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Understanding Some of the Magic of the V3's Analysis Screen

Thanks Larry! Since it's kind of the off season, I spend a lot of time at the county archive museum pouring over old maps, some dating back to the early 1700's, looking for prospective sights to hunt. I know most of the folks in the county (small county ~52,000 people) so I already know most of the folks with the land. The only draw back is that the maps are not exceptionally accurate and don't include any GPS data.:) But the lay of the land hasn't changed much and most of the places to hunt are/were always located around a body of water or steam bed of some sort. That does make it a bit easier to use those as a reference point on the old maps.

Thanks for the fine welcome!

Regards,

Robby
 
I have just read Manly P Halls- Secret teaching of all ages - and it was nearly 1000 pages so Im ready for Your V3 book.

It has been said over and over again that more then 50% of the good targets remain in the ground due to different kind of masking effects. The silent masking being the worst i guess.

Now I wonder, How many bigger silver targets remain due to wrap effect?
 
I understand that it takes time and I am waiting. I appreciate the tip. I won't chanve anything I do but it does help me understand the V3 a little better.

Julien
 
Jeff Foster said:
(OMISSIS)
And, finally, the grand finale that you've all been waiting for. What would you expect to see on the Analysis Screen in Three Frequency Salt Mode???

To be continued...

Enjoy.

P.S. Yes, I'm working on a V3 book, and it's still a long way off.
Click to expand...

Dear Jeff,
First of all I beg you pardon for my poor english. I'm writing you from Italy and I'm one of your biggest fan in my country.
I'm not an engineer and neither a physicist, so please forgive if my words are not so technically correct. I'm a happy DFX owner and even if I've never touched a V3 in my life, I'm trying to study as more as I can about this wonderful machine.

To go straight to the point and imagining what could happen in Salt Compensate mode (using my imagination and from a theoretical point of view), I suppose the V3 will show a general effective loss of sensitivity in the 0-+2 VDI area and beside that point (both in the positive and the negative sides). This is due to White's Signal Subtraction Technique used to compensate marine salt mineralization. What will affect this? Well I suppose it will knock down V3's efficency on small gold items due to VDI being quite close to 0/+2 point. Of course 22.5KHz and 7.5KHz graphs should be less effected than 2.5KHz one due to the natural Up-Shift of gold target's VDI (exspecially thin jewelry) you have by using higher frequencies.

Am I so wrong?

Happy FosterForPresident Hunting!
Bodhi3
 
Jeff I have a question. What information in your post wouldn't show on the spectragraph? Rob
 
Bodhi3 said:
To go straight to the point and imagining what could happen in Salt Compensate mode (using my imagination and from a theoretical point of view), I suppose the V3 will show a general effective loss of sensitivity in the 0-+2 VDI area and beside that point (both in the positive and the negative sides).
Click to expand...
That's correct with regard to target sensitivity. This is why targets that have VDI numbers close to that of salt (0 to +2 region and slightly beyond), like small gold, small gold chains, etc., do not respond in Salt Mode.

Bodhi3 said:
This is due to White's Signal Subtraction Technique used to compensate marine salt mineralization.
Click to expand...
I'm getting ahead of myself here, but the Signal Subtraction Technique handles the ferrous portion of the ground-balance. The V3's analysis screens provide a view into the effects of this. I will try to cover this in a simplified fashion in my next thread on this topic. I originally thought I would be able to write that in a few days, but I'm very busy and it will be longer than I expected before that is completed.

Bodhi3 said:
Of course 22.5KHz and 7.5KHz graphs should be less effected than 2.5KHz one due to the natural Up-Shift of gold target's VDI (exspecially thin jewelry) you have by using higher frequencies.
Click to expand...
That is also correct.

The initial motivation in writing the parent post was to illustrate how 2.5kHz may not necessarily provide the best high-VDI response in the Analysis Screens. This was illustrated in this thread and will be more apparent in Salt mode. Without this information on how detectors operate, it is more difficult to interpret these screens and raises questions as to why 22.5kHz will in many cases show better responses to high-VDI targets than one might expect.

Ciao.
 
