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Thanks a lot to the Stupid Lazy Moron who dug up Moran KS park with a shovel and left holes open this summer :ranting:
- Thread starter Ray-Mo.
- Start date
JimmyCT
Well-known member
I feel your pain Ray. This happened to me as well this year. I had a super nice, multi-acre, late 1800's carnival lot / currently used as a field for the school system and now it is all off limits thanks to a lazy moron as well. So sad - it is starting to make me loose interest in this wonderful hobby.
Youtube has a lot of hunters in parks using long handled shovels. I've seen some on this forum too. Not that they don't cover their holes. But it just looks bad and soon their parks will be closed too. FYI: Bill and I repaired several holes in a favorite spot last week that you and us hunt. We can't wait to see those guys again!
Larry (IL)
Well-known member
Very sad, it is happening at an alarming rate. What is even worse is most of the idiots don't even realize, or don't care, they are doing anything wrong.
I always dread, the day after Christmas when someone asked for a Metal Detector from Santa 
I always find hole in parks were I detect. The grass, if they brother to fill in there holes is jagged and looks like C&#@* I'll do the best I can to repair the area, then I go on a quest to find the culprits. If I drive up to an area and I see someone detecting, I'll watch him for awhile. If he is tearing up the area, him or her will get lessons in retrieving a target.
The sad thing is, they'll usually miss the target and move on I also find that most people who get a detector find out it's to much work! The detector will go in the closet, never to be used again 
I always find hole in parks were I detect. The grass, if they brother to fill in there holes is jagged and looks like C&#@* I'll do the best I can to repair the area, then I go on a quest to find the culprits. If I drive up to an area and I see someone detecting, I'll watch him for awhile. If he is tearing up the area, him or her will get lessons in retrieving a target. The sad thing is, they'll usually miss the target and move on
I also find that most people who get a detector find out it's to much work! The detector will go in the closet, never to be used again Ray, I know the sign says "no digging" as the presumed reason for the "no metal detectors". But do you know of instances of holes, LEADING to that sign? Here's why I ask: There's been ample stories of persons who go to city hall somewhere, believing they need to ask "can I metal detect?" And humorously, the following answer is often-times forthcoming from the dazed clerk: "Yes but you can't dig" Did you catch that? The questioner NEVER mentioned "holes" or "digging". So why then, did the answer come out this way from the desk-bound clerk? Because obviously it's the knee-jerk reaction to the obvious connotations that our hobby admittedly has. Right? And the clerk (or cop, or mayor, or gardener, or ranger, or whomever) may not necessarily have any such instances in his or her mind. It's just what they think of, when asked to put their "permission" on this.
And therefore, when such permission asking occurs, and city officials must address this, there has been cases where rules were actually implemented to address the "pressing issue". All the while "holes" may never have actually been the genesis behind it (at least not that would have caused a rule to be implemented). The genesis was the person asking, the whole time.
Not saying this is always the case, but ........ just saying that when some city person says "no because of holes", it does not always automatically follow that: "Ergo, someone must've left holes in the past"
And therefore, when such permission asking occurs, and city officials must address this, there has been cases where rules were actually implemented to address the "pressing issue". All the while "holes" may never have actually been the genesis behind it (at least not that would have caused a rule to be implemented). The genesis was the person asking, the whole time.
Not saying this is always the case, but ........ just saying that when some city person says "no because of holes", it does not always automatically follow that: "Ergo, someone must've left holes in the past"
Yes the holes were made by one or more persons detecting and well documented.One of the local police officers filled me in.He hates it as much as I because he and his grandfather can no longer detect either. It was probably newbies who were just lazy and ignorant of the error of their ways.....
I believe the majority of the public areas being closed for detecting is from holes either being left open or poorly repaired. Not in someone simply asking to hunt. Also I don't know why we keep seeing people in hunting vids still using long handled shovels in public parks and such? They still have to go to the ground to retrieve the target and repair the holes anyway.
