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First Gold Nugget with new White's PI

S

steve herschbach

New member
Hi,

There is a picture of the first gold nugget found with the new White's ground balancing pulse induction unit at http://www.findmall.com/read.php?27,674743. You can also get a glimpse of part of the unit.

Steve Herschbach
 
Hi Steve so how do you like the new Whites PI machine? I am assuming that this unit is a land based unit Is it possible to waterproof this unit? How good do you think this machine would work underwater for diving? Hope to hear what you may have to say about it. Aloha
 
Aloha makahaman,

I got to test a prototype in Hawaii last November. In the past I have favored the Garrett Infinium and Surf PI Pro. But the Surf PI pro has issues with the basalt cobbles, and the Infinium has interference issues. The proto was better than either. It handled the basalt better than the Infinium and was seemingly immune to interference. It is the best unit I've used in Hawaii. Only problem is it was not submersible. Frustrating, to say the least. I have been lobbying hard for an underwater version but have not had even a hint that one will happen. It would make sense after spending so much time and money on this unit to get some extra sales by just sticking it in an underwater housing.

The bottom line is this. I'll wait until fall to see if an underwater version appears. If not, I will have the dry land version converted into an underwater unit before next December, when I hope to visit the beautiful Hawaiian Isles once again.

People may think I'm hyping this unit up. The fact is PI detectors are not for everyone. This unit is based on Eric's Goldscan 5 and that alone means it is a good unit. But while Eric is a genius, he is only one person. White's has more resources and more people involved and so the final result will bear no resemblance to the Goldscan 5 but will be recognizable as a White's unit. I pretty sure even Eric will be pleased with the final result since this is his brainchild. And I hope he made some good money in the process!

I've been detecting since 1972. It is only rarely a unit comes along that really intrigues me. So much stuff these days is the same old same old. This unit is going to get a huge amount of my detecting hours and I'm betting I'll be posting some great finds with it. 2008 is going to be a fantastic year!

Steve Herschbach
 
This is definitely getting more exciting!
 
I ran into this problem with Minelab as well when I tried them to update the Excal 1 which is pretty long in the tooth. Their response was that they viewed underwater detecting as too small a market and they would continue to focus on the X-Terra series as they felt mid priced land detectors was the way to go.(I think I still have their e-mail somewhere) In their defence they did come out with the Excal 2 recently but by all accounts it's the same detector with an upgrade to the battery, pinpoint and a fancy paint job. You would think that in 13 years they might have been able to upgrade the circuitry a little, at least a tweaking, plus a straight shaft is the most common modification to this unit as the ergonomics on the stock shaft is terrible.
Waterproofing the unit would be a big help to dirtfishers too as you wouldn't have to worry about your expensive, new PI unit going poof :surprised::surrender: if you were caught in a sudden downpour or if it rolled over into a mud puddle while you were digging a target.

JMHO,

BDA:cool:
 
Hi,

I agree that developing a new water unit is low on most manufacturers lists of things to do. But in this case a ton of time and money have gone into developing a unit anyway. It really just boils down to whether or not the circuit board can be crammed into either a Surf Pi housing or a Beachhunter housing. If White's can use an existing case then the cost to produce a waterproof version would be negligible. I doubt the Surf PI case would work, but the unit just might fit in the Beachhunter ID box. If so White's would be able to leverage more profit out of all the costs they have already expended to bring this unit to market.

If a new housing had to be fabricated, that is another matter entirely.

Steve Herschbach
 
BHIDs are good to 30 feet now which is as much as I need. Where do I sign to get in line for the first unit?

BDA:cool:
 
Steve,

How well does the iron discrimination work?

Thanks,

Landman
 
Hi,

To my knowledge nobody has yet developed a PI unit with true ferrous discrimination. Dave Emery claims to have developed such a thing with the Pulse Devil/Nemisis unit, but it has yet to be demonstrated to anybody. The Minelab unit do have a ferrous discrimination system but it only works on shallow targets and cannot be trusted. The day a PI comes out that can accurately discriminate all iron and steel targets I might just quit my day job as I could probably make a living detecting at that point. Right now Dave is the only person claiming it can be done.

Steve Herschbach
 
Then Steve what does the new Whites PI bring to the table that is better or new?
 
Hi landman,

Nothing earth-shattering per se. It is the overall package that appeals to me, and it does have some unique features. Lots of little things that add up to a unit that I've wanted for years but could not get. It addresses lots of the gripes people have about other ground balancing PI units currently on the market. Unfortunately, I can't be specific as I am under a confidentiality agreement. And I'm not out to hype the unit. I'm excited about it but that does not mean anyone else should be. I'm kind of excitable anyway!

We won't have to wait too much longer, I hope.
 
