Manticore presale going for 2k online

[Mark kus]

I understand where your coming from I’m in eastern Ct I see the signs of things to come lateness of the hour in a biblical way.
These are all signs as our weather they blame on climate change which it’s not it’s judgment on the US…
Mark

 

[MackDog]

The economy is tuff and the president is powerful. But he's not powerful enough to cause global inflation. This is a world wide problem, let's all hope for the best and help and support each other.

 

[sprchng]

The economy is tuff and the president is powerful. But he's not powerful enough to cause global inflation. This is a world wide problem, let's all hope for the best and help and support each other.

Au contraire , the crippling of our oil and gas industry and restrictions on LNG production and exporting has put Europe on the chopping block for unfriendly energy. Everything resident Biden has done has played directly into the hands of Putin and given China greater leverage which has filtered down to global inflation in the name of a ridiculous climate control policy based on the total arrogance that , somehow , mankind can control the climate. If you believe otherwise you should remove your aqua colored lenses.

 

[DigDog]

I don’t want to turn this thread into a political thread but Sprchg has a point.
As a world leading nation everything we do will have a ripple effect throughout the whole world. Same goes with China.
I don’t care how you slice all the issues everything always comes down to one basic principle, supply and demand.

If ML suddenly decided to stop making metal detectors watch the prices of detectors go up around the world. Just as if they flooded the market watch the prices drop

 

[JAN1]

Does nobody think the same as me. The price of detectors is getting totally stupid. I only bought an 800 because I found enough Gold to pay for it. I still use my Detector Pro Wader which I have been using for the past 10 years which I paid £175 for and the first time out I was very lucky and found £176 in Gold. I have the 800 fixed to my harness As I am to old if anyone decided to run off with it

 

[DigDog]

Does nobody think the same as me. The price of detectors is getting totally stupid. I only bought an 800 because I found enough Gold to pay for it. I still use my Detector Pro Wader which I have been using for the past 10 years which I paid £175 for and the first time out I was very lucky and found £176 in Gold. I have the 800 fixed to my harness As I am to old if anyone decided to run off with it

Yes I’ve been saying that for a while.
You have to ask yourself do these new detectors actually find MORE than the old ones where the DIFFERENCE in finds actually pays for them?
New detectors help the manufacturers and dealers more than the end user with higher profit margins.
The industry is not about volume as it is not overly popular per capita.
Curious as to actually how much of the population is into metal detecting. 1 out of ? People? Vs other hobbies.
Sales in industry/security only go so far rest is to continually generate added revenue.
I don’t seem to recall past detectors dropping couple hundred dollars in price after a short period of sales

 

[sprchng]

Considering the cost of a M-core to the cost of a new etrac when they came out nearly a couple of decades ago , the price is actually pretty reasonable when you consider the advanced tech in it.. As far as what additional it will find goes , I think that is like real estate , all location. In my neck of the woods detecting is a dying activity with what I suspect is few new people doing it. The fraud that the Duck people are laying on the public may stimulate some interest but here , anyone trying it will quickly know they are being conned.

Relic hunters , prospectors and beach hunting will stay popular but those of us relegated to public parks and the occasional demo house know there is no way a $1600 purchase is going to pay for itself when a good day is 4 or 5 bucks in clad and maybe a thin silver ring , if lucky. People don't wear jewelry any more , they get tattoos and coinage is dead. There is little if any recharge in the public areas with the exception of trash and bottle caps. Out here you are looking at a tank of gas to explore new sites and that has to be factored in on the reasoning for buying an expensive machine. The local club here has dropped from 50 or 60 members to less than ten and one would think the lack of detecting would make more finds available but about 1 out of 15 coins is a new drop and most everything is 4 or 5" deep. Consider yourself lucky if your area provides better "fishing" but if Minelab's bean counters projected lots of sales to folks in this type of area , they are in for a rude awakening!!

