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Yet another ring from the park today

dbsmokey

New member
Thanks to Critterhunter, synthnut, Deanasaur, and crazyman who helped me get the correct setup for my GT in the horrible soil at the park, I found another ring today: this one 14k gold! It seems as if this park, which is HEAVILY hunted, is yet full of nice finds. I found four quarters 3-4" deep, which have undoubtedly been missed by lesser machines. I found three dimes where I personally witnessed a man hunting with another brand of MD three weeks ago. What an outstanding machine the Sovereign is! I can't wait to hunt the ACRES to see what lies beneath. Thanks you guys for helping me out!

My settings:
Discr: 0
Volume: max
Threshold: barely audible
Iron mask: off
Sensitivity: 1 PM
[attachment 176000 IMG00128-20101011-1609.jpg][attachment 176001 IMG00127-20101011-1608.jpg]
 
Nice job on the gold! :super: Were you running a meter, or just digging by sound? If by chance you were running a meter what numbers did that chunk of gold register? I cherry pick a trashy local park for silver and normally skip over most low tones. I keep thinking of spending an afternoon digging and searching for some gold... At $1350 a ounce for 24k that stuff will pay a Sovereign off in a no time!
 
I was using a meter, but the meter jumped around alot (I think because of the horribly mineralized ground??!). I think it read 165. I am still learning the meter (have used it only 2 times), so I hunt mostly with sound. The sound of this ring is distinct compared to that low aluminum foil sound, or any other (besides maybe pulltabs). I will test it again and get back to you.
 
Gold is always good. There is some great people here that are always willing to help. The more you use the GT and learn it the more you will love it.
 
Ive found gold rings with and without the meter and Ive found that they all get picked up when discriminating ring pulls. I dont get the same depth though I dont think bit this was air test.. I dont know about your ring pulls in the USA either (im in the UK), or if its the same with higher karat gold as these were 9ct wedding bands.. Tested on the meter though they are roughly the same as cupro nickel coins.. I run a 580 meter and I find it more accurate as you have a wider range of numbers..

My rings have all been off beaches and I dont discriminate on the machine, I do it by ear.. You could run it fully open, ignore low tones (not the iron buzz) and then when you hit a mid/high tone just discriminate ring pulls and if it still comes through then its got to be either a coin/ring or something you can forgive the sov for thinking it was something good..

Im yet to test thin rings.. Im thinking they may be in the ringpull range..


Also I dont think ring pulls give a solid number on the meter you guys with the 180 meter might not notice?
 
That's one heck of a nice ring! I'm over due for my next gold ring on land. Search this forum for a thread called something like "Splitting Hairs On Ring VDI Numbers". I posted some charts with statistical graphing of random square/round tabs and also a test pool of over 100 random unbiased ring samples. By setting the notch properly you can kill roughly 84% of all tabs and still dig well over 75% of all gold rings. On the beach this wouldn't be a good idea, but in a trashy park loaded with thousands of tabs it will improve your ring to trash ratio.
 
The Sovereigns actually have a wide notch range in that the band at a specific setting is wider than you think and if you factor in the affect it has on targets that are close above and below the notch setting you can miss more good targets than intended especially at depth so use it sparingly at older sites because both of my 2 1/2 dollar gold coins came in at pull tab and this ring which is my best so far came in at pull tab also.
 
dbsmokey ,
WAY TO GO !!.....I'm happy for ya ......I see that you had iron mask "OFF " ......DId it quiet things down for you a little bit in that highly mineralized soil that you deal with ? .......The notch on the Sovereign is a little too wide for me also ..... I too don't want to miss anything in any part of the Pull Tab range , so I won't use the notch ...... Critters testing is a test of percentages that are EXCELLENT and really do say a lot ......In one hand , I can understand his logic where you can cover more ground with the notch , and not be spending time digging Pull Tabs , but in the other hand , that pull tab tone might be a Platinum Ring of a lifetime .....Please don't ask me how I know .....Jim
 
The first diagram is from Minelab on the notch width of the Sovereigns. The second is the same diagram that I did that basically shows the effect the discrimination and notch can have on targets close to the notch and discrimination zone.
 