I'd still go, and just tell them I cant read
Sorry, I usually default to humor in these types of situations...these laws are nonsense. I see people walking their dogs on the fields and parks with NO DOGS signs, and I find golf balls in fields that are clearly posted NO GOLFING. And you guys know we all find beer bottle tops in parks with clearly posted NO ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES ALLOWED signs. I would consider NO METAL DETECTING sign as a general recommendation not intended for responsible taxpayers!
Mud
Sorry, I usually default to humor in these types of situations...these laws are nonsense. I see people walking their dogs on the fields and parks with NO DOGS signs, and I find golf balls in fields that are clearly posted NO GOLFING. And you guys know we all find beer bottle tops in parks with clearly posted NO ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES ALLOWED signs. I would consider NO METAL DETECTING sign as a general recommendation not intended for responsible taxpayers! Mud
In parks in the county here in FL that just banned us I have pulled razor blades, fish hooks, nails, can slaw, broken glass, etc from the totlots there. Yet the head bureaucrat who did this sited safety concerns about holes left that a child could trip in. The rural parks have damage from feral hogs, armadillos, moles and other critters but we get banned? I find crack and pot baggies and condoms on the playgrounds and we get banned? We were fine with the local park managers, they even told us we were welcome. But a new by just had to decide to go to the top for permission and we got screwed.
Critterhunter
New member
Maybe he thought the sign said "Moron City Park" and thought that's what he's supposed to do there?
Sad to hear. I caught a guy leaving unfilled holes on a beach this year and I called him out for it and he stopped (that day anyway), but for now on before I say anything I'm going to catch them on film from a distance and then walk up with the camera rolling and ask if they'd like to state their name as they are about to become a you tube sensation.
With the advent of video ability with cell phones we need to start shaming these guys into shaping up before it's too late. If you catch them on film leaving holes unfilled or using shovels I bet that will shame many of them into being more ethical. Then maybe they'll think twice next time they are hunting because they won't know who might be lurking nearby filming their actions. Nobody likes to be caught on film doing something stupid.
But please, if anybody does this think of your safety first. People get killed over far less, so don't confront anybody you feel might be packing some heat or something.
Sad to hear. I caught a guy leaving unfilled holes on a beach this year and I called him out for it and he stopped (that day anyway), but for now on before I say anything I'm going to catch them on film from a distance and then walk up with the camera rolling and ask if they'd like to state their name as they are about to become a you tube sensation.
With the advent of video ability with cell phones we need to start shaming these guys into shaping up before it's too late. If you catch them on film leaving holes unfilled or using shovels I bet that will shame many of them into being more ethical. Then maybe they'll think twice next time they are hunting because they won't know who might be lurking nearby filming their actions. Nobody likes to be caught on film doing something stupid.
But please, if anybody does this think of your safety first. People get killed over far less, so don't confront anybody you feel might be packing some heat or something.
Unfortunately, those who disregard the signs and are caught detecting do just as much harm to our cause as those whose behavior led to the bans in the first place.
Yes, there is merit to the adage "it is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission" but IMHO that expression should not apply to our hobby. Why? because there is a moral high ground perceived by persons who pushed for and got the bans, and once detecting is "outlawed' and the sign goes up, there mere existence of the ban makes the hunter an outlaw, period. Lawn police. Do-goodas. Nosy busybodies. You name the group. They see no distinction, and do not care to, between you with your CTX and a Lesche and the mope with the divining rod and a snow shovel and a pick axe prowling the tot lot. All they see is their sign, and a guy with a detector. "Quick, Honey, call 911! All the problems we have,unemployment, crime, littering, trespassing, teen pregnancy, and drug abuse are all HIS fault!"
My feeling is anyone taking time to read and post on forums is probably not the culprit. I have yet to see that sort of behavior exhibited here on thise forum. The problem lies elsewhere.
The key is to isolate the bad apples before they isolate us by default. We will never win the hearts of those ignorant low-information types reacting to the shovel mopes. We need to keep up the self-policing and take every opportunity to educate the public that we law-abiding detectorists are not destroying the planet any more than any of the other activities mentioned earlier in this thread do.
Every rule has exceptions. IMHO it makes more sense to ask the cop, ranger, sheriff or park police for permission, the sign notwithstanding. Go for it. Ask. From experience I can say that the officers I have asked, even if they say no, are quite reasonable once they understand how we do what we do. Sometimes they do say yes as long as the permission isnt abused and we aren't packing shovels.
