a 1940S Mercury dime.

For the last hour I hunted in the multi tone conductive mode with discrimination. The only coins I found were a memorial and a wheat cent. That's all.

Here's what I like about two tone ferrous. I'm able to hunt with a wide open discrimination screen - no discrimination. With two tones I get a Iron or Not Iron tone. A quick glance at the numbers on the screen help me determine whether or not to dig. I found stuff I didn't get on previous hunts at the same location with the more standard multi tone conductive mode.

Observations. When I got the signal for the 1935 Wheat cent in two tone ferrous, I decided to re-scan the hole before I dug to see if I could get the signal in multi tone conductive mode. I changed the settings and passed the coil over the hole. My E-trac could easily detect the coin. Later on I got a deep signal in two tone ferrous. I thought it might be an indian. I re-scanned in multi tone conductive and still got the signal. However I didn't dig because the ground was hard like baked clay. I'll go get it, whatever it may be, after a good rain. My conclusion is that I can't say for certain I wouldn't have found the Mercury dime, the bracelet and the two wheats in the multi tone conductive mode.

I also want to add that it was fun hunting in two tone ferrous.

Happy Hunting!
Dan

Finds

1940S Mercury Dime

Eagle Bracelet
(Not Silver)

Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6y7e1-fkqA

 

[dgc]

Thanks for that video. It was very well done. Also thanks for your insights on 2 tone ferrous. Glad your recovery is going well.

 

[NebTrac]

Thanks Dan! Appreciated the video hunt. Congratulations on the finds and hope the knee continues to heal!

NebTrac

 

[Bilko]

gel knee pads are good.nice story thanks

 

[hunter 18]

Sweet Hunt~ Congratulations

 

[Southwind]

Nice finds.

I gave 2 tone ferrous a try myself this weekend but didn't really have any luck. I dug a lot more trash(iron) then I usually do. If using 2 tone ferrous simply makes more iffy signals sound good then I really don't have much use for it. I normally run in multi-tone(variance up to 30) conductive and I can hear the falsing from iron because it is a very high tink type sound. In 2 tone ferrous those same false signals sounded just like any other good signal.

 

[Gaz]

......Southwind!.......dude......what EXACTLY are you doing wrong???

It sounds like you still don't get it. You must be doing something wrong mate???

How can you dig tons of iron using 2 tone ferrous??? I just don't understand what you're doing??

The only trash you should be digging is the type of trash which is non-ferrous and gives everyone a good signal regardless of what settings they using?

It's failing me that you're the only person on here that can't make it work!!!

Tell us your EXACT settings and let's see if there is something different going on.............

 

[Southwind]

Unless some major change takes place in the electronics between ferrous and conductive tones I just don't see how they can be that different other than simply having 2 tones for those who have problems with multi-tone.

It's a digital signal that gets processed so that means the software/firmware is just addressing the same numbers differently. Sure on shallow iron the E-Trac easily can tell the difference, but it's the deep iron that causes falsing not shallow. I run a wide open CO and FE open after 26. Basically a quickmask. I set it on ferrous sounds 2 tone whats left to change? It still gives a false positive on deep pointed iron just like it does in multi-tone, the difference is it all sounds the same with just 2 tones. At least in multi-tone(variance at max 30) I can tell a false iron from the very high tink.

 

[Gaz]

I think we may be getting somewhere now mate.

We tried those settings and found something happens differently. We had a little quickmask at the bottom and used 2 tone ferrous.
It was un-usable mate!!!
Something happens and it does, as you say cause some very erratic behaviour.

Do this mate........open the screen wide open then black out the top line only for now. Only one pixel across the FE01 line.
I've found that deep iron wraps around from FE35 to FE01. This will stabilise the machine and transform it.

Do that and give it another go. Dig ALL high tones and IGNORE all low tones.

Let us know how you get on.

All the best.

Gaz.

 

[Southwind]

Thanks! I'll get it a go.

 

[moseng]

Thanks Dan! Good review of 2-tone ferrous and as usual good vid! Oh yeah, congrats on the treasures!!