 

[DigDog]

As i have stated where i am is not a target rich area and the soil is loose and sandy with a very high sink rate
Most fruitful hunting is done on the beaches and not alot of old coins, pre 1900’s to be found on the beaches.
Used to be good for finding gold jewelry but that was decades ago when gold was inexpensive and most people wore it. What few people still wear gold jewelry not many of those wear it to the beach anymore.
Those that claim there $1600 detectors pay for themselves either never hunted here, got extremely lucky, or took years of alot of detecting.
Thats why its more of a pass time to break up the monotony rather than expecting great results.
Will getting frustrated with tweaking many settings find alot more? Not if the targets are not there. Or enough of them
Just my 2cents which is even hard to find.

 

[DigDog]

Considering the cost of a M-core to the cost of a new etrac when they came out nearly a couple of decades ago , the price is actually pretty reasonable when you consider the advanced tech in it.

Without starting a big debate on NM vs ML who is better this has nothing to do with that at all. Talking strictly about prices.
For example the Legend has similar new advanced technology comparable to say what the Nox is capable of but half the price.
So does ML technology cost twice as much to manufacture?
Maybe little more invested in R&D they have to recover but i would think the actual cost of manufacturing(parts) is pretty close.
Wouldn’t think the circuit boards, plastic, wires, etc cost double.
Weather you want to contribute more money because it was manufactured in a more state of the art building and added advertising is up to you.
Does that extra cost in R&D equate to double the price for years ahead or is there added profit margin.

 

[sprchng]

The Legend has served me much better than the NOX but whether it will match up to the M-core is difficult to say when the former is not yet on the market. I miss the screen from both the etrac and CTX(when you could see it ) I also miss the ferrous number but can live without it since the screen gives you that info anyway. Price wise I think ML products have always been the poorer value if net finds are the only contributing factor, at least in the hobby area. Most finds with the ML machines would also be found by other machines providing the detectorists involved are equally proficient with their respective machines..

In terms of pure value , I think the CTX in the classifieds for $1500 is abetter value than the M-core at $1600.

 

[DigDog]

The Legend has served me much better than the NOX but whether it will match up to the M-core is difficult to say when the former is not yet on the market. I miss the screen from both the etrac and CTX(when you could see it ) I also miss the ferrous number but can live without it since the screen gives you that info anyway. Price wise I think ML products have always been the poorer value if net finds are the only contributing factor, at least in the hobby area. Most finds with the ML machines would also be found by other machines providing the detectorists involved are equally proficient with their respective machines..

In terms of pure value , I think the CTX in the classifieds for $1500 is abetter value than the M-core at $1600.

I never really considered the CTX one due to the weight but also because of the price $2500 I believe
Is the CTX really that much better than the Nox to be double that price or are we just talking about bragging rights at that point

 

[sprchng]

A $1500 CTX with a couple of years warranty would be like a $400 NOX 800 with full warranty. The CTX also incorporates a full GPS that has to contribute mightily to the cost and can be invaluable to the correct type of user. I only used it a couple of times but bought my CTX used for $1400 a year or two after they were introduced. When the ground was frozen i did use the GPS to mark good signals and could come back and dig after it warmed up..The weight was never an issue for me and I'm a stocky little 72 year old Irishman. The lighter machines are nice but if you're digging targets you're not swinging. As I said earlier , the NOX and many other detectors would find most of what the CTX would find but it is still the superior machine for discrimination , EMI mitigation , ease of use and bragging rights.

If the M-core approaches the capabilities of the CTX without the GPS and in a durable lightweight package it will be a decent value to the right person in the right areas.

 

[DigDog]

A $1500 CTX with a couple of years warranty would be like a $400 NOX 800 with full warranty. The CTX also incorporates a full GPS that has to contribute mightily to the cost and can be invaluable to the correct type of user. I only used it a couple of times but bought my CTX used for $1400 a year or two after they were introduced. When the ground was frozen i did use the GPS to mark good signals and could come back and dig after it warmed up..The weight was never an issue for me and I'm a stocky little 72 year old Irishman. The lighter machines are nice but if you're digging targets you're not swinging. As I said earlier , the NOX and many other detectors would find most of what the CTX would find but it is still the superior machine for discrimination , EMI mitigation , ease of use and bragging rights.

If the M-core approaches the capabilities of the CTX without the GPS and in a durable lightweight package it will be a decent value to the right person in the right areas.