Thanks for listening.
Yes, there is merit to the adage "it is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission" but IMHO that expression should not apply to our hobby. Why? because there is a moral high ground perceived by persons who pushed for and got the bans, and once detecting is "outlawed' and the sign goes up, there mere existence of the ban makes the hunter an outlaw, period. Lawn police. Do-goodas. Nosy busybodies. You name the group. They see no distinction, and do not care to, between you with your CTX and a Lesche and the mope with the divining rod and a snow shovel and a pick axe prowling the tot lot. All they see is their sign, and a guy with a detector. "Quick, Honey, call 911! All the problems we have,unemployment, crime, littering, trespassing, teen pregnancy, and drug abuse are all HIS fault!"
My feeling is anyone taking time to read and post on forums is probably not the culprit. I have yet to see that sort of behavior exhibited here on thise forum. The problem lies elsewhere.
The key is to isolate the bad apples before they isolate us by default. We will never win the hearts of those ignorant low-information types reacting to the shovel mopes. We need to keep up the self-policing and take every opportunity to educate the public that we law-abiding detectorists are not destroying the planet any more than any of the other activities mentioned earlier in this thread do.
Every rule has exceptions. IMHO it makes more sense to ask the cop, ranger, sheriff or park police for permission, the sign notwithstanding. Go for it. Ask. From experience I can say that the officers I have asked, even if they say no, are quite reasonable once they understand how we do what we do. Sometimes they do say yes as long as the permission isnt abused and we aren't packing shovels.
Thanks for listening.
bik-il said:
bik-il, what's wrong with looking any potential muni-codes for oneself, and ..... if there is nothing that says "no detecting", then there's your answer ?
Because if, as you admit, you might get a "no" to your permission asking (where perhaps there is not really a rule or law saying such a thing), that now you've done nothing more than: Preclude yourself from a place that perhaps no one would ever have cared less ?? There's been a lot of places where no one ever had a problem UNTIL someone went and asked. So I'm having problems understanding why asking permission (where there's no prohibitions to begin with) is a good thing?
Let me clarify-
I agree. Where there are no visible signs prohibiting detecting.
I meant what i said about getting permission in the context of locations that have signs and rules prohibiting detecting.
Asking permission from authorities in charge of enforcement doesnt hurt, bans and signs notwithstanding.
If an official gives you the green light you're covered.
Its similar to the well-established rule of law concerning traffic law enforcement. In most jurisdictions the statutes set forth the elements of the offense but go on to say "unless otherwise directed by a law enforcement officer."
So yes, I ran the red light. But a cop directing traffic waved me through. An affirmative defense.
thanks,
Bik
I agree. Where there are no visible signs prohibiting detecting.
I meant what i said about getting permission in the context of locations that have signs and rules prohibiting detecting.
Asking permission from authorities in charge of enforcement doesnt hurt, bans and signs notwithstanding.
If an official gives you the green light you're covered.
Its similar to the well-established rule of law concerning traffic law enforcement. In most jurisdictions the statutes set forth the elements of the offense but go on to say "unless otherwise directed by a law enforcement officer."
So yes, I ran the red light. But a cop directing traffic waved me through. An affirmative defense.
thanks,
Bik
I dont know boys...I bet we all are getting tired of the new rules invading every outdoor sport, from fishing to hunting and so on...I'm sure we all leave no trace, for thats just how we were brought up, with a general respect for everything. Who'da thought there would come a time when a Free Man cant dig a hole in the earth on public lands? As far as us being the ethical Keepers of the Flame, I dont know how that heavy mantle got bestowed on us in the first place, and from what I can tell, its not working out too well for us anyway. I dont remember taking any oath or signing a pledge when I got into this...hell, I just want to find some metal and be left alone! The best thing is to hunt when, where, and how ever you want and just not let anyone see you do it. This is a big planet, and the coils are sooo small, and time is really short, ...As the old guy in the boat with a lit stick of dynamite said to the gamewarden, "Are you gonna talk, or fish?"
Mud
Mud