On my GT the notch width is 12.5 digits. It's no coincidence that it's that wide, because 84% of the most common pull tabs (both round and square) fall within that number range. I like to set mine at 152.5 to 165 and it will then kill 84%. Another 8% are from 149 to 151, and another 8% are from 166 to 169. If anything I'd like to see the notch a bit wider to cover this entire stretch from 149 to 169, but if anything I can easily pay attention to the few tabs that exist at a site outside 152.5 to 165 and not dig those common numbers. Interestingly enough, there are 4 or 5 numbers within the entire 149 to 169 span that none of the tabs showed up in. That's why they are noted in the ID Chart thread I made- I like to dig those odd numbers even when I'm not digging tabs hoping for a ring. Other numbers that can be quite interesting to dig are things like 170 or 171, 175, etc. I'm also big on any steady numbers in the 1-teens, 120's, 130's, and of course the 140's, but I'll not waste my time digging the 149 to 169 tab zone in a park that has millions of these. Pointless to even start doing that is the way I look at it, unless I very well plan to make it my life's effort to dig those. By avoiding those numbers you will greatly reduce the amount of trash you dig in terms of ratio to gold rings, and still recover well over 75% of the rings. Also remember that while you are digging each and every tab signal you come acrossed there somebody else might be only digging other numbers and beat you to most of the rings.

Again, as I've always said, not saying that digging any and all signals isn't the best and most thorough solution at the beach, at land sites that aren't loaded with tabs, or at land sites where you plan to spend all your free time for the next 20 years digging all those tabs out. I further refine this stategy by targeting high potential ring loss areas in these trashy parks (such as around wade pools or swings) and digging even the tab numbers in these high probability zones. I've got parks where when I've dug every tab signal I only walked about twenty feet in the course of about an hour's time. At that rate I'd have to be wheeled around in a wheel chair from my nursing home some day to continue to clear the rest of them out. Some guys avoid digging pennies or even dimes and quarters when beach hunting. To me that makes no sense since it's so easy to scoop with a long handle sand scoop and there are gold rings that can read that high. I feel it's much more logical to not dig tabs in high trash areas on land than to avoid any target above iron on the beach. Much more effective use of time.

In high trash land areas that are loaded with bits of foil and aluminum I'll increase discrimination to about 75 or so, since that's about as low as gold rings go. Even still, when it's real bad I'll raise it to just kill around a 95 trash target, and even running the notch and that I'm still getting most rings by the numbers. Another useful tactic when the area is a metal grave yard is to raise discrimination right to the bottom of the nickle zone, like say 139 or maybe 141 or so, then adjust the notch to where it's bottom is right at the top of the nickle zone, at like 147 or 149 or so. Now you are only going to hear nickles for the most part in really bad areas, along with any coins.

There are of course pros and cons to using or not using notch or discrimination. They are there to increase you treasure to trash ratio provided you read an area and use them specifically set to increase the odds in your favor. One thing that I've seen for sure is my nickle count goes through the roof when I've shut up the constant sound off of tabs and other nearby trash in terms of conductivity. It's too easy to pass over a nickle when you are in a maze of tabs and never realize you just passed one. Nickle sounds are pretty distinct on the Sovereign but when targets get real close to that it's not too hard to mistake one for the other.
 
I hate them also but if your using the meter you just don't dig the targets that ID in that range. Once you disc. out that range they are gone period and anything outside that range can be masked out. Also there are many times that people have gotten a signal that read in the tab range on the meter but just sounded different tone wise than the normal tab tone and many times these can end up being a gold ring. If they would have used notch they would not of even heard the tone difference.
 
Yes synthnut, turning iron mask off quieted things down nicely. Oddly, the numbers on my 180 meter bounce around at this park: I can't get a fixed reading. I wonder if something is wrong with the meter or mineralization is driving it crazy, or user error?
 
Yep Crazyman, that's a con to running the notch- not being able to hear the number and decide for yourself if it sounds different than the other "tabs" with the same number. On the other hand, the advantage to silencing them is you are more apt to notice any non-tab numbers and in particular nickles. Like I said, my nickle count goes way up when I'm hunting running the notch and in a ton of tabs. Some numbers are just so close in sound that had I not been running a notch I would have ignored some of these nickles thinking they were tabs. I don't usually look at the meter until I'm interested in a target by ear, so I'm more apt to check things out when running the notch and something sounds through.

Mainly my prefered method of "discrimination" when ring hunting is to not use any discrimination or notch, but rather to look for steady IDs and good audio on targets. If they change by more than a digit (maybe two) swept from different directions then chances are good it's not a ring but rather a piece of trash uniform in shape. Most of the rings we scanned would lock onto one or two numbers, MAYBE three in the odd instance but much more rarely. I'd say from memory out of all those rings we scanned only a few would give a "worbly" bad "up and down" type audio and a jumpy VDI that was changing by more than 2 or 3 digits (sometimes as high as 10 or 15) depending on which way you swept over them. These rings were ones with many holes in them caused by webbing or engraving of tiny bands like a lattice or something (words escape me, and I ain't no expert on ring styles). Mainly if they have say mutliple bands at the head or in some way a bunch of tiny spider web type holes in the metal then that's when they'd sound sick and change in ID a lot.