Yeah i could do without the gps, not really something great for the beach i would think and if im going out hunting im digging right then not marking and going back. Its either the park or small beach so there is enough around to get an idea of location without a gps, unless it gives you a mark down to a foot or two but im sure a cool feature for some applications. Not sure if its available without a gps?
I do like that theory “ if your digging your not swinging “ lol
But on the flip side you have to swing to dig.
I guess what came first the chicken or the egg. Lol

.

 

[CoinRobber]

The Legend has served me much better than the NOX but whether it will match up to the M-core is difficult to say when the former is not yet on the market. I miss the screen from both the etrac and CTX(when you could see it ) I also miss the ferrous number but can live without it since the screen gives you that info anyway. Price wise I think ML products have always been the poorer value if net finds are the only contributing factor, at least in the hobby area. Most finds with the ML machines would also be found by other machines providing the detectorists involved are equally proficient with their respective machines..

In terms of pure value , I think the CTX in the classifieds for $1500 is abetter value than the M-core at $1600.

Forget CTX it's OLD tech. Heavy and expensive , explorer find just as much

 

[CoinRobber]

I never really considered the CTX one due to the weight but also because of the price $2500 I believe
Is the CTX really that much better than the Nox to be double that price or are we just talking about bragging rights at that point

I have a CTX and have owned a Nox 800 for 8 months before selling it. My honest opinion is the NOX was better all round.
The CTX is way too heavy. Nox has slightly better depth than ctx on many targets. done the tests and proved it.

 

[SeaScene]

Enough is a reasonable place to be in the spectrum. Good enough is an affordable add on. Marlborough cigs ... can't be a man if you don't smoke 'em still playing.

 

[DigDog]

I have a CTX and have owned a Nox 800 for 8 months before selling it. My honest opinion is the NOX was better all round.
The CTX is way too heavy. Nox has slightly better depth than ctx on many targets. done the tests and proved it.

Do you think the 600 preforms equally as good as the 800 when using using the same frequencies. I know the 800 has two more frequencies available but for example you set both to operate in 15 khz will they operate identical for the most part? I know two of the exact same models can possibly give slightly different results due to possible tolerances in manufacturing etc.

 

[jim tn]

For example the Legend has similar new advanced technology comparable to say what the Nox is capable of but half the price.
So does ML technology cost twice as much to manufacture?

Since it is so much the same, suppose there is any chance that the Legend technology was mostly copied from the Nox? If so, the Legend should be less money as ML had all the costs involved in making the technology. Just wondering, that's all. HH jim tn

 

[Pyledriver]

The market determines whether the price is fair, and performance will dictate how long the price stays the same, or how much the next machine will sell for. Witness the GPZ 7000- it hit the market at $10,000 per copy! Even so sales were brisk for the number one most powerful gold detecting machine in the world. in the US market machine sales were fairly slow until they lowered the price to around $7000, which is still absolutely incredible until you consider what you were getting. The reason I mention gold machines is because that’s actually how minelab makes their real money. But the technology that they hold patents on, and the R&D that goes into developing any machine, let alone logistics, marketing, and all the other costs that go in to producing and selling anything make it reasonable for the seller to set whatever price they feel their goods are worth. The market will tell them whether it’s too high or not. And greed has nothing to do with it because they’re producing something that you can either take or leave and they don’t care either way for the most part because price adjustments will come as the market indicators start to develop. Are they making a huge profit? Probably yes, but who are we to tell them how much money they can make for their product?

Here’s a case in point, but not 100% applicable to the manticore..fitting nonetheles—- I have an SDC 2300 that I only use 2 to 4 times per year. That machine new at the moment is right around $3800! why would I be so crazy as to buy a machine like that to only use a few times a year? Well that’s because I got tired of flying out to Arizona going through all of the work and the high hopes of finding gold only to get skunked repeatedly with an older, lower technology machine. I have had the 2300 since it was basically considered the number two machine in the world for the goldfields, but now they have come out with the 6000. Guess what? I’m back to getting my tail kicked on most of our adventures because my buddies are swinging 6000 and 7000’s and some of the ground that we prospect has been hit by us enough times that I need more power to find what might still be left. I call it the arms race! Do we gripe about a machine that probably cost the company $800 to produce and yet they sell for thousands? Yes sometimes we do, but then we realize that it’s not about what it cost any company to make any certain thing, but what that thing is and what it can do for us that allows the price to be whatever it is. So I’m contemplating stepping up my game and buying a $6000 machine just to keep up to find gold that probably won’t pay for that machine for a long time, IF EVER, lol!

