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Technical advantages of X-terras

C

Cody

New member
While we are chunking rocks at the moon I thought I would toss a few more. Each year we see the new crop of detectors and if you are like I have been for the last 46 years it is like the new Sears catalog of years ago. I go to each new offering and look to see if the newest and greatest has something really new and better or just a new paint job. Most of the time it is a repackaged detector and I don
 
We need to chunk bigger rocks ???? :lol:

Great post. Minelab seems to have taken the high road, cleaning up the signal before the fact instead of after the fact. Better to keep the truck out of the mud than having to wash it later. ;)

Ralph
 
I bought a T-50 for several reasons and the different approach to offering two separate single freq operations based on the coil was certainly one of them. One of my assumptions was that this detector would be more sensitive to higher conductivity targets while running the lower frequency/coil and of course the opposite when running the higher freq coil. I'm clearly seeing the original configuration (stock coil supposedly running on the lower of the two operating freq's) be more sensitive to nickels than silver. What's up with that? This is another thing that's definitely different about this detector and I don't understand the reasoning behind it. Explanations?
 
It may have something to do with the high gain design, but I think others are stumped too with these units being more sensitive to nickels than silver at 7.5 kHz. I'm sitting here wondering if the same thing carries over into the 30 model, or if there is something else in the 50 that allows for this effect since it can operate at both the higher and lower frequency using different coils......perhaps a sort of carry-over effect ?

HELP, Cody ! ;)

Ralph
 
Kind of reminds me of my neighbor's new pickup. He is so preoccupied with the fact that the glove box don't have a lock on it that he forgets what makes it so nice: Electronic transfer case, fuel injection V8, leather heated seats, 6 disc changer, electric everything, etc..... At the end of the day, it still hauls a load. And, in style! HH Randy
 
Silver and copper are best at the lower frequency of 6.5khz while gold and nickle will be best at the higher frequency. We can think of this based on their conductivity. Copper and silver are better than gold and nickels. However, we are talking about great conductors even when we throw in iron. Higher frequency for lower conductive and lower frequency for higher conductive.

Iron has permeability, retention, and is magnetic, which causing it to look a lot like silver. So, we end up with iron responding great to a low frequency and out of step with nonmagnetic materials.

Higher Frequency - Gold and Nickle
Lower Frequency - Silver and Copper (Iron)

When we read about the signature of a metal this is what is being said. As examples, take a pieces of metal about the size of a flashlight, that are silver, iron, copper, and nickle and hit it with the same force like a tuning fork and it will have a specific ring. The general idea in we hit the target with a electromagnetic field. The different metals are in a sense going to ring depending on their signature frequency. The next step is to alloy the metals and see where they ring.

I would add to the coils for the X-terra 50 one at 3khz and then smaller coils for 6.5khz and the higher frequency. A nice small coil for the higher frequency should be a killer on small gold jewelry and really work through the trash. I have seen some very valuable small jewelry with nice diamonds that would make a great find.
 
I've had dozens, dozens, and more dozens of different detectors in spite of only being into detecting for a relatively short period of time compared to many out there. I understand a lot about the operating principles of current detectors. I've never owned or tested a detector operating on a frequency of less than 10 khz respond to a nickel deeper than a silver or clad quarter. The XT-50 I have does just that. Here are my specific questions.

1. Is what I'm seeing happening with all 50's or does mine have some sort of problem?

2. If this IS normal for the XT-50 when it's operating in the lower frequency, why and then how (in simple terms) is this happening? Doesn't this sort of defeat some of the commonly perceived advantages of the ability to run in two different separate frequencies one at a time?
 
you are asking some very good questions that need to be answered. My problem is ask a retired professor the time of day and he tells you how to build a grandfather clock.

A single frequency detector cannot be ground balanced to wet salt and iron ferrite at the same time. A multiple frequency detector can so this is a very nice feature of multiple frequencies. It would take 28 coils on the X-terra 50 to transmit the same number of frequencies as the Explorer. This is an exaggerated as I am sure some coils would work for more than one frequency. The Explore is pulse induction time domain and the X-terra is single frequency sine wave driven frequency domain. The multiple frequency of the Explorer provides the needed data for both ferrous and conductive data display.

I guess I could go on for a couple pages and have here and there about SF compared to MF. The X-terra does not defeat the purpose of multiple frequencies in at all that I can see. One of my primary points that interest me about the X-terra 50 is a very light weight easy to use machine and if I have no interest in the ultra high frequencies and the design that goes with that I don
 
Thanks for the second shot and that'll do for now. Or as the old saying goes..... "close enough for the girls I go out with!" ;)
 
Hi Cody...I don't think you understood what he said...must be his Ohio accent. :rofl:

I'm from Ohio...so let me translate. :laugh:

If I understand him correctly...his Xterra is hitting nickles much better than silver or clad quarters....

Does this seem right to you, considering the 6.5 freq? Have you, or anyone else noticed this anomoly w/your Xterra?

Hope I got that right....I don't have an Xterra, but am curious about it. Garry/Ohio
 
it still comes back muddy!

Think about it!

Tom
 
I expect the 6.5khz to do about the same on all US coins which is why they have that for the stock coil. If we were taking about 3khz at one end and 18khz or so at the other end then I would expect to see it shift a little. We are not talking about a lot of difference no matter if we are at the high or low end of the frequency of operation. The selection of 6.5khz has been a dominant operating frequency for detectors due to response to all US coins.

My guess is a little positive offset to the ground balance will move the response depending on the soil in the different parts of the US. I would give that a try and see what happens. Just a very slight offset positive. I would use a target in the soil to make the positive offset to get an idea what is best. I know it is going to be just a slight amount. I also run a manual ground balance detector with a slight positive offset for that reason. As you know manufactures beat the 3khz to 20khz frequency to death. Something in this range should give a good snappy response to all US coins.

Sorry, I guess I would still be beating the wrong bush had you not explained.
 
all them arrows. Hoo Boy! :lol:

Don't ya wish the Manufacturers would publish data like losses and signal to noise ratios instead of some creative grpahs showing "their" clean sine wave vs the "competitions" jaggety one?

Tom
 
I thought the Xterras were operating at 7.5 kHz on the low end (??) At least I thought those were the specs I had been reading. From what I understood also, 18.75 kHz would be the only alternative coil frequency offered on the XT-50. Or is the design going to be capable of more than just those two frequencies ?

Ralph
 
Interesting concept, but I have to wonder if comes from engineering or the marketing department.

Getting a little cynical in my old age I guess.

Tom, not in Missouri
 
Kinda my line of thinking too. Maybe Cody can put one on the scope when he gets his and advise if there is a noticeable difference. Would be interesting to know if it really makes any difference in actual performance too.

Ralph
 
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