Dear Jeff,

I beg you pardon about the Signal Subtraction Tech mistake relating it to salt elimination.
The guy who explained me that obviously made me a bad joke... Very Happy

I've done some research here on DFX and in one of your old posts (2005) about DFX and Dual Freqs operations you've told us:
"When the DFX is used in dual frequency mode, it responds to targets, at the all-metal level, based on the difference in the target
 
Thats how I understand it, if the VDI numbers are different then the signals are combined and passed to the discrim circuit, if the numbers are the same the the signal is ignored. I beleive there is some "tweaking" done of the negative VDI numbers to get them to line up exactly. Also the ground balance is set out of the way or restricted to only a few numbers in the dual fequency mode.
 
Thank You Jeff, really an informative post. Your explanation filled in some major gaps for me, Just another 100 miles to go...
 
asking what we think about a digital display on the analog Xl-Pro.

The more i look at Mr Fosters " wheel of VDI scale" the more i like it as a display information center.

Two digital arrows, one at the set GB and one at the Target hits.

There is room for two bars at the sides probably, maybe depth and battery power.

Im sorry, i know it didnt belong here but....
 
Jeff,

Just like everyone else here, I really appreciate your time and effort. It's been a great help with a very convoluted topic. V3's certainly rock...
 
Thanks Jeff. That is some truly useful info. Can't wait for the book.

The saying "that 2.5 is better for silver", although found to be true for some ground conditions (as you have demonstrated), is poorly understood although often stated possibly due to another reason. Longer wavelengths of electromagnetic radiation (radio waves in our case) interact less with matter than shorter wavelengths. Astronomers use visible light (short wavelength) for objects within line of sight, but have to rely on radio waves to peer through dust clouds and the innards of galaxies. This means that longer wavelengths travel farther through matter (more depth). The depth difference between 2.5 and 22.5 is probably barely even measureable, but the "longer wavelength = more depth" rationale may contribute to the association of 2.5 and silver since silver is most often at depth.

Beep
 
Has anyone heard of this before, or am I a fry short of a happy meal?

According to physics...

longer wavelengths = less interaction with matter + less resolution
shorter wavelengths = higher energy/more interaction with matter + greater resolution

Visible light images are sharp and clear, radio images are indistinct and lack detail.

How significantly this impacts our little range of wavelengths is, as stated, probably negligible, but it makes theoretical sense.

On the other hand, GPR uses various frequencies (some high I believe) and gets 20+ feet depth...I think I need to read some stuff on wave mechanics, propagation, absorption and electro-magnetic theory...maybe Jeff or one of his White's contacts can provide or point to some info on the significance of wavelength (in regards to depth), if any.


wavelength = speed of light / frequency
energy = planck constant x frequency

For 2.5KHz, wavelength = 1.1992e+5 meters (energy of 1.0339e-11 electron volts)
For 22.5KHz, wavelength = 1.3324e+4 meters (9.3052e-11 electron volts)

This shows that 2.5KHz has a wavelength an order of magnitude less than 22.5KHz.
It also shows that a 22.5KHz photon has 9 times the energy of a 2.5KHz photon.

hmmmm
 
The Beep Goes On said:
Has anyone heard of this before, or am I a fry short of a happy meal?

According to physics...

longer wavelengths = less interaction with matter + less resolution
shorter wavelengths = higher energy/more interaction with matter + greater resolution

Visible light images are sharp and clear, radio images are indistinct and lack detail.

How significantly this impacts our little range of wavelengths is, as stated, probably negligible, but it makes theoretical sense.

On the other hand, GPR uses various frequencies (some high I believe) and gets 20+ feet depth...I think I need to read some stuff on wave mechanics, propagation, absorption and electro-magnetic theory...maybe Jeff or one of his White's contacts can provide or point to some info on the significance of wavelength (in regards to depth), if any.


wavelength = speed of light / frequency
energy = planck constant x frequency

For 2.5KHz, wavelength = 1.1992e+5 meters (energy of 1.0339e-11 electron volts)
For 22.5KHz, wavelength = 1.3324e+4 meters (9.3052e-11 electron volts)

This shows that 2.5KHz has a wavelength an order of magnitude less than 22.5KHz.
It also shows that a 22.5KHz photon has 9 times the energy of a 2.5KHz photon.

hmmmm
Click to expand...

Whoaaaaaaa!
fractal.gif
 
:rofl:...I think that is exactly how the insides of the V works......:laugh:
 
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