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Just read Andy's book and I gotta question...

Frase44NY

New member
:nerd: Great book and fun reading while I wait for warmer ground. Heres my Quest..I have The EXP 2, and was wondering if its better to HEAR an unwanted target, or REJECT (null) said target. In other words, if the undesireable target is co-located with a keeper. Is recovery faster with a null, or with an audible response to that unwanted target?? Im an AM kind of guy. My take on the book was 'dont be afraid to discriminate',and yes, operating in AM all the time can be tough,especially in the city parks I hunt at.. But I have hunted along side of others who discriminate and usually end up with a heavier pouch of keepers. One of them being an xs user. Id love to discriminate more..but at what expense..just wondering if ayone had any thoughts on the subject..PS..almost always with deep on if it helps..Thanks and HH to those with thawed ground .Maybe I should have posted in classroom too..:usaflag:
 
I use ferrous tones with an open screen because I'm afraid of missing a good coin when my Explorer nulls on a rejected target close to the coin. I hunt many sites where even iron mask -15 nulls constantly on iron. I tend to use no discrimination on any of my detectors except my Tesoro Compadre.
 
It really depends on the type of site your are hunting. I use the open settings when im in really old spots that have all kinds of junk but good relics and mabey a great coin or two. here I dont want to miss any good targets. But while on some beachs I am specifically looking for rings and cant take all the signals so I discriminate more. If in an old park I start with some discrimination if I find a good spot or target then I will open the machine wide open and carefully tighten my swing pattern. Sometimes I will hunt the same spot both ways once with discrimination one without. I tend to be a die hard and in good areas I will go over and over again with different settings. Its esay enough to change once you do it a few times.
If you can handle the sounds in the AM mode than in general the machine will pick up on iffyer targets that trun out to be good more often. So if your getting great finds than less Discrim.
thats my 2 cents. good luck.
 
thanks Utah..but Im still curious about the recovery speed on co-located targets and which method is quicker. nulling,or hearing..Not sure if Im explaining it correctly. Thank you for your input and good luck to you my friend..:thumbup:
 
and the more open a screen the better in iron... once you get used to ignoring the sounds of trash and knowing what to listen for in a good target even if it reads trash then your better off.. most I will do is notch out crown caps if I get in an area with loads of them.. one notch of iron mask to get rid of nail signals and that is it.. Sure the explorer will still get the good stuff using disc, but it wont get what good targets read in the same place as trash you have notched out, and you might miss the tell tale sounds you get when a good target is mixed in with that notched out stuff.. if you can stand listening to all the junk then do it... the more you hunt this way the easier it is to just go on by that junk and get your ear tuned to the good ones mixed in
 
after reading Andys book, made me think maybe I didnt neeed to listen to all the trash..but your right, in time it has become easier and my finds have improved tremendously over the years. But some spots do try my patience and thats where a little disc is the difference between stayin..or leaving. HH
 
someone said:
thanks Utah..but Im still curious about the recovery speed on co-located targets and which method is quicker. nulling,or hearing..Not sure if Im explaining it correctly. Thank you for your input and good luck to you my friend..


Hearing is better than nulling. Take a quarter and a nail out in your garage and put the quarter on the ground and the nail on top of an overturned cup (simulating a shallower nail). Put the cup with the nail at different distances from the quarter. Now reverse the quarter/nail role. Try disc and no disc and it will help you see the limitations. I've found that even my uber slow Explorer isn't a whole lot worse than my f75. The f75 will catch the quarter at shorter distances but the TID will be quite a ways off.
 
I agree. that coin next to the iron trash is going to give you just enough of a signal to make you go back again and perhaps swing from a different direction or approach it from another direction and hopefully dig. If you are using heavy discrimination you might loose that co located target while the machine is recovering from a null. This is just my guess,, also I know alot of gold jewelery will hit in the pull tab region so if you have those discriminated against you might wind up walking over a really good target.. just think for every 300 or so pull tabs you might find a ring. I remember someone saying let the shovel be the discrimination. Dig everything that sounds reasonable! I hunt in AM with ferrous tones and let my brain do the discrimination (usually)
 
Dont disregard pattern hunting. Ive hunted behind some good hunters using a pattern and still pickup as much stuff as they do in those trashy spots. Thou its true it takes more time for the coil to recover from a nulled target there are advantages to disc. I have noticed when hunting really trashy areas there can be was too much going on even when in ferr if i have almost no disc. I also say pattern because if you have to much disc and there is mineral or EMI you may not notice it. I can get a better threshold with a pattern just because it only nulls on targets with out all the falsing of EMI ect. As you can see everyone hunts differently, thats what andy was trying to say. There is a place and time for patterns, disc, and AM let the area dictate your settings especially if you have hunted it previously.

Dew
 
F-75 for all it's advertised speed didn't do appreciably better with targets in trash. And like you say the TID was way off, meaning you would have to dig much more than with the explorer. Again the 2 axis screen of the explorer makes all the difference in successfully deciphering what is in the ground. Still wondering what the heck they were thinking with the ETrac. Everytime I ask I get no answers, just told it's "NOT AN EXPLORER".

Chris
 
gold is rare for me, unless I accidently dig it looking for a nickle.Love the old coins man..thanks for the reply..HH
 
I am not sure i am understanding..............but i have never heard a unwanted target,,,,,,,,,,,,i want to hear it all .....and null only on iron,,,,,,,but i dig everthing....
 
I built a big test bed and HALF of my good targets are 'co-located' with nails or tabs, next to or over good targets. Readings seem to change a bit from day to day, whether disc'ed or AM. I guess it has to do with ground moisture changes....or weather...whatever. It sure gives me an idea of what is happening on any given day with my machine.
 
I am curious why in Andy's new book on the Explorer, he doesn't dive into what so ever hunting in all metal, other than to say some how it's less superior to pattern hunting and that mantras such as "all metal, all the time" are ignorant (did you read that one Bob??), raised my eyebrow, for sure. It takes a great deal of patience and skill to hunt in all metal. Just because Andy doesn't seem to be able to do it effectively or can't deal with all the noise, does not make pattern hunting better. Obviously, nobody hunts in all metal with an Explorer, because Andy didn't list anyone who hunted that way with their settings and experiences in his book. It's like a big sales pitch for pattern hunting. I would think one would train themselves to do both as there are clear advantages to hunting behind some one who can't. It is my absolute experience that all metal as much as possible, with as little discrimination as possible, is the only way in most sites because the slow recovery rate on the Explorer's and the ETrac absolutely, most definitely, causes missed targets, and an absolute loss in average depth of targets found. The depth issue I am referring to does not mean that I am saying while using discrimination, the machine doesn't achieve the same depth, It does get the same depth. However, the nulling interferes with you hearing the weaker responding deep targets and thereby makes the louder shallow responding targets stand out more, which is why many find nothing but shallow clad when hunting with heavy discrimination. There are instances where you may find additional targets with patterns that you otherwise wouldn't in all metal, specifically with the ETrac, but not enough that you would preclude missing so many more with discrimination nulling away. My beef with my ETrac is that I was not given the choice.
 
If the E trac nulls are you still... in the midst of the null getting a signal on a good target, either in a test bed or in the feild. Just curious. I love my Ex II.
 
Well I just read part of AndyS book .......and he is definitely calling me ignorant............Im not saying i hunt in all metal mode but I am damn close.....So ill find me a better book that tells me why i dont want to hunt in all metal.......seems to me i would want to know the target is there ...its up to me whether i decide to dig it or not ...as long as hear the sound or tone thats all i want.....Can anyone tell me why not ?
 
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