Better Target Seperation but no improved Depth?

[EladSwerdna]

So the rumor is that this new latest and greatest machine has superior target seperation when compared to Minelab's previous models, but am I to understand correctly that depth has not been improved?

When I heard that Minelab was rumored to be coming out with a new machine earlier this year, I got my hopes up on a coin/relic machine that used Pulse Induction like the GPX's, but more affordable and more suited towards coin shooters.

Alas, to my dissapointment... (going off of rumor here) CTX3030 has no improved depth, but just a slightly improved FBS. This makes me sad...

I hope I am wrong. Anyone else feel this way?

 

[Critterhunter]

I'll wait to see some in field comparisons of it with another Minelab using the same coil. And if it does have better depth or separation, whether a good aftermarket coil on another Minelab can keep up. Too early to know any of these things until somebody does the testing and maybe posts some videos, so really nothing else can be said about the matter until those detectors are compared out in the field where it counts on undug targets.

 

[EladSwerdna]

I would imagine that "Increased Depth" would have been a major selling bullet... but I don't see it mentioned in that manner.

Nevertheless, I will probably upgrade to this new machine one day. I love the GPS/map features!

 

[Ray-Mo.]

for my old coin hunting at my public sites. Not sure how digging 12" plus holes will go over at said sites. For private sites and relic sites more depth would be a plus no doubt.
Has any forum members noticed the amount of loose dirt piled on the ground cloth when even a smallish diameter 12" plus hole is excavated???

 

[earthmansurfer]

I think there will be improved depth in ground that isn't "sweet". The improved ground balance functionality will more than likely give extra depth - I mean what else can improved GB do on an FBS detector?
At least that is wishful thinking on my part as my iron mineralized ground, though not terrible, does limit my depth. So far, 9" seems to be near the max on mid sized coins.

 

[EladSwerdna]

for my old coin hunting at my public sites. Not sure how digging 12" plus holes will go over at said sites. For private sites and relic sites more depth would be a plus no doubt.
Has any forum members noticed the amount of loose dirt piled on the ground cloth when even a smallish diameter 12" plus hole is excavated???

For someone like me, who hunts primarily in woods and fields, digging deep is not an issue. Detecting depth, however, is a huge issue for relic hunters and is one of the greatest challenges we have to face while using these machines. I have many sites that I know if I took a GPX machine into them, I would certainly come up with dozens of keepers that were hiding out deep below.

Better target seperation is great, but where is the love for the hidden deepies?

 

[Old California]

Good post,

Would rather see depth improvement in areas of poor ground especially harsh black sand in fresh water, Masking effects even todays top end detectors.

If the CTX can reduce masking even to a small degree, that alone is a step forward which will result with more finds.

Got my fingers crossed, hope the CTX has less issues with masking.
Paul (Ca)

 

[Ray-Mo.]

I think when a vlf type machine is built to get extreme depths it suffers from lack of discrimination and emi/instability issues . A pi unit with accurate ID & discrimination would be a dream come true for a lot of us.......

 

[EladSwerdna]

I think when a vlf type machine is built to get extreme depths it suffers from lack of discrimination and emi/instability issues . A pi unit with accurate ID & discrimination would be a dream come true for a lot of us.......

It would certainly be nice!

 

[stasys]

More depth and more, because not all targets huge coins, I had used Tone one allot for max what I can get from Explorers and Etrac and it was still not enough, but to get GPX is no point or no time and money.

 

[earthmansurfer]

Curious as I don't hear this asked much, actually never. You guys who are using PI (or who know of others using them), what is the deepest you see coins being found? And, are there many beyond say 12"? I just wonder if more depth is going to get us many more coins. My guess is yes, at least in certain spots.

 

[EladSwerdna]

Curious as I don't hear this asked much, actually never. You guys who are using PI (or who know of others using them), what is the deepest you see coins being found? And, are there many beyond say 12"? I just wonder if more depth is going to get us many more coins. My guess is yes, at least in certain spots.

I remember seeing a few videos on YouTube where they were finding coins at 18" (somewhere in Europe) with a GPX5000.

 

[Critterhunter]

I still have a lot of questions about the said improved separation abilities. So far what I'm seeing *leads me to beleive* (based SOLEY on reading, so I could very well be wrong) that it *might* just be a history of the prior target before the detection field moves on to see the next target, and not any *appearant to me only on what I've read thus far* improvement in separation otherwise. If that's the case (still waiting for more details that prove otherwise) then just noting your changing VDI response as you wiggle over the target(s) on any other Minelab *should* do just as well. This is ONLY based on what I have read, and thus take that with a huge grain of salt and talk to and decide your final conclusion from those who have actually compared two Minelabs on targets undug in the field. I could VERY well be wrong about this, so by any means DO NOT take my word for it and think otherwise. This is just my pet theory, and I have only what reading I've gathered so far to stand on to support it.