Its funny that Whites with all its money and resources have in the last 15 years always managed to take one step forward and one back when it comes to P.I.'s.
The first Whites Surfmaster change didn't improve the performance but just stopped the use of rechargeables when the internal change to the control box stopped the use of the larger rechargeable battery pack.
They then let things slide for years allowing mods such as by Mr.Bill to become very popular. Eventually they decided to follow suit but if it wasn't for Mr.Bill would they have bothered with their "upgrade" ?
And what do we end up with in the latest "Pro" version...a gain control instead of a pulse delay.
Come to think of it the same sort of thing was mirrored in the popular Classic series and its still a better option to have a older Classic upgraded than go for one of the Prizm's.
 
Hi Brian,

Yeah, it does get pretty frustrating at times. We as detector users see manufacturers doing dumb things all the time. The fact is most of the people in the industry either are not detectorists or only do it but rarely.

That would be fine if they listened closely to their users, but it seems only a few people ever get input into the designing process.

Some companies are better and some are worse, to be sure. Fisher really went off track and so nearly went bankrupt. I think White's does a fair job, but as you note they also do things that puzzle at times. I guess in the end all we can do is vote with our wallets as that is what in the end it is all about for those that make detectors and hope to sell them to us.

Steve Herschbach
 
do you think this new Whites PI will be any better than the Infinium, not including all the Minelab, coiltek coils at prospecting? Stock coils to stock coils.
 
Hi,

Frankly, I was using a prototype in November, and the unit has undergone changes since then. So I do not know exactly where the final performance will be at. But in my opinion it will smoke the Infinium. I sold all my Infiniums at Moore Creek in hopes of replacing them with the White's unit.

The difference when it comes to electrical interference is amazing. I ran the prototype under a powerline transformer and it was quieter than some VLF units. Compared to the Infinium the White's is a superb urban area unit

I got the feeling it will give my Minelab SD2200v2 a run for the money but I was unable to make a direct comparison. Minelab may still have the edge for large nuggets at depth but for smaller gold it may be the other way around. In my direct area around Anchorage we have pretty small gold and not much mineralization and so not many people want to spend the big bucks for a high priced Minelab when a 1/4 oz nugget is a huge find. Bread and butter is 1/4 dwt stuff. The White's may very well have an edge over the Minelabs in my local area that would not exist in other locations. I'm anxious to do some nugget detecting here with it.

Steve Herschbach
 
This is getting more interesting - been biting down to the knuckles.
Been awhile since I been nugget shooting. Was using 3 GoldMasters back then, and I found them to be sensitive. My favorite was the GoldMaster-3 hip mounted. The 4B was okay but preferred the knobs of the GM-3. Really liked the multi-turn ground balance control.
Hunted by audio with quality headphones. Didn't get the hang of using a screen much.
Still biting to see what Whites will whip out.
 
This question really seems like comparing apples to oranges. :poke: My Infinium runs fine and it's so quiet in my area even with very bad black sand (talking beach hunting only)! Everything I've read so far about the White's makes it really sound alot like the Infinium! For one, the disc function sounds very familiar to the design of the Garrett. No manufacturer as of yet, has produced a "real" PI discriminating detector that works like a VLF. The multi-tone function also sounds very similar to the design of the Infinium. As of now, White's only has this as a land based prospecting detector and it's a huge thing to re-design something as a waterproof machine (could take years if ever). I know plenty of hunters now using the Infinium with deadly results and no real issues to speak of. I've also been informed that the newer coils for the Infinium seem to run a whole lot smoother than the older coils too. Since Hawaii seems to be a very tough environment for metal detectors in general, I can't say what works the best there. Again, many hunters are using the Infinium all over the world with nice results. I know that the ML gold machines are hard to beat, however the Infinium is no slouch doing land hunting and a new larger coil just might be available soon too. I'm sure the White's will be one hell of a machine as they don't release junk and make quality goods! I also have the White's BHID now with the Super 12" coil and it's punching as deep as my CZ20. The pinpointing is spot on and the coil is fast like an 8" or 10" coil!!! Anyway, I want to wish everyone much success and happiness in their hunting for treasure and gold!!!!!!!!


Thanks and HH!!!:thumbup:
 
Also wondering because some of the discrimination talk, beside nugget shooting, maybe double duty for relic hunting?
 
Hi Diggindirt,

Well, copy the line below, paste it into Google, and check it out:

"steve herschbach" infinium

I have used the Infinium since the prototype stage. Actually been a big fan of the unit and up until a couple months ago owned four of them. So I'm quite familiar with the unit. If you are happy with your Infinium, by all means just keep using it. As you note there may never ever be a White's underwater version anyway so for water hunting it is a moot point. But after I used the White's prototype I sold my Infiniums as quickly as possible. Having used both there is no question in my mind as to which I'd rather use.

Steve Herschbach
 
Hi,

This unit is likely to see lots of use relic hunting and beach hunting. I plan on using it for far more than nugget hunting myself. In low mineral areas it will not be of any great advantage except maybe in running very large coils. But the worse the ground gets, the better it will do compared to a VLF unit. Seems like relic hunting in Georgia would be right up its alley.

Steve Herschbach
 
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