So is the price the main factor of buying any machine? To me it’s not worth entering the arms race for coins and relics because I already have an equinox 800 with collapsible control, telescoping shaft, every single widget you can imagine, that takes care of the majority of anything I need a VLF for, short of going past 10 feet deep (or in the case of the equinox, possibly just a light dunking). The deus 2 has my eye at the moment as probably the best upgrade for the type of hunting that I do, which even around home probably involves a hike or a kayak ride, and a bit of swimming, but I realize that I am not the majority of detectorists!

Sorry for the rant, somebody threw out the ‘greedy manufacturer ‘catchphrase and it just hits me the wrong way!

 

[DigDog]

The market determines whether the price is fair, and performance will dictate how long the price stays the same, or how much the next machine will sell for. Witness the GPZ 7000- it hit the market at $10,000 per copy! Even so sales were brisk for the number one most powerful gold detecting machine in the world. in the US market machine sales were fairly slow until they lowered the price to around $7000, which is still absolutely incredible until you consider what you were getting. The reason I mention gold machines is because that’s actually how minelab makes their real money. But the technology that they hold patents on, and the R&D that goes into developing any machine, let alone logistics, marketing, and all the other costs that go in to producing and selling anything make it reasonable for the seller to set whatever price they feel their goods are worth. The market will tell them whether it’s too high or not. And greed has nothing to do with it because they’re producing something that you can either take or leave and they don’t care either way for the most part because price adjustments will come as the market indicators start to develop. Are they making a huge profit? Probably yes, but who are we to tell them how much money they can make for their product?

Here’s a case in point, but not 100% applicable to the manticore..fitting nonetheles—- I have an SDC 2300 that I only use 2 to 4 times per year. That machine new at the moment is right around $3800! why would I be so crazy as to buy a machine like that to only use a few times a year? Well that’s because I got tired of flying out to Arizona going through all of the work and the high hopes of finding gold only to get skunked repeatedly with an older, lower technology machine. I have had the 2300 since it was basically considered the number two machine in the world for the goldfields, but now they have come out with the 6000. Guess what? I’m back to getting my tail kicked on most of our adventures because my buddies are swinging 6000 and 7000’s and some of the ground that we prospect has been hit by us enough times that I need more power to find what might still be left. I call it the arms race! Do we gripe about a machine that probably cost the company $800 to produce and yet they sell for thousands? Yes sometimes we do, but then we realize that it’s not about what it cost any company to make any certain thing, but what that thing is and what it can do for us that allows the price to be whatever it is. So I’m contemplating stepping up my game and buying a $6000 machine just to keep up to find gold that probably won’t pay for that machine for a long time, IF EVER, lol!

So is the price the main factor of buying any machine? To me it’s not worth entering the arms race for coins and relics because I already have an equinox 800 with collapsible control, telescoping shaft, every single widget you can imagine, that takes care of the majority of anything I need a VLF for, short of going past 10 feet deep (or in the case of the equinox, possibly just a light dunking). The deus 2 has my eye at the moment as probably the best upgrade for the type of hunting that I do, which even around home probably involves a hike or a kayak ride, and a bit of swimming, but I realize that I am not the majority of detectorists!

Sorry for the rant, somebody threw out the ‘greedy manufacturer ‘catchphrase and it just hits me the wrong way!

Well i think the point more specifically as you point out they are already manufacturing devices, have the technology and parts for high end products for gold prospecting which finds bring in alot more than what the detector costs as well as military use which is invaluable. Commercial or
business use is one thing.But to ask thousands of dollars for basic coin, jewelry and relic hobbyist machines is basically taking a page out of the government playbook and making a bulk of revenue from the little guy.
And yes throw in the that the younger generation who doesn’t have as much of a sense for the value of money and throws money to the wind we suddenly have high prices. Nobody can answer the question did the actual parts double in price and how is it another manufacturer can sell something very similar physically speaking for about half the price. Im sure very similar costs are involved.