So long as the tabs aren't so bad that I'm losing my mind I won't run the notch or discrimination, and rather just go by how soft/round/smooth/warm the audio sounds and if the ID is staying at one, maybe two, and rarely three digits depending on how I sweep over it. Rings are a lot like nickles, or for that matter any coin...They won't change in ID much regardless of how you sweep over them. Think of how much a nickle normally changes in VDI #s as you change positions on it. Hardly any change if at all. It'll either stay one number or perhaps change by a digit or two, but for the most part is very solid. Same deal with other coins. Take pennies....They rarely change by three digits. Same deal with most rings, and for good reason....Coins and rings are round and for the most part uniform in shape. Trash that is shaped oddly or rough at the edges will tend to change more in numbers as you sweep over it. It also won't have as good/smooth of audio most of the time like a ring will. it'll sound harsh, tinny, hollow, bangy, or a few other ways....where as a gold ring will sound smooth, round, warm, soft, solid, etc.

We are very lucky to have such good audio and VDI ability on the Sovereign. It's not just the depth of this machine on coins and rings that puts it at the top of the mountain in terms of performance compared to other machines. It's not just the ability to handle the roughest of grounds that would send other brands running away whimpering. It's also the telling audio and VDI the Sovereign has. It's got the perfect VDI resolution IMO- not to high making it jumpy, and not too low making it unable to split hairs on things like tabs and rings. It's also got long drawn out audio that speaks in long sentences to you about a target it's seeing. I can't stand machines that just beep or use such processed audio that you lose much of the target's traits.

One other thing- My other favorite method of avoiding tabs and other similar trash while ring hunting and not using any discrimination or notch is to "time travel" back in time before they were invented. I figure out how deep tabs go at a site and then I'll dig anything deeper than that. It's easy enough to tell by sound just how deep a target is. Once I note that say round tabs (obviously older than square tabs) go for the most part no deeper than say 5.5" at a site then I'll dig anything that sounds 6" or deeper. If not too many tabs are at that 5.5" max depth then I'll even still dig stuff that shallow, but anything shallower than that I'll just pass by if it's got a tab ID that is common to that site.

Another handy trick is to not use discrimination or notch but to mentally note the common tab numbers that pop up at a site. If your memory isn't that good then carry a card you can scribble the numbers down on as you dig them. Once you find say that there are maybe 5 or 6 specific numbers that all the tabs are reading found at that site then dig everything else. Often there will be only 4, 5, maybe 7 or 8 types of tabs found at a site, and that includes both round and square tabs. Why is that? Because local bottle/can companies supply certain types to most of the stores in the area. You can really fine tune this to laser out those specific most common tab numbers and then dig everything else. Of course this doesn't work at all sites. Some of mine probably have 20 or 30 types of tabs, but remember that many of those will read the same as each other. Still, when the diversity of tab types gets that wide and there are just too many of them to the point of distraction that's when it's notch time for me. I'd rather want to hear everything else I plan to dig and silence everything I'm not going to even think about digging at sites like this. It greatly improves my concentration.
 
Super ring :clapping:

dbsmonkey said:
I found three dimes where I personally witnessed a man hunting with another brand of MD three weeks ago.

I think that's the most satisfying thing about the detector - rather than thinking that area's already been hunted so not worth doing the GT has the ability to make you wonder whether the other person actually switched on their detector. Sometimes I even see the footsteps in the sand of another person who had detected a few hours before and just can't resist following those footprints....

HH
 
Critter, I appreciate your research on this, I certainly see the logic in it and hear the criticism also. Since I don't have the 180 meter, and realizing there are individual differences in machines, could you give me a disc and notch position that corresponds to your numbers [how many dots up from the bottom zero position]? Thanks and good luck to all. James
 
notching in or out with Explorer/ Etrac

etrac
 
Yes, thanks Critter, I would like to know which index mark 90 VDI corresponds to. Also, I wonder if there is some common object [ex. a penny] that could be killed at the upper end and another common object at the lower end that could maybe be used to better set up the GT for this. Thanks for the advice. James
 
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