 

[NebTrac]

I think we may be getting somewhere now mate.

We tried those settings and found something happens differently. We had a little quickmask at the bottom and used 2 tone ferrous.
It was un-usable mate!!!
Something happens and it does, as you say cause some very erratic behaviour.

Do this mate........open the screen wide open then black out the top line only for now. Only one pixel across the FE01 line.
I've found that deep iron wraps around from FE35 to FE01. This will stabilise the machine and transform it.

Do that and give it another go. Dig ALL high tones and IGNORE all low tones.

Let us know how you get on.

All the best.

Gaz.

I hunted several old homesteads yesterday. No good finds because that dang grass was a foot high or better. Just had to swing in the spots where you could. I was experiencing the same thing Southwind was on occasions. I was ready it for it Gaz. I remembered exactly what had been discussed and viewed on your video a month or two back about the "wrap around" effect. A low tone and quickly or tailing that low tone a high peep. You look at the screen and it alwas has a Fe of 01 and on a slight occassion an 02. You play with the target and circle it and usually you could clear up any doubt. Swing speed is very critical to this also. The E-Trac is very, very versitile.

NebTrac

 

[Gaz]

Thanks Neb!

I came to the 'wrap around' conclusion by accident really. I was convinced that iron wrapped around from FE35 to FE01 but people wouldn't believe it.

I just carried on and thought that if folk won't listen to a possible reason why this is happening........so be it. I ran an open screen but blacked out the whole top FE01 line.

This transformed the machine and lost all of those annoying high toned iron squeaks. I then then opened up a small section in this blacked out line for large silver. CO 38 to CO 48.

I was absolutely in heaven when I read the article by forum member Digger quite a bit later on the X-Terra 70. He was basically confirming that the same thing was happening on the 70 and
the whole thing isn't linear, it's circular!!!
That's why on the XTerra 70, large iron will sometimes hover between -8 and +48 which are the bottom and top of the TID scale.

............food for thought!

Gaz.

 

[captn_se]

Yep,

I too have seen the iron wrap-around effect on the SE, Gaz! When the machine falses on iron, I have noticed high Ferrous values (31 Fer is max on SE), then wrap around to 0 Ferrous (with a "half box" Target ID hanging on the far right side of the display. It will jump anywhere along the vertical Ferrous 0 line). I just blacken out the upper right-most 4 pixels of the SE display to quiet the high iron pings, in addition to hot rocks, so I can hear the silver targets better.

Hey, Dan!! Nice video!! I'm really glad to hear your knee is improving, and you're able to go out hunting again!!

Congrats on your finds!! Good luck next time out!

CAPTN SE
Dan

 

[Goes4ever]

Great finds Dan glad the 2 tone ferrous was able to pull some goodies for you. after much experimenting and digging a TON of signals with 01 ferrous values I gave in and disc those out as well, I know I dug a couple deep coins that were 01-31 but that was using conductive sounds. When using ferrous sounds, anything I dug with a ferrous value of 01, turned out to be iron. So I Blacked out the 01 line (01-01 thru 01-31) and the machine runs quieter, and no more iron falsing!

 

[in the woods]

Nice, I'm still waiting for that first silver coin in two tone ferrous.
Tin Pan Man

 

[Digger]

I've followed your posts on 2-tone ferrous and agree that there are places that 2-tone ferrous works quite well. But I'm afraid you lost me on this one....

I know I dug a couple deep coins that were 01-31 but that was using conductive sounds. When using ferrous sounds, anything I dug with a ferrous value of 01, turned out to be iron.