If a prior target VDI history report is all this plays out to be, the sharpest stick still wins. Which means either a good aftermarket coil like the 12x10 which will *many say* (not all) give improved depth over the Pro Coil as well as enhanced separation over a typical DD coil in the left/right perspective. Or, at the very least, going for pure "best" separation abilities (if only over a 12x10 in the respect of the length of the DD detection field and not necessarily in the width)...Going to a smaller coil such as an X-5 or such still *might* "poke" the best at target. As said, only if this plays out to be the situation in respect to separation abilities or any enhancements there of in terms of the ability to "see" two targets in the field at the very same time.

Detection fields are where it matters to me, and I haven't seen yet (but that could easily change with more field reports or more detailed technical data) in no amount of technology from any manufacturer that makes this a mute point. You have to see what you want, and also not see what you don't want, in order for a detector to unmask what it does want...And that boils down to just how sharp the detection field is. So far the 12x10 has done the best for me in those respects in the left/right width perspective to be able to wiggle between and separate targets. Even standard round DD coils are a vast improvement over typical concentric coils in this respect, but I must say the SEF has been even a huge step above any typical DD coil I've ever used in this left/right separation respective.

 

[john4840]

Hello guys I wanted to share with you a response I got back from Darin Brown Customer Care Technician of Minelab about the depth of CTX.

John, the CTX will perform on par with any other FBS machine with the Minelab name on it. I can tell you from an development point of view there was no intended idea of increasing depth over say an E-Trac. However with the advancements in the coil technology our field testers have reported increased depth. This obviously is still very subjective but reports none the less. The idea behind the CTX was to find more good stuff and less junk or better yet more good stuff amongst junk that your old machine was telling you it was probably junk when it wasn

 

[Southwind]

Isn't depth relative to conditions? If you have very difficult ground, be it minerals or trash, and due to conditions you can only get 4-5" and better separation gives you the ability to hit those 7-8" targets then wouldn't'[t that be improved depth?

 

[Critterhunter]

I think there will be improved depth in ground that isn't "sweet". The improved ground balance functionality will more than likely give extra depth - I mean what else can improved GB do on an FBS detector?
At least that is wishful thinking on my part as my iron mineralized ground, though not terrible, does limit my depth. So far, 9" seems to be near the max on mid sized coins.

From what I've read there does in fact appear to be an improvement in ID at depth (not necessarily per say depth, but better ID at depth) with this machine in certain rare soil conditions, based on it's ability to further enhance ignoring the ground signal via a further ground balancing function that prior Minelabs don't have (beyond the excellent job that BBS and FBS machines already do at ignoring the ground signal...Well beyond the ability of other machines on the market).

However, I wager this further ability is only going to be apparent in the worst and rarest of hunting conditions that the majority of hunters wouldn't experience. I would bet that under most common and yes even mineralized conditions any prior Minelab will compensate just fine with the soil conditions, but there will be exceptions to this rule where the further added ground cancelling abilities of this new machine might show an advantage for IDing at depth, if not necessarily getting any deeper at depth. For instance, there are some other machines on the market that appear to have the ability to "match" a Minelab in depth. The problem is they don't ID as well at those depths.

That's just my "gut" feeling on this new machine compared to other Minelabs, and I await future field testing to see how that plays out. I only base this "bet" on the fact that Minelab hasn't come out and said the very thing this thread is about....That the machine has better depth ability. If this further ground neutralizing ability was to show it's self even in common grounds most hunters encounter then I would think, like the person who initiated this thread said, that Minelab would have made it a point to promote the further depth ability under most conditions.

 

[EladSwerdna]

Isn't depth relative to conditions? If you have very difficult ground, be it minerals or trash, and due to conditions you can only get 4-5" and better separation gives you the ability to hit those 7-8" targets then wouldn't'[t that be improved depth?

Good point. When refering to specifically difficult ground, I can see how that would indeed add depth.

However, FBS still lacks the depth (I want) in "easy" ground.

 

[EladSwerdna]

Not to get off topic, but this link is about the depth of Minelab's amazing GPX5000.

The GPX 5000 Depth Advantage ( Corfe Castle Rally, 2010)

The guy is shoulder deep in holes pulling out coins.

Now that the CTX 3030 is out, I have to save up an even larger amount of money to buy them both!

 

[earthmansurfer]

Not to get off topic, but this link is about the depth of Minelab's amazing GPX5000.

The GPX 5000 Depth Advantage ( Corfe Castle Rally, 2010)

The guy is shoulder deep in holes pulling out coins.

Now that the CTX 3030 is out, I have to save up an even larger amount of money to buy them both!

Absolutely amazing depth, around 16" on a small Roman coin. Not a park machine.

Discriminatin to boot.

Thx for posting that. Hopefully the make an affordable version someday.

 

[stasys]

Isn't depth relative to conditions? If you have very difficult ground, be it minerals or trash, and due to conditions you can only get 4-5" and better separation gives you the ability to hit those 7-8" targets then wouldn't'[t that be improved depth?

In usual situations you are right Southwind, but to know this we have to make side by side test with older FBS..