In my mind.....
2-tone ferrous provides an audio response based on the ferrous properties of the target. The E-TRAC software is either going to generate a low tone for ferrous readings higher than 17. Or it will generate a high tone for a ferrous reading of 17 or less. In your example of 01-31, you would hear a high tone. Sweeping that same 01-31 target using conductive tones, the audio tone is based on the conductive reading of 31. And the software will generate a tone who's pitch is based on the number of tones the user selects. Since the software matches the tone to the ferrous and/or conductive values, I don't understand how 01-31 could represent coins when you are listening to the conductive portion of the TID of 01-31, but has always been iron when listening to the ferrous portion of the TID of 01-31? The target's ferrous and non-ferrous values did not change from 01-31. The only change is that you chose to hear the audio tone for the target's ferrous properties instead of the audio tone for the target's conductive properties. I might be missing something in your post. But I don't see how listening to one target value (ferrous) compared to the other target value (conductive) can distinguish between two targets comprised of the same values.
Let me know what it is I'm missing. Thanks. HH Randy


One thing I will add....... even though the E-TRAC software is responsible for providing both the audio and visual indications, I think the audio tone precedes the visual TID. The reason I believe the visual TID "lags behind" the audio is because when X-ing over a target, the audio can change with each sweep, allowing for better separation of targets. The visual TID, on the other hand, does not update as quickly. To me that makes the audio tone a more "up to date" indicator of target properties than the visual TID. But as with all my posts, that is JMHO. HH

 

[Goes4ever]

Randy all I know is I have dug two really deep indians that gave me a solid reading of 01-31 from 2 directions, so I was afraid to disc out the 01 line when using two tone even though people here suggested I do that because of the wrap around effect that iron can do. So I dug 01-31 signals over and over when using 2 tone ferrous and every single one was deep nails. So I gave up and just disc'd out the 01 line from 01-01 to 01-31 and now I am running smoother and quieter. because most sites I hunted at were filled with 01-31 signals and they gave a high tone. Does that make any sense? Also 01-19 and 01-20 was rusty bottle caps as well that give a high tone in ferrous.

And some of the signals I got 01-31, so I flipped into condictive mode and it gave me readings of 35-45 over the same target that ferrous gave me a reading of 01-31..........explain that one?

But if I miss a deep coin every now and then and save myself from digging 100 deep nails with an 01-31 reading, I am willing to take that chance, and save myself all that wasted time and stick to signals that are at least closer to a coin signal when running ferrous

 

[Digger]

Thanks for the response.
If I found IH cents at the 01-35, I wouldn't reject the 01 ferrous line either! I'd build a program that rejected individual cells instead of using the "line item veto".

As to the numbers varying, depending on the tone you chose.....I can't explain that. The transmit and receive circuits don't know or care what type of tones we are listening for. In fact, those tones don't come into play until after the receive circuit has sent the information to be processed. After the ferrous and conductive properties are analyzed, the software provides us with the information we can use. My guess on having a signal jump from 01-31 in ferrous tone to a 35-45 in conductive tone might be indicating adjacent target(s), inaccurate noise channel or too much sensitivity, rather than an actual variance in the property value of the target. JMHO

Regarding your last comment...... with a rejected 01 line.......what if that last 01-31 was an 1877? HH Randy

 

[Goes4ever]

an 1877...........well I guess I would be out of luck!..lol
the 2 indians I dug were 01-31 not 01-35, I rejected 01-01 thru 01-31, give your detector a test, go into 2 tone ferrous at an old homesite and dig some of those 01-31 and report back what you find, I have dug a LOT of them trust me! rejecting those numbers was hard for me to do, especially since I knew I have dug two injuns that came in like that, but they were right in the middle of iron and I know one had a nail in the hole beside it.Those were found while using a coin program in conductive mode. And I have even had a clear with nothing around it signal come in at 01-31 and flipped it back into coin mode and conductive sounds and the signal then gave me 35-45.......I can't explain why, except for the wrap around effect??
and like I mentioned before rusty bottle caps give me a high tone in ferrous sounds and always come in around 01-19 to 01-21. I dug a LOT of them just trying to see what it was. Seems like everything with a ferrous reading of 01 has been iron. Geting rid of the 01 line has made me be able to concentrate on better signals

the odd thing is that I don't get many at all signals in ferrous sounds coming in at 02, 03, 04..........just 01, so it HAS to be be iron wrap around, and as far as too much sensitivity, I also use auto, so I doubt that